Anyone here purchased one of these?
I have one of the older models that is a stand alone type that I really like but then shopsmith had a lot more ideas and information our about that model... this one I see in catalogs and on the web page but it seems they are not really "pushing" the product. Anyone want to comment on the machine or what you think of how it is being sold????
Ed
New Overarm Pin Router
Moderators: HopefulSSer, admin
...it seems they are not really "pushing" the product.
I have to agree, Ed. In my opinion, not only are we not pushing the product, the marketing copy in the catalogue doesn't even begin to tell what this sucker can do. In the vertical position, it does everything the world's-best-and-most-expensive router tables do, only lots better. Easier, safer, more efficient, more accurate. And it does stuff that router tables don't do, pin routing being only one example.
And if you buy the overarm router that attaches to your Shopsmith, you can also rout with it in the horizontal position. It's the JointMaker, back from the dead -- but with a better table and some cool new capabilties! The fact of the matter is that if you compare a router table -- any router table -- to the Overarm Router mounted on the Shopsmith...Well, there is no comparison. It's like comparing an apple to an entire grove of oranges.
I'm not just spouting the company line, guys. Those of you who have taken my classes know that I'm straight up about tools and I don't push stuff you won't use. But in this case, I don't think the company knows what they've got. In fact, I don't think the inventor of the Overarm Router, Norm Bryden (God rest his soul), knew what he had. Come take our Routing & Shaping and our Advanced Routing courses at the Academy. I'll put my router where my mouth is. (How's that for a straight line? Somebody pick up on it, please!)
With all good wishes,
I have to agree, Ed. In my opinion, not only are we not pushing the product, the marketing copy in the catalogue doesn't even begin to tell what this sucker can do. In the vertical position, it does everything the world's-best-and-most-expensive router tables do, only lots better. Easier, safer, more efficient, more accurate. And it does stuff that router tables don't do, pin routing being only one example.
And if you buy the overarm router that attaches to your Shopsmith, you can also rout with it in the horizontal position. It's the JointMaker, back from the dead -- but with a better table and some cool new capabilties! The fact of the matter is that if you compare a router table -- any router table -- to the Overarm Router mounted on the Shopsmith...Well, there is no comparison. It's like comparing an apple to an entire grove of oranges.
I'm not just spouting the company line, guys. Those of you who have taken my classes know that I'm straight up about tools and I don't push stuff you won't use. But in this case, I don't think the company knows what they've got. In fact, I don't think the inventor of the Overarm Router, Norm Bryden (God rest his soul), knew what he had. Come take our Routing & Shaping and our Advanced Routing courses at the Academy. I'll put my router where my mouth is. (How's that for a straight line? Somebody pick up on it, please!)
With all good wishes,
Nick Engler
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
Hello again,
I can see my the lack of posts here that either no one is all the that interested in the subject or you have no idea what we are taking about and why you might even want such a tool.... thus I will attempt to give you a bit more information and see if an "lights" turn on and any "wheels" start spinning.
The first place to start is maybe here:
http://www.woodshoptips.com/tips/022403/index.htm
This is the page that talks about the version of the tool I have but the use of the tool is so close that if you updated the pictures it would work for the new version.
If you want a very short history of the item check this:
http://www.ssug.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=627
If you can add to the history please do so........
In general a lot of people use the router to shape the edge of some project, maybe rounding an edge and that it is extent of it. Ah but routers can do soooo much more. Once you start do things like making patterns and getting a router table it becomes so much clearer as to what other projects you can do..... and what other ways to really use the router.
The overarm router was the leap that got many a job done in small and large shops. It was the NC machine so to speak of the day. Small shops with small budgets were looking at paying lots of dollars to have one of these in their shop.... for the average hobby woodworker they were out of the question both in terms of cost and size.
This was where the Norm Bryden design came in. It was home shop size and with the help of shopsmith an affordable tool. My guess is that most that were sold still went to comerical shops but at least a few of the hobbiest also picked one up. Then the price of a smaller NC machine started to get with in reach of small shops and again this is my guess but the number of machines sold dropped.... and the last few were sold off.
For people like me who never did get the money together for a new one my hopes for getting one went way down.... only to be back by way of ebay. I'm not sure what the final cost was but it was not cheap... I got it in several sales... basic machine, upgraded table and stand, better upgraded table, several orders of parts from shopsmith.... to be honest I really don't want to add it up.
