Portable generators

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edma194
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Portable generators

Post by edma194 »

I'm veering outside the range of woodworking in this thread. I'm planning on a whole house generator sometime in the future but there are home improvements still needed. Getting a fixed generator installed around here also requires a long wait, there's a shortage of installers and equipment is back-ordered.

So for the near future I want to get a portable generator that will keep the heat on in the winter time (oil furnace+24000BTU heat pump), and keep at least one fridge running. Lights are pretty much nothing these days. I guess I have to work out how many watts I need total. And when the power isn't out this will give me an easy way to plug in my welders out in my welding shop (20ft storage container with too much junk in it right now).

So if anyone has experience with portable generators or advice please let me know. I want to get set up before the serious cold comes in.
Ed from Rhode Island

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DLB
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Re: Portable generators

Post by DLB »

The heat pump is a tall (in watts) order so my first question: Is there a heating mode that uses the air movement part of the heat pump but the oil burning part of the furnace? Around here heat pumps have an "Emergency Heat" mode that disables the compressor and uses Natural Gas, Propane, or Electric as a heat source. When I had the NG version, my heat would run with relatively little electric power.

I have a small portable generator that I bought primarily for running my welder out of range of extension cords. With 20/20 hindsight, I know this was not the best choice and wish I had bought a PTO driven generator that would run off my tractor. If you don't have a tractor, this advice is useless. When you use it only infrequently, the gas portable can be a PITA. Plus mine doesn't really work that well for the welder. IMO it doesn't handle the dramatic near-instantaneous changes in Amps as well as I (or my welder) would have liked. I would look to at least double the needed power for this type load. I simply went too cheap.

Also some house-boating experience with marine generators. Diesel is the only way to go. We frequently had problems with the gas models and often hear of people having issues with theirs. Power generation is not really optional nor a luxury on the newer styles of houseboats, and the diesels are simply more reliable. We've been using a Kohler turbo diesel for the past few years and it has been excellent.

- David
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Re: Portable generators

Post by roy_okc »

Ed,

To add to what David said, you apparently want to make sure your power is smooth/has a nice clean sine wave for anything with electronics. If you get a noisy gas generator, the electric wave is probably pretty dirty. Some (all?) quiet generators put out a cleaner wave. You can get power conditioners that will clean up the incoming power, but I'm far from smart enough to know what kind are appropriate.
Roy

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edma194
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Re: Portable generators

Post by edma194 »

Thanks guys. The oil heat and heat pump are totally separate systems. Oil heats the old half of the house, the split system does the new part. Next year I'll add a split system to the old house and the oil burner will just provide basement heat. It could probably heat both parts if it had to, it sort of did while we were under construction.

I wouldn't run any electronics on the line during a power outage except the rechargeable stuff. Charging won't use a lot of power. I used to get through the outages with a 2000 watt inverter operating off a car. With only one battery it couldn't provide a full 2000 watts but it would keep a refrigerator running (not as important as heat in the middle of winter). A good sized portable generator can handle a lot more than that. I do have look up the details on that compressor unit and see what size breaker is on that. It's 230V and the generators usually have at least one 230V outlet. I don't have to power much, if I can keep a few lights one we'll be fine.

Whoa, just occurred to me we have an electric water heater too. The oil burner can heat water but I have the coil closed off right now because of a problem. Need to get that sucker fixed ASAP.
Ed from Rhode Island

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HopefulSSer
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Re: Portable generators

Post by HopefulSSer »

Just thinking out loud... I've not done it yet but I've considered down-rating the elements in my electric water heater. They're currently 4500w but 3500w are available. My genset could pull the 3500w if I shut off everything else while I was heating water. I don't know how much I'd give up when I'm on mains though. Might not be worth it for the infrequent power outages we have around here.
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JPG
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Re: Portable generators

Post by JPG »

Candles/flashlights are for "infrequent' power outages.

A candle in a garbage can will make a room tolerable above 0°F.

BTDT fer a week er so.
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john_001
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Re: Portable generators

Post by john_001 »

edma194 wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:04 pmI'm planning on a whole house generator sometime in the future but there are home improvements still needed. Getting a fixed generator installed around here also requires a long wait, there's a shortage of installers and equipment is back-ordered.
How much in the future? Mine took 10 months (Sept. to July), and it's probably even worse now; so if you'll want it in time for winter 2022-23, it might not be too soon to get your order in.
RFGuy
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Re: Portable generators

Post by RFGuy »

Ed,

My experience with generators is limited, but I thought I would share what I do know. A whole house generator with appropriate transfer switch is definitely the best way to go but will run you a lot of money. If you are looking to go with a portable generator in the meantime and are okay with manually hooking it up and running it, then my suggestion would be to look at what Honda offers. In camping out here, I can tell you almost everyone owns a Honda portable generator and bring it to camp, which is very telling. Also, a few of my camping friends own and love their Honda generators so I have close friends who recommend them. They are nearly trouble free and usually start right up on the 1st pull. Also hold their value really well.
Another added benefit is they tend to be quieter than most other models on the market. In fact, they are so good that Harbor Freight with their Predator line essentially copied them almost exactly. I am not a fan of blatant, patent defying copies like the Predator, but if budget is paramount you can consider them. I have seen review articles that give the smaller Predator portable generator glowing reviews, but it has been a few years since I looked into them. Keep in mind no matter what generator you pick, if you are running a heating system on it or other larger load, then the generator will likely need to run at higher throttle which is louder and burns through gas faster. Something to consider for what size you buy, e.g. buying a larger one that runs at half throttle could be quieter (and more efficient) for you than buying a smaller one that has to run at full throttle the whole time. Hope this helps.

You didn't mean what fuel source you are looking for or have in abundance. You can get generators that run on gasoline, diesel, propane, etc. Did you have a fuel source in mind that you want to use for it?
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edma194
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Re: Portable generators

Post by edma194 »

Dual fuel. More efficient with gasoline but I don't want to keep a lot of gasoline around. Have to check on the gasoline requirements, the regular gas around here has ethanol and so many additives in it that it ruins small engines. I only have a chainsaw and lawnmower left to keep gasoline for and I wouldn't mind going battery on those.

I'll check out the Hondas.
Ed from Rhode Island

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HopefulSSer
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Re: Portable generators

Post by HopefulSSer »

edma194 wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:47 pm Dual fuel. More efficient with gasoline but I don't want to keep a lot of gasoline around. Have to check on the gasoline requirements, the regular gas around here has ethanol and so many additives in it that it ruins small engines. I only have a chainsaw and lawnmower left to keep gasoline for and I wouldn't mind going battery on those.

I'll check out the Hondas.
FWIW the only piece of equipment that's had issues with the E10 we get around here is my old JD garden tractor. The ethanol dissolved the fuel hose inside the tank. But that's the only part it affected on the tractor, and nothing else has had issues. The JD is the oldest I have (1984), the second oldest being the generator (Generac, purchased new ca. 1999). I don't know if the age of the machine has anything to do with it.... Also, most (all?) of the fuel lines on everything have been replaced over time as they perished so that probably helps.

I've never owned a Honda generator but I've been around them and they are MUCH quieter than my B&S-powered one!
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