Pulley Speed Shaft Binding Problems, Looking for Help

[jere]

So the other day I went to fire up the SS and the motor was turning slowly, and tripped the breaker. I have been using it all week as a table saw making a new railing for the front porch. It has been pretty cold so lately but it hasn't been this slow to start. I started taking it apart cleaning wood dust and oiling metal on metal moving parts. I haven't taken it apart as I did the other day, but I have oiled it in the past few months of ownership.

After the oiling I put things back together the motor turned but I noticed I couldn't change the speed dial past three speed points. I took the dial apart and found a "Quadrant Assembly" as the SS site lists it (it was a geared lever arm), the teeth where well worn and it looked like it was missing some washers. I ordered a new one, but the part turned and I wanted to see if I could get away with it to finish the job I started. I cleaned, oiled and reassembled everything, and again ran into a problem.

I haven't seen the SS apart in pieces working, so I may be wrong but it seems like the real problem is the shaft that that arm comes in contact with. I am guessing that the arm pushes against this shaft to change speeds can anyone verify this? Anyway the shaft won't move, even if I push on it by hand. What would be holding this shaft in place? Could it be another bad part? Or is it just something else that needs cleaned?

[JPG]

So the other day I went to fire up the SS and the motor was turning slowly, and tripped the breaker. I have been using it all week as a table saw making a new railing for the front porch. It has been pretty cold so lately but it hasn't been this slow to start. I started taking it apart cleaning wood dust and oiling metal on metal moving parts. I haven't taken it apart as I did the other day, but I have oiled it in the past few months of ownership.

After the oiling I put things back together the motor turned but I noticed I couldn't change the speed dial past three speed points. I took the dial apart and found a "Quadrant Assembly" as the SS site lists it (it was a geared lever arm), the teeth where well worn and it looked like it was missing some washers. I ordered a new one, but the part turned and I wanted to see if I could get away with it to finish the job I started. I cleaned, oiled and reassembled everything, and again ran into a problem.

I haven't seen the SS apart in pieces working, so I may be wrong but it seems like the real problem is the shaft that that arm comes in contact with. I am guessing that the arm pushes against this shaft to change speeds can anyone verify this? Anyway the shaft won't move, even if I push on it by hand. What would be holding this shaft in place? Could it be another bad part? Or is it just something else that needs cleaned?

Take a look at that shaft and see if you can locate the oil hole. Yes that shaft should move, but only if the pulleys are rotating. There is a similar hole in the hub of the floating sheave on the motor shaft.

Those two locations should be oiled every 10 hrs of run time.

Check out the sticky threads at the top of the Maintenance and Repair forum(this un).

[charlese]

So the other day I went to fire up the SS and the motor was turning slowly, and tripped the breaker. I have been using it all week as a table saw making a new railing for the front porch. It has been pretty cold so lately but it hasn't been this slow to start. I started taking it apart cleaning wood dust and oiling metal on metal moving parts. I haven't taken it apart as I did the other day, but I have oiled it in the past few months of ownership.

After the oiling I put things back together the motor turned but I noticed I couldn't change the speed dial past three speed points. I took the dial apart and found a "Quadrant Assembly" as the SS site lists it (it was a geared lever arm), the teeth where well worn and it looked like it was missing some washers. I ordered a new one, but the part turned and I wanted to see if I could get away with it to finish the job I started. I cleaned, oiled and reassembled everything, and again ran into a problem.

I haven't seen the SS apart in pieces working, so I may be wrong but it seems like the real problem is the shaft that that arm comes in contact with. I am guessing that the arm pushes against this shaft to change speeds can anyone verify this? Anyway the shaft won't move, even if I push on it by hand. What would be holding this shaft in place? Could it be another bad part? Or is it just something else that needs cleaned?

I have noticed the Mark V manual says the temperature should be at least 50 degrees to run the headstock. That said, I have run mine at lower temps, but was always careful to start at low speed - This is easiest on the motor and gives more power to the quill. I also have run a Mark V with worn teeth on the quadrant with no issues. It changed speeds easily, but I did order a spare and had it on hand.

