Greenie rebuild issues

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ssmall
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Greenie rebuild issues

Post by ssmall »

Hello,
I'm in the middle of repairing an old "greenie" Shopsmith, and I'm having difficulty matching up and old machine with new parts.

My current issue is matching up the Drive Sleeve and Sheave to run a Gilmer belt.
The new Drive Sleeve came with a Poly belt drive.


My delimia depends on if I can remove the Gilmer drive from the old Drive Sleeve and install it on the new Drive Sleeve. If this is not possible, I guess my only option is to purchase a new Sheave with a Poly belt drive and a new Poly belt.

If I can interchange the belt drives from the old Drive Sleeve to the new Drive Sleeve, I'm good to go. If not, UGH!!!! :mad: I need to order more parts.

Thank you for you assistance in advance!
Shawn
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ssmall
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by ssmall »

Upon futher investigation comparing the Drive Sleeves, I found the old Drive Sleeve has a set screw securring a collar that is used as a stop for the Gilmer drive on the Drive Shaft.

The new Drive Sleeve does not have a set screw, and I did'nt want to disassemble it to find it wont work with the Gilmer drive.

I guess I'll have to replace the Idler Sheave assembly with a new unit and a Poly belt.
Hopefully this will be the last issue I have prior to assembling the Greenie. :rolleyes:
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chapmanruss
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by chapmanruss »

As you have now found out the later Gilmer Drive Sleeves have a clutch. The Poly V Drive does not need a clutch since the belt can slip and provide that function. Now that you have the Gilmer Drive Sleeve apart you should know it is very difficult to get it back together with the proper clutch slippage. Since you have most of the parts anyway, as shown in your first picture, going to the Poly V Drive may be best. You will need the Poly V Drive Sheave on the Idler Shaft to complete the change-over. Because they are different Drive Sleeve systems, clutch vs. non-clutch, parts are not interchangeable.

The original Gilmer Drive Sleeves did not have a clutch and could easily break belts. The clutch was added in the first changes to the Mark 5 headstock in 1954.
Russ

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JPG
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by JPG »

Nothing has been said(yet) re the quill incompatibility. Old quill needs old drive sleeve.(and vice versa), Since it appears you have a newer quill, the only parts you now need to complete an entire gilmer to poly-v conversion is the idler sheave and a poly-v belt.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
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rpd
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by rpd »

chapmanruss wrote:As you have now found out the later Gilmer Drive Sleeves have a clutch. The Poly V Drive does not need a clutch since the belt can slip and provide that function. Now that you have the Gilmer Drive Sleeve apart you should know it is very difficult to get it back together with the proper clutch slippage. Since you have most of the parts anyway, as shown in your first picture, going to the Poly V Drive may be best. You will need the Poly V Drive Sheave on the Idler Shaft to complete the change-over. Because they are different Drive Sleeve systems, clutch vs. non-clutch, parts are not interchangeable.

The original Gilmer Drive Sleeves did not have a clutch and could easily break belts. The clutch was added in the first changes to the Mark 5 headstock in 1954.
I must have gotten lucky. When I rebuilt my Gilmer drive I lightly sanded all the clutch plates to remove rust (metal plates), and clean up the friction plates. When I put it back together I somehow missed one out of the pack, but it still tested within specs, so I didn't bother to take it apart again. Getting it together wasn't that difficult using the bearing puller.
Ron Dyck
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ssmall
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by ssmall »

Thank you all for your input, I sure appreiciate it! :)

I ordered a P/N: 515556-0001 Control Sheave "assembly" form Shopsmith. I was dissapointed when it arrived and did not include the drive shaft, Poly belt gear and the oposing Sheave. :confused:



Now I'm really confused as to what other parts I need for the conversion.
I guess I'll need all the parts for the entire Control Sheave. This would include item numbers: 304,303,104,103,103A,105,106,107,108,109, already have a new 110,112, and I assume the 111 is attached to the P/N: 515556-0001 (Control Sheave "assy").
(I've attached the MV parts diagram for reference) :confused:
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ssmall
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by ssmall »

I guess if I were to slow down and actually read the parts descriptions, I would find that P/N: 504177 (Idler Shaft assy.) includes parts 105-113. :o

That said, I can only assume I still need the remaining parts. :confused:

Hopefully when I order these parts: 222458 (set screw), 515616 (Eccentric Bushing assy.), 504177 (Idler Shaft assy.) I will than actually have the required parts to complete the conversion. :)
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JPG
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by JPG »

You need "Item: 5041809 (Reference #109)" Idler sheave.

All the other parts in the 'assembly' are the same as what you have originally. They have not changed(this version) since day uno.

You already have the quill and drive sleeve parts.(IIRC)

PS, you may need advice re removing 107.

And let us not fergit the poly-v belt.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
ssmall
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by ssmall »

Gee I feel stupid... :o I over tightned the bolt securring the Eccentric Bushing and broke one side of the cast Eccentric Bushing retainer.

Needless to say I'm shopping for a Headset Case. Does anyone know if other models have compatable Headset Cases?

I found a Headset Case that appears everything is the same visually, other than an extra hole around the speed control drive belt.

Thank you in advance!
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JPG
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Re: Greenie rebuild issues

Post by JPG »

ANY headstock casting will accept ANY set of internal parts EXCEPT the power switch and rear medallion and external tinnerman clips. However the early belt covers have more screws/holes which the later castings have no place to put them.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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