Shopsmith Forums

Chuck, I am a bit confused. Are you saying that there is never any down pressure on either table? Or are you saying that the down pressure is very minor compared to the push/ pull across the blades? I have not tried this for a while, and I am not very good at it, but it seems to me that if I don't push down some on the out-feed side, I rock back on the in-feed side. When I started to practice this way, I was able to get better results. I'm not arguing with anything said, I am trying to learn something.

More than one 'objective'.

Charlese is concerned with the squareness between the face(against the fence) and the edge(against the table).

When seeking that squareness it becomes more important to maintain solid fence contact so as to not cause the edge to not be square with the face. A very small deviation from the fence creates a large error on the edge cut.

The earlier statements regarding keeping the light pressure on the outfeed table(just enough to maintain solid contact) are just as true.

For a square, straight edge/face result both reference surfaces must be solidly contacted.

We have been concentrating on the edge cut since tapering was the original 'issue'.

Straight edges do not magically happen by just passing the workpiece through the jointer. The workpiece must be examined so as to determine how to proceed. If the center is bowed upward, material must be removed from both ends first before attempting a full length pass. If the workpiece is bowed downward, material must be removed from the center before attempting a full pass.

When desiring a square face/edge, that preliminary work must be done on both the face and the edge.

Now if the workpiece has wind,(twisted), the prep work becomes much more difficult.

dlbristol wrote:Chuck, I am a bit confused. Are you saying that there is never any down pressure on either table? Or are you saying that the down pressure is very minor compared to the push/ pull across the blades? I have not tried this for a while, and I am not very good at it, but it seems to me that if I don't push down some on the out-feed side, I rock back on the in-feed side. When I started to practice this way, I was able to get better results. I'm not arguing with anything said, I am trying to learn something.

OKAY, no downward pressure on the outfeed table. Just keep the material against the fence and the surface being jointed in contact at all times with the outfeed table surface. No pressure just constant contact.

Thin cuts (about 1/16" or less) allows this to be done with virtually no pressure being applied except that required to move the piece across the cutter head.

Remember, the outfeed table surface is the "reference surface" for this task. Stay in contact with the reference surface.

Keep your fingers away from that cutter. Push blocks and push sticks should always be available and should be used especially when jointing smaller pieces.

That puppy has three sharp, fast moving teeth and it bites without hesitation.

Thanks Dusty, I have an open week end in the football season in a couple of weeks, I will go back into the shop and practice some more. I can make a nice bag of pine shavings for the rabbits, and learn to use the jointer.

charlese wrote:There being a couple of posts here that recommend downward hand pressure - I must stick with what I said earlier. Using the "Push/Pull" method of jointing, the hands pushing across the infeed table also has the responsibility to keep the board up against the fence and lift any teetering weight off of the board so it glides with its own weight across the infeed table. Likewise the pulling hand(s) have a responsibility to pull the board while keeping it flush with the fence. If the board would teeter, it is better to lift some weight off the board rather than to press downward on the table. Solid fence contact assures no taper.

Not only does this method work very well, but is much safer than downward pushing.

With all due respect I believe there should be little or no downward pressure on the infeed table but on the outfeed the board should be jointed and flattened and downward pressure applied to insure the board does not vibrate and cause ripples.

Problems occur when operators try to apply downward pressure on the infeed table. Since the board has been jointed yet it is possible to pust out any twist that would be jointed off with no downward pressure.

I was taught never to press down anywhere from the blades back on the infeed side and to press down only after the blades and the rest on the out feed table. So far my jointing efforts had produced my expected results.
So I will keep my method.

Ed in Tampa wrote:With all due respect I believe there should be little or no downward pressure on the infeed table but on the outfeed the board should be jointed and flattened and downward pressure applied to insure the board does not vibrate and cause ripples.

Problems occur when operators try to apply downward pressure on the infeed table. Since the board has been jointed yet it is possible to pust out any twist that would be jointed off with no downward pressure.

I was taught never to press down anywhere from the blades back on the infeed side and to press down only after the blades and the rest on the out feed table. So far my jointing efforts had produced my expected results.
So I will keep my method.

Good advice! I would alter that to include some registration to the infeed table at the start(until firmly resting on the outfeed table and mind the fence registration if squaring to that face is desired

dlbristol wrote:Chuck, I am a bit confused. Are you saying that there is never any down pressure on either table? Or are you saying that the down pressure is very minor compared to the push/ pull across the blades? I have not tried this for a while, and I am not very good at it, but it seems to me that if I don't push down some on the out-feed side, I rock back on the in-feed side. When I started to practice this way, I was able to get better results. I'm not arguing with anything said, I am trying to learn something.

I am saying, as you put it, "the down pressure is very minor compared to the push/ pull across the blades". Posts 33 and 35 have pointed out that contact with the outfeed table is most important. I wish I said that earlier, but now I can agree wholeheartedly.

I guess some have found it more workable to exert downward pressure. I have learned to let the workpiece slide across the outfeed table under it's own weight while making sure contact is firm with the fence and table. I've never had an issue with ripple marks on the jointed edge because of lack of downward weight. Maybe this would happen with dull cutters.

I have found this thread to be quite thought provoking as well as instructive.

One thing that should be obvious is that many things can mess up the operation(both machine setup and technique).

Although it is a very simple machine. its proper setup and operation are paramount to being used successfully.

I believe there are many misguided efforts to 'help' folks misuse it.

I found the link from Algale to be very concise and accurate information(including the entire set therein) and recommend them to all!!!!!

I repeat it here for convenience, but it is backed up to the top(basics) - http://www.newwoodworker.com/basic/usejntr.html

Further links are near the bottom left of the page.

"When cutting stock to width, you first establish a smooth, square work edge by making a jointing cut on one edge of the stock. This edge is placed against the fence during the rip cut on the saw. The rip cut is made oversize to allow for stock removal when making the second jointing cut." So says R.J. DeCristoforo in "Power Tool Woodworking for Everyone."

I did a lot more investigating and found the problem. The answer to my original question seems to be:

You have probably set your jointer knives a little too low. Try raising them by about 0.005" and see if that helps.

My jointer knives were set to between 0.000" and 0.002" above the outfeed table. I reset them to be 0.005" above the outfeed and the tapering problem went away.

Thanks again to all for the helpful posts. They inspired me to figure this out.