Table Line Up

Forum for Maintenance and Repair topics. Feel free to ask questions or contribute.

Moderators: HopefulSSer, admin

BigSky
Gold Member
Posts: 479
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:16 am
Location: MT

Table Line Up

Post by BigSky »

If the saw blade is parallel to the miter track is the table considered lined up.
User avatar
edflorence
Platinum Member
Posts: 621
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 8:14 pm
Location: Idaho Panhandle

Re: Table Line Up

Post by edflorence »

Basically, yes. But, there has been much electronic ink spilled on this forum discussing just how parallel is parallel and how best to determine it.
Ed
Idaho Panhandle
Mark 5 of various vintages, Mini with reversing motor, bs, dc3300, jointer, increaser, decreaser
User avatar
dusty
Platinum Member
Posts: 21359
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona

Re: Table Line Up

Post by dusty »

edflorence wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:16 pm Basically, yes. But, there has been much electronic ink spilled on this forum discussing just how parallel is parallel and how best to determine it.

Yes there has been but is there now a consensus?

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/parallel
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Hobbyman2
Platinum Member
Posts: 2660
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:52 am
Location: Ohio

Re: Table Line Up

Post by Hobbyman2 »

Don't toss out the fence alignment if you are using one , a improper alignment can cause pinching and burning . a properly aligned fence should allow a cut to be made with minimal effort .
Hobbyman2 Favorite Quote: "If a man does his best, what else is there?"
- General George S. Patton (1885-1945)
User avatar
dusty
Platinum Member
Posts: 21359
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona

Re: Table Line Up

Post by dusty »

Hobbyman2 makes a good point but there are other factors too.

What is a complete SS Alignment?

Table (miter track) to Blade
Rip Fence
Miter Gauge
Drill Bit to Table Top
Table Top Flatness

note: don't over look drive shaft and arbor run out ???
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
DLB
Platinum Member
Posts: 1984
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2019 11:24 am
Location: Joshua Texas

Re: Table Line Up

Post by DLB »

dusty wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 4:05 am Yes there has been but is there now a consensus?
I don't see how there could be consensus. The accuracy needed depends on the work being performed. The procedure in the manual (there are many variations) doesn't quantify the error and is clearly close enough for a lot of work. I doubt that it reliably produces results better than 8 or ten thou over a distance of 8". Which is not good enough for many of us as individuals or for the work we're doing. Taking us down a path with variations in technique and the equipment we're using.

- David
User avatar
dusty
Platinum Member
Posts: 21359
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona

Re: Table Line Up

Post by dusty »

DLB wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 8:31 am
dusty wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 4:05 am Yes there has been but is there now a consensus?
I don't see how there could be consensus. The accuracy needed depends on the work being performed. The procedure in the manual (there are many variations) doesn't quantify the error and is clearly close enough for a lot of work. I doubt that it reliably produces results better than 8 or ten thou over a distance of 8". Which is not good enough for many of us as individuals or for the work we're doing. Taking us down a path with variations in technique and the equipment we're using.

- David
Yes, I suppose you are right. There can be no consensus - for a variety of reasons.

If asked, over the years (especially the last few), my answer would have been a constant contradiction. Today I am inclined to say that I hardly ever strive for precision better than 1/32" (.03125"). Why? Because I no longer see well enough to shot for 1/64" (.01563"). I might even concede that the Shopsmith can not hold tolerances any tighter than that.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
DLB
Platinum Member
Posts: 1984
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2019 11:24 am
Location: Joshua Texas

Re: Table Line Up

Post by DLB »

dusty wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 10:23 am If asked, over the years (especially the last few), my answer would have been a constant contradiction. Today I am inclined to say that I hardly ever strive for precision better than 1/32" (.03125"). Why? Because I no longer see well enough to shot for 1/64" (.01563"). I might even concede that the Shopsmith can not hold tolerances any tighter than that.
In the interest of safety I think we should be clear about these precision numbers. I infer that you're referring to accuracy of a cut, as in +/- 1/32" in the length or width of a board. Not an angle representing deviation from parallel, like 1/32" over 8" between blade plane of rotation and miter tracks. That, to me, would be a very large and potentially unsafe error.

Nick had some fuzzy math, Sawdust Session 1 IIRC, determining maximum error from parallel for a 'typical' blade. I'm reluctant to repeat here, too much deviation from typical. But, the message remains good. You do not want the deviation from parallel to be large enough that the work contacts the body of the blade. At best, this causes binding and burning and at worst a kickback. Smaller errors cause the system to work harder to create a wider than intended kerf, and can result in angle errors in some setups.

- David
User avatar
dusty
Platinum Member
Posts: 21359
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona

Re: Table Line Up

Post by dusty »

DLB wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 11:51 am
dusty wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 10:23 am If asked, over the years (especially the last few), my answer would have been a constant contradiction. Today I am inclined to say that I hardly ever strive for precision better than 1/32" (.03125"). Why? Because I no longer see well enough to shot for 1/64" (.01563"). I might even concede that the Shopsmith can not hold tolerances any tighter than that.
In the interest of safety I think we should be clear about these precision numbers. I infer that you're referring to accuracy of a cut, as in +/- 1/32" in the length or width of a board. Not an angle representing deviation from parallel, like 1/32" over 8" between blade plane of rotation and miter tracks. That, to me, would be a very large and potentially unsafe error.

Nick had some fuzzy math, Sawdust Session 1 IIRC, determining maximum error from parallel for a 'typical' blade. I'm reluctant to repeat here, too much deviation from typical. But, the message remains good. You do not want the deviation from parallel to be large enough that the work contacts the body of the blade. At best, this causes binding and burning and at worst a kickback. Smaller errors cause the system to work harder to create a wider than intended kerf, and can result in angle errors in some setups.

- David
The numbers that I stated thus far in were intended to quantify characteristics of a cut piece of wood and have nothing to do with blade to table alignments. If I rip something 6" wide I want it to be 6" within the tolerances so stated. Very good points you make.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
User avatar
dusty
Platinum Member
Posts: 21359
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona

Re: Table Line Up

Post by dusty »

My Table to Blade Alignment

is done this way with all four trunnion bolts loose to allow the table to be repositioned under control of the two Adjustable Stop Collars.

"Equal radings" on dial indicators indicate parallelism of a miter track to the alignment plate (saw blade). I do this only when table to blade alignment is in doubt (which is seldom).

NOT BETTER just EASIER and LESS TIME CONSUMING
Attachments
A pair of Shopsmith  Adjustable Stop Collars mounted on Extension Table Legs replaced by Double Tilt modification.
A pair of Shopsmith Adjustable Stop Collars mounted on Extension Table Legs replaced by Double Tilt modification.
20210501_092735.jpg (432.23 KiB) Viewed 1686 times
A pair of SuperBar Alignment Gauges and an Infinity Alignment Disk.
A pair of SuperBar Alignment Gauges and an Infinity Alignment Disk.
20210501_092747.jpg (417.13 KiB) Viewed 1686 times
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Post Reply