Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

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JPG
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by JPG »

Does this mean the guvmnt did not exist between 1976 Jul 01 and 1976 Oct 01?

Now WHY should a contractor change their bookeeping simply because the guvmnt did?
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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chapmanruss
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

Fredricks,

Welcome to the Shopsmith Forum. The decision on keeping your Shopsmith Mark 5 and restoring it or selling it, in my opinion, should be based on if you would find it useful or not. If you like woodworking keep it. If you like restoring tools, you could do that (I find them fun to restore) and then sell it or if not either of the above then do not keep it. Since you inherited it there is a family connection and if you do not want it maybe someone else in your family would.

You said "the powerhead works" which is called the headstock so a little maintenance/lubrication there. I would suspect it is the 2 top rails called Way Tubes that are the pretty clean ones and the not so good ones are the bottom, Bench Tubes. The way tubes are simply polished metal for the headstock and carriage to slide on. The bench tubes are painted silver for the early Mark 5's. The bench tubes are slightly longer and larger in diameter than the way tubes for the Mark 5 "Greenies". So far an easy start for getting it back into shape. A lot of the same or similar parts are still used in the current Mark V 520 made today. Depending on which aluminum parts are broken you may be able to replace them with current new parts or find used parts. If you decide to restore it or fix it up enough to use we can help you along the way. I would encourage you to start your own thread in the Maintenance and Repair section for this so as not to get lost in this or another thread.

Everybody,

Fiscal years vary by companies and different government levels. In Oregon local governments, counties, cities and special districts, use the July 1 to June 30 fiscal year. Why I don't know but since they are mostly supported by property taxes which are not due until November 15 I believe bankers must have designed it so these local governments must borrow money to operate until the property tax collections come in. Government, go figure.

My hope is that somewhere in the paperwork Everett collected from Shopsmith he may find the answer as to when Magna, Yuba and Magna's fiscal years occured.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by RFGuy »

chapmanruss wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:01 pm Fiscal years vary by companies and different government levels.
I can't speak to government calendars, but in business fiscal years are rarely the same as the calendar year (frustrating, I know). Reasons vary...sometimes it is based on taxes and availability of accounting firms at a particular time of year (accounting firms are cheaper during low times of the year). Other times it is based on when the company sees major revenue for the year, e.g. if a business records most of the revenue in the summer, then often a fall year end is picked rather than December/January. Also, if the company works on government contracts, it makes sense that they follow whatever fiscal year the government is on.
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by JPG »

I fail to understand WHY party A and party B having a different fiscal year boundary unless they are subsidiaries is an issue. Their books are independent if not subsidiaries. Each set of books is an 'island'.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

The only Fiscal Year that matters here is the one for the makers of the Shopsmith Mark 5. That would allow us to better guesstimate what some of the missing monthly starting serial numbers are so we can have better dates available as to when any Mark 5 was made.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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chapmanruss
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

Identifying which Shopsmith Mark 5 or Mark V you have can be difficult at times. Let’s go through the different Models starting with the first Mark 5 the “Greenie”. From its introduction in 1954 until 1985 there was only one Shopsmith Mark 5 or Mark V. They started out painted in green and silver colors. It had the original table system which is the actual difference between the models. In 1960 the paint color changed to gold and copper and were commonly known as “Goldies”. Shortly before the Mark 5 went out of production in the 1960's the paint color changed to the most common gray paint color. Up to now they are all a Mark 5 and in 1980 the labeling on the tool itself changed to Mark V as seen on the vent plate on the belt cover. Below is a Mark V with the original table system aka 500.

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Mark V Model 500.jpg
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In 1985 the Mark V 510 and 505 were introduced with the larger table system that included floating tables for the 510. It was at this time that the Mark V with the original table system became the Mark V 500. A special note about the Mark V 510 and 505 is during their first year in production the fence tubes were slightly different and mounted different than later Mark V 510 and 505 tools. You can tell the difference between the early Mark V 510/505 by the holes on the fence tubes they had compared to the later ones without the mounting holes. Below is a picture of a Mark V 505 and 510.

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Mark V Model 505 50th Anniversary.jpg
Mark V Model 505 50th Anniversary.jpg (17.73 KiB) Viewed 345 times
Mark V Model 510.jpg
Mark V Model 510.jpg (12.65 KiB) Viewed 345 times
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In 1999 the Mark V 520 was introduced with the Pro Fence. It uses the same tables and carriage as the Mark V 510/505 but has extruded aluminum fence rails and a larger fence. It is the same table system used for the Mark 7 which came out in 2010. Below is a picture of a Mark V 520.