So what happens next... shopsmith makes it a part of the family again. But my fear is that a lot of people have no idea why they would want one and what it can do... the sales will be poor and again this fine tool will pass away.
BTW the other tool that is also misunderstood is the Joint-Matic which shopsmith got from Strong Industries.... perhaps even by shopsmith.
So this is gotten a bit long....... maybe if you have questions you would like to ask them either here or at the http://www.ssug.org site (look under forums for both the items mentioned here). I can't give you details on the new model but I can tell you how the one I have works.
Ed
I can see my the lack of posts here that either no one is all the that interested in the subject or you have no idea what we are taking about and why you might even want such a tool.... thus I will attempt to give you a bit more information and see if an "lights" turn on and any "wheels" start spinning.
The first place to start is maybe here:
http://www.woodshoptips.com/tips/022403/index.htm
This is the page that talks about the version of the tool I have but the use of the tool is so close that if you updated the pictures it would work for the new version.
If you want a very short history of the item check this:
http://www.ssug.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=627
If you can add to the history please do so........
In general a lot of people use the router to shape the edge of some project, maybe rounding an edge and that it is extent of it. Ah but routers can do soooo much more. Once you start do things like making patterns and getting a router table it becomes so much clearer as to what other projects you can do..... and what other ways to really use the router.
The overarm router was the leap that got many a job done in small and large shops. It was the NC machine so to speak of the day. Small shops with small budgets were looking at paying lots of dollars to have one of these in their shop.... for the average hobby woodworker they were out of the question both in terms of cost and size.
This was where the Norm Bryden design came in. It was home shop size and with the help of shopsmith an affordable tool. My guess is that most that were sold still went to comerical shops but at least a few of the hobbiest also picked one up. Then the price of a smaller NC machine started to get with in reach of small shops and again this is my guess but the number of machines sold dropped.... and the last few were sold off.
For people like me who never did get the money together for a new one my hopes for getting one went way down.... only to be back by way of ebay. I'm not sure what the final cost was but it was not cheap... I got it in several sales... basic machine, upgraded table and stand, better upgraded table, several orders of parts from shopsmith.... to be honest I really don't want to add it up.
So what happens next... shopsmith makes it a part of the family again. But my fear is that a lot of people have no idea why they would want one and what it can do... the sales will be poor and again this fine tool will pass away.
BTW the other tool that is also misunderstood is the Joint-Matic which shopsmith got from Strong Industries.... perhaps even by shopsmith.
So this is gotten a bit long....... maybe if you have questions you would like to ask them either here or at the http://www.ssug.org site (look under forums for both the items mentioned here). I can't give you details on the new model but I can tell you how the one I have works.
Ed
-
Ed in Tampa
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 5829
- Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:45 am
- Location: North Tampa Bay area Florida
Ed
You have stirred my interest in the overhead pin router.
I have been waffleing between which router table to buy/build and this presents a whole new option.
From what I see the overhead pin router should function exactly like a router table only using the pin router adjustments instead of the router to adjust depth and etc.
Also you are working upside down compared to a router table.
Besides this you also have the pin router feature and you can run the thing in horizontal mode which lets you use vertical panel raising bits which don't have the 3 1/2 inch swing of the normal panel raising bits.
The only thing that is stopping me is the requirement for a round body router.
I have a Hitachi m12, a Porter cable 8529, Sears 1/4 inch and small edge trimmer.
I know everyone says you can never own enough routers but I would want the big PC to put into this thing and between the two the cost would be $600or so. Right now I can get a really nice router table and insert for my Hitachi and even with a fence and all for less than $200
But I'm definitely thinking about it.
What was the neatest thing you did on your pin router?
Ed
You have stirred my interest in the overhead pin router.
I have been waffleing between which router table to buy/build and this presents a whole new option.
From what I see the overhead pin router should function exactly like a router table only using the pin router adjustments instead of the router to adjust depth and etc.
Also you are working upside down compared to a router table.
Besides this you also have the pin router feature and you can run the thing in horizontal mode which lets you use vertical panel raising bits which don't have the 3 1/2 inch swing of the normal panel raising bits.
The only thing that is stopping me is the requirement for a round body router.
I have a Hitachi m12, a Porter cable 8529, Sears 1/4 inch and small edge trimmer.