Lubrication - The arm and shaft is all part of the idler shaft assembly - refer to the exploded diagram and parts list here http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/productmanuals/MKVSTDPartsList%20_1_14.pdf

The control sheave should slide very easily back and forth on the idler shaft. Since yours is stuck, it definitely needs oil. At this point on your machine, it is necessary to oil and remove the control sheave from the shaft. Then look at the short key ,#108 on the exploded diagram. make sure it still has square edges and also the keyway on the control sheave has not been widened or distorted. Now take a good look at the retaining loop (#111) to see if it's roll pin is still in the little button on the end of the control sheave slide tube and it can rotate freely around using the little bearing at the end of the tube. Lack of oil can cause this bearing to fail. If those things don't perform easily and freely, you need to also order the appropriate parts.

Although the SS recommendation is for a few drops of oil into the control sheave hole every 10 hours. Many have found that excess oil in here does not hurt, but helps keep things working. The little bearing will thank you!

Now down to the motor shaft - Put your machine in drill press position and give the motor shaft a good oiling through the spring. Let the oil work it;s way down the shaft then pull the floating sheave (#117) out by hand several times until it slides easily with only the spring holding it in. Caution - don't let go of the floating sheave and let it slam into the motor sheave. This may cause damage.

After these parts are working follow the 10 hour lubrication advice in the future.

[jere]

Thanks for the replies, they helps a lot.

What kind of oil is best, just motor oil? I have noticed wood chips tend to get stuck in the motor oil without much cause

[beeg]

What kind of oil is best, just motor oil? I have noticed wood chips tend to get stuck in the motor oil without much cause

I use 3in1 oil, with a long flexible spout on it.

[JPG]

I use 3in1 oil, with a long flexible spout on it.

#10 Machine oil - Sewing machine oil - turbine oil - ZOOM SPOUT oil - and yes 3in1 oil.

Low viscosity!!!

[jere]

I had a chance to take the SS apart today, the oil didn't help the frozen parts. The pulley plates on the 105 shaft and not budging. The wire hoop 111, roll pin, and bearing seem fine. I can see the key way on the shaft looking in-between the pulley plates but I can't see if there is any damage where the pulley meets it.

I am thinking about wedging or prying the two pulleys apart in a vice but I am worried the pot metal may be damaged. Any suggestions how to go about separating the two pulley disks?

[JPG]

I had a chance to take the SS apart today, the oil didn't help the frozen parts. The pulley plates on the 105 shaft and not budging. The wire hoop 111, roll pin, and bearing seem fine. I can see the key way on the shaft looking in-between the pulley plates but I can't see if there is any damage where the pulley meets it.

I am thinking about wedging or prying the two pulleys apart in a vice but I am worried the pot metal may be damaged. Any suggestions how to go about separating the two pulley disks?

They are soft and aluminum, but NOT pot metal.

Crud will cause them to resist moving.

Too much side force will warp them.

If you must 'pry', do so gradually and not all in one location.

You have not mentioned it, but how 'free' is the floating sheave on the motor shaft.

Are you sure the belt is not restricting the sheave movement?


Truth be told, a complete removal of the movable sheaves from the shafts is the best 'solution'. That allows complete crud removal and adequate lubrication.

[billmayo]

I have had great success (100%) using AeroKroil from Kana Labs for freeing stuck sheaves. Spray and let soak. Google AeroKroil to find where you can buy a can. I have used more than a case of the spray cans over many years. It is the best penetrating oil I have found and used. There is a great google deal from them if you have a company name to use. I just brought a few more cans for myself.

I used wooden wedges many years ago to separate rotating surfaces without too much damage. Any metal tool used can score, scratch and nick the aluminum sheave vane faces.

[jere]

They are soft and aluminum, but NOT pot metal.

Crud will cause them to resist moving.

Too much side force will warp them.

If you must 'pry', do so gradually and not all in one location.

You have not mentioned it, but how 'free' is the floating sheave on the motor shaft.

Are you sure the belt is not restricting the sheave movement?


Truth be told, a complete removal of the movable sheaves from the shafts is the best 'solution'. That allows complete crud removal and adequate lubrication.

Thanks for the correction about the metal. I guess the "sheaves" are what I was calling the pulley plates. Sorry I don't know the proper terminology, the sheave plates are what is frozen. The belts are no longer attached to the shaft. The shaft and the sheaves are out of the SS housing at the moment.