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Mark V Model 520.jpg
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Hopefully this information helps anyone trying to identify which Model of Mark V they may have. Do keep in mind that any pre 1985 Mark 5 or Mark V can be upgraded to these other models by changing the Table System. They can even be upgraded to be a Mark 7. It is the table system a Mark 5/V has that determines which model it currently is.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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chapmanruss
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

For those of you who are new to the Shopsmith tools or interested in getting a Shopsmith here are some things to think about. The Shopsmith Mark 5, like the Model 10E and 10ER preceding it was introduced as a 5 in 1 tool. It functions as a Table Saw, Drill Press, Horizontal Boring Machine, Disk Sander and Lathe as it came from the factory. It came and still does with all the necessary items needed to do those functions except lathe chisels or drill bits to start working right away. Starter kits add Lathe Chisels, Drill Bits and more. When it was introduced, there were already many accessories available to do even more thanks to the similarities between it and the Model 10’s. Routing, Molding, Shaping and more were already available and additional accessories were made for the Mark 5. I am sure most Shopsmith Owner’s add some of the additional accessories to make their Tool more useful. Be it SPT’s or other accessories needed to complete a project. It is the design of the Shopsmith Mark V and available accessories that allow the Shopsmith to do things that stand alone tools simply cannot. For example, how many woodworkers using standalone tools have a Horizontal Boring Machine? It is a feature you can use on a Shopsmith and one I do use and like having that kind of flexibility. Because I have a Shopsmith I was able to mortise square holes in a project that was too large to do on a drill press. Without it I would have likely tried to use an electric hand drill and chisel or not done the project because of the limitations of the tools I had on hand. I could go on and on but suffice it to say that the Shopsmith is a unique tool that may only be limited by one’s imagination.

Is there anything about the Shopsmith Mark 5/V and its different Models that should be covered here? My hope is this can be a reference for those individuals wanting information about the Mark 5 and Mark V’s to be able to find what they want to know about them in one location. That being said it is not my intention to provide individual service, maintenance or restoration help here. The best way to do that is start your own thread with questions specific to your situation as many members do. We are always happy to help our fellow Shopsmith Owners.

Readers, please do not be offended by the above request. I feel it is better to have a thread of your own relating to your particular needs than having questions and answers mixed in with unrelated posts.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

Accessories are one of the unique features that I feel make the Shopsmith tool special. You can add extra functions to a stand-alone tool like a Table Saw and do dados with a special blade set but extra functions are limited. Something to keep in mind when looking for accessories for different models of the Mark 5/V is the differences between the models and even differences over the years. In a recent thread the Mark 5 and Mark V 500 Front Table Extension came up. Keep in mind that this was made only for the original Table System. Having not actually seen one before I learned that there have been two versions. The first to fit the early Mark 5 table with the cast on fence rail and the later one also fits the bolt on fence rail having more reach. It is a case where you need to know which version of the Front Extension Table to get to fit your Mark 5 or V 500. Thanks to JPG and Mike for that information and the thread can be found at the link below.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=25270&start=20

When looking for used accessories you should do a little research if you are not totally familiar with the item. Many sellers of used items do not know what they actually have for sale and commonly mislabel them. As an example, do you know how many different Shopsmith Shaper Fences there are? As you would expect there is the original Shaper Fence dating back to the introduction of the Mark 5 in 1954 that fits the original Table System AKA Mark V 500. Lessor known is it also fits the Shopsmith Model 10E and 10ER which actually came out before the Mark 5 was introduced and can be used in place of the Model 10’s table insert style Jointer-Shaper Fence. It does not fit the Mark V 510, 505, 520 or Mark 7 without modification. There is a Shaper Fence for the Mark V 510, 505, 520 and Mark 7. The other Shaper Fence is for the 1960’s Mark VII which does not fit the Mark 5/V models or newer Mark 7 unless the tables are modified. The last two Shaper Fences mount through holes in the table top whereas the original Shaper Fence clamps over the front and rear of the table.

If you want to do some mortising which hold down would you use? Early hold downs were attached to the fence in a hole through the top of the fence held by a set screw but with the introduction of the “T” track in fences you need the “T” nut. That one can still be used on earlier fences by inverting the rod or removing the “T” nut. There is a Mark V 500 upgrade fence with a “T” track.