I know everyone says you can never own enough routers but I would want the big PC to put into this thing and between the two the cost would be $600or so. Right now I can get a really nice router table and insert for my Hitachi and even with a fence and all for less than $200
But I'm definitely thinking about it.
What was the neatest thing you did on your pin router?
Ed
...but the fence left a lot to be desired.
Agreed. Same fence comes with the Overarm Router. Fortunately, fences are easy to make.
...something about horizontal routing...What do you mean?
The router is held horizontally and the table is parallel to the axis of rotation.
Can you do mortise and tenons?
You betcha. Best mortise-and-tenon tool in Shopsmith's arsenal. Perhaps the best in anyone's arsenal.
With all good wishes,
Agreed. Same fence comes with the Overarm Router. Fortunately, fences are easy to make.
...something about horizontal routing...What do you mean?
The router is held horizontally and the table is parallel to the axis of rotation.
Can you do mortise and tenons?
You betcha. Best mortise-and-tenon tool in Shopsmith's arsenal. Perhaps the best in anyone's arsenal.
With all good wishes,
Nick Engler
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
Hi,
Again this is the information from the old over arm router set up
The router needs to be one that can mount in the arm. The motor needs to be between 2-1/2" and 4" in dia. and it is mounted without a base. They call for up to 2-1/2 hp on the old one, no idea about the new one. You have 3-1/2" vertical travel in addition you can locate the arm at various distances from the table for up to about 12" of stock height.
While it does not say anything about spinning large bits I personal would question if I wanted to use a 3-1/2" bit in this arrangement. This and the limit of 2-1/2 hp would move me to you larger router and table.
I have a sears 1/4" router that I have had mounted in this along with a PC690 and now what I have mounted as my simi-perm solution a Hitachi KM 12VC motor. I got the whole kit, router, both bases, centering kit, extra sub-base and guides all in a case for under $160.00. The "plain" router sells for a lot less...... I haven't priced them lately but by shopping around it should not be much over $100. (I liked this model so much I purchased two more).
The table on mine is designed to use the two piece fence system and you can build off that by adding some simple parts described in the manual. Depending what you are expecting in a fence this will work or go ahead and make your own.... or add an Incra if you want. The orginal Incra was offered by shopsmith for the router arm and I have one of those... mounting holes provided by shopsmith. I see a lot of advice about fences but take a look at:
http://www.thewoodworkingchannel.com
and look for a show called the router workshop or maybe you have seen it on PBS..... I'm in their camp as far a fences go. (But I still have two Incra fences.)
I have always been interested in pin routing and have attemped to purchase one (with over head pin) I even tried to make a my own really good set up for pin routing.... The one I purchased was so bad that every pass left the edge a bit different then the one before... three passes - three visible lines on the stock edge. These really have to be ridge to work. Lucky for me the company took it back.... I did better on my design it was still to limited and hard to use....... The shopsmith is stout!
It comes with three "pins" that you need to center with the bit of the same size that is held in the router.(This is almost true but maybe more on that later). Once the bit and pin are aligned a pattern is followed by the pin and the router cuts the same part on your work piece. Now think about making one pattern then cutting 1 spare that is just like the first. You stick that up on the wall and start using the orginal and make the 30 or 40 or 120 or 1001 parts you need.... if you wear out the first pattern remember the spare one you made back at the start of the project... now you have that new one hanging there so you make another new one and use the spare till it wears out and so on and so on....... Or maybe you would like to make things 4 at a time out of some stock. You simply make the first pattern then make 3 more ones just like that then made a fixture to hold the 4 patterns at one time on you stock and away you go doing 4 at a time.... What is nice is you can see what your cutting because it is up on top...
Pin routing is nice because the pattern can be the same size as what you are making... if you use guide bushings you always have to deal with the off set of the bit to bushing dimension...... nicer then even pilot bits because the pilot has to spin etc. as do pattern bit bearings....... pins just sit nice and cool working away.
Can you do some of these same operations on other tools..... sure you can but when you have a better tool to do the job why not use it....
By the way in case is not clear the handle is dual function, you twist to lock or unlock and then of course the up and down function. The depth stop then saves you the problem of going a bit too deep... If you want you can add a foot switch to start stop the motor just make sure you turn the router off before doing anything else with it.