Simply said anytime you are using the Table System on your Mark 5/V you need to check if there are specific differences in accessories for the original Table System versus the larger Table System of the 510, 505 & 520. The Table System includes the carriage so most functions aside from powering an SPT are affected in some way.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by JPG »

Would any one be interested in pix of the model 2 table/carriage/aux table/rip fence/ mitergauge/tailstock?

Here or separate thread?

No, I do NOT have a complete M2, but do have those parts. The carriage will fit onto M5 way tubes.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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chapmanruss
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Re: Shopsmith Mark 5 What When and Where

Post by chapmanruss »

JPG,

I don't know if there is enough to be said about the Shopsmith Mark 2 to have it's own thread like this one. The following is some history and information on the Mark 2 which was made from 1958 to 1960. Below is a picture of one of mine which is waiting to be restored.

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20.jpg
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Introduced in December of 1957 by Magna Power Tool Corporation. This unit was made at Montgomery Ward’s request and sold primarily by them. It was not made to the same quality standards as the Mark V and was a lower cost alternative while still providing the same five functions. It has an 8” saw blade capacity instead of the 9” saw blade of the Mark 5 at the time. The Mark 2 uses a ½ HP or optional ¾ HP motor while the Mark 5 had a ¾ HP motor at the time that was later changed to a 1-1/8 HP motor. It uses two 2-step pulleys to change the 7 speeds (much like the Model 10E and 10ER) instead of the variable speed of the Mark 5. It has lower quality locks to hold the headstock, carriage, etc. in place. It has an extra saw blade slot on the main table (a feature added to the Mark 5 in the 1960’s and 1970’s). The Miter looks similar but is different than the Mark 5’s as it has no angle stops and a shorter bar without the lock to hold it in place on the table. Some Mark 2’s have round metal bench tubes while others have rounded top channels made out of wood to connect the bench ends and legs together. It could be purchased with or without the bench. Instructions included making your own wood bench. It has a narrow step shape extension table that creates its own fence and serves as the tailstock with a small block attachment. There are very few individual parts that are interchangeable with the Mark 5. The Mark 5 Headstock will fit on the Mark 2 frame. The Mark 2 can also hold and power Add-a-tools later known as Special Purpose Tools made for the Mark 5/V’s and Mark VII/7’s. Even the table system can be changed to the Mark V or 7’s. It started out with the “Greenie” colors and later changed to gray.

At the time of its introduction the Mark 2 was priced at $179.90 (less bench and motor) compared to the Mark 5 at $329.50. The Bench with tubes costs $19.95 and the ½ HP motor was $34.95 making the total for a Mark 2 to be comparably equipped to the Mark 5 at $234.80 and still considerably less than the Mark 5.

Another interesting feature of the Mark 2 is the Headrest which is a pin-able version of the Base and Arm which functions much like the new Mark 7 Double Tilt feature.

The Mark 2 works more like it’s a Model 10 trying to look more like a Mark 5.

I have two almost complete Mark 2's waiting restoration. Unfortunately I do not have the Tailstock attachment and Mark 2 Miter for both units. One has a cracked carriage and both belt covers have some damage. The good news for the missing Tailstock attachment and Miter is the Mark 5 Tailstock and Miter can be used on the Mark 2 as replacements.

Mark 2's I have seen for sale are commonly missing the Tailstock attachment that locks on to the extension table. The belt guard is commonly missing or is damaged. There is an extension for the Table Riser Crank that is commonly missing (I only have 1) but there is a longer threaded shaft crank that I have with the other Mark 2.

Extra Accessories specific to the Mark 2 are harder to find either for sale separately or with a Mark 2. Retractable casters like the ones for the Mark 5 are narrower for the Mark 2 and not often found on them. Like the Mark 5 at the time upper and lower blade guards were an optional accessory. I have yet to see a Mark 2 with those. I cannot even find a picture but only a listing for them in catalogs. The Mark 2 Table has a threaded hole on the back end of the table like the Model 10E and 10ER which could be for an upper blade guard like the one for the Model 10 which does fit on the Mark 2. It is possible the Model 10E/10ER Lower Blade Guard was the one available for the Mark 2. The Mark 2 used 8" Saw Blades.

At some point, apparently there was a version made with just the Powr-Kraft label.

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Powr-Kraft Mark 2.jpg
Powr-Kraft Mark 2.jpg (35.19 KiB) Viewed 255 times
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. 10E S/N 1076 & Mark 2 to be restored plus others.
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