Want to do a bunch of really clean 1/4" holes...... how about a 1/4" spiral bit and the over arm router???? I don't think you can get them any cleaner then the router bit does.
Ed
Again this is the information from the old over arm router set up
The router needs to be one that can mount in the arm. The motor needs to be between 2-1/2" and 4" in dia. and it is mounted without a base. They call for up to 2-1/2 hp on the old one, no idea about the new one. You have 3-1/2" vertical travel in addition you can locate the arm at various distances from the table for up to about 12" of stock height.
While it does not say anything about spinning large bits I personal would question if I wanted to use a 3-1/2" bit in this arrangement. This and the limit of 2-1/2 hp would move me to you larger router and table.
I have a sears 1/4" router that I have had mounted in this along with a PC690 and now what I have mounted as my simi-perm solution a Hitachi KM 12VC motor. I got the whole kit, router, both bases, centering kit, extra sub-base and guides all in a case for under $160.00. The "plain" router sells for a lot less...... I haven't priced them lately but by shopping around it should not be much over $100. (I liked this model so much I purchased two more).
The table on mine is designed to use the two piece fence system and you can build off that by adding some simple parts described in the manual. Depending what you are expecting in a fence this will work or go ahead and make your own.... or add an Incra if you want. The orginal Incra was offered by shopsmith for the router arm and I have one of those... mounting holes provided by shopsmith. I see a lot of advice about fences but take a look at:
http://www.thewoodworkingchannel.com
and look for a show called the router workshop or maybe you have seen it on PBS..... I'm in their camp as far a fences go. (But I still have two Incra fences.)
I have always been interested in pin routing and have attemped to purchase one (with over head pin) I even tried to make a my own really good set up for pin routing.... The one I purchased was so bad that every pass left the edge a bit different then the one before... three passes - three visible lines on the stock edge. These really have to be ridge to work. Lucky for me the company took it back.... I did better on my design it was still to limited and hard to use....... The shopsmith is stout!
It comes with three "pins" that you need to center with the bit of the same size that is held in the router.(This is almost true but maybe more on that later). Once the bit and pin are aligned a pattern is followed by the pin and the router cuts the same part on your work piece. Now think about making one pattern then cutting 1 spare that is just like the first. You stick that up on the wall and start using the orginal and make the 30 or 40 or 120 or 1001 parts you need.... if you wear out the first pattern remember the spare one you made back at the start of the project... now you have that new one hanging there so you make another new one and use the spare till it wears out and so on and so on....... Or maybe you would like to make things 4 at a time out of some stock. You simply make the first pattern then make 3 more ones just like that then made a fixture to hold the 4 patterns at one time on you stock and away you go doing 4 at a time.... What is nice is you can see what your cutting because it is up on top...
Pin routing is nice because the pattern can be the same size as what you are making... if you use guide bushings you always have to deal with the off set of the bit to bushing dimension...... nicer then even pilot bits because the pilot has to spin etc. as do pattern bit bearings....... pins just sit nice and cool working away.
Can you do some of these same operations on other tools..... sure you can but when you have a better tool to do the job why not use it....
By the way in case is not clear the handle is dual function, you twist to lock or unlock and then of course the up and down function. The depth stop then saves you the problem of going a bit too deep... If you want you can add a foot switch to start stop the motor just make sure you turn the router off before doing anything else with it.
Want to do a bunch of really clean 1/4" holes...... how about a 1/4" spiral bit and the over arm router???? I don't think you can get them any cleaner then the router bit does.
Ed
Always thought these things were interesting
Thanks for the discussion!! Don't have much time right now to fully read your comments, but I now know this tool has many more possibilities than I have ever imagined. Keep writing! I'll come back to learn more. AGAIN Thanks ED! Thanks Nick!! Thanks All!
Chuck
Chuck
New Over Arm Pin Router Arrived
Wow what a neat looking tool. My only mistake was receiving it before Christmas. The boss will never laet me play with it for at least a week.
It is truly a heavy weight. I wonder when Nick is going to write an article for the Woodworking Forum to help us put this new tool to work.
If you are considering one I suggest getting it now before the special ends, I'm glad I did. Jim:D
It is truly a heavy weight. I wonder when Nick is going to write an article for the Woodworking Forum to help us put this new tool to work.If you are considering one I suggest getting it now before the special ends, I'm glad I did. Jim:D