Bandsaw Squeal

[reible]

Here is the location for the video I mentioned I would do. It is very short so it will not take up too much time to watch it.

As I mentioned most of the noise in my setup is from the ceramic guide blocks. No squeal no strange noise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_-K_uwK ... e=youtu.be

It was still loading when I just checked but it should be done very soon.

Other details are listed with video.

Ed

[claimdude]

Here is the location for the video I mentioned I would do. It is very short so it will not take up too much time to watch it.

As I mentioned most of the noise in my setup is from the ceramic guide blocks. No squeal no strange noise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_-K_uwK ... e=youtu.be

It was still loading when I just checked but it should be done very soon.

Other details are listed with video.

Ed

Ed,

That sounds like mine Ed. I have the ceramic guides as well.

Jack

[reible]

Ed,

That sounds like mine Ed. I have the ceramic guides as well.

Jack

That is pretty much how bandsaws sound until you get to the ones that cost about 3 times more. I have no issue with that sound level and don't even worry about hearing protection.

Ed

[dusty]

That is pretty much how bandsaws sound until you get to the ones that cost about 3 times more. I have no issue with that sound level and don't even worry about hearing protection.

Ed

Well, not all bandsaws. If my bandsaws always sounded like that, I would be delighted.

I'll have to move my bandsaw over to the Mark V, to get away from the Power Station noise, and do another video to highlight my bandsaw squeal.

For those of you who have the quiet versions, may you never hear bandsaw squeal.

[claimdude]

Well, not all bandsaws. If my bandsaws always sounded like that, I would be delighted.

I'll have to move my bandsaw over to the Mark V, to get away from the Power Station noise, and do another video to highlight my bandsaw squeal.

For those of you who have the quiet versions, may you never hear bandsaw squeal.

Thanks Dusty! I actually have had the "squeal" and agree that it is nearly mind numbing. I fear that having openly stated mine doesn't I may have jinxed it ;-)

OBTW Dusty and All that helped, I have used my OFT with some long stock and large pieces of ply and simply don't know what took me so long to build it. Makes the table saw function a real pleasure to use!

Jack

[dusty]

[quote="claimdude"]Thanks Dusty! I actually have had the "squeal" and agree that it is nearly mind numbing. I fear that having openly stated mine doesn't I may have jinxed it ]

Now that you have experienced the benefits of an OFT, I doubt that you will ever be comfortable without one. It is so nice to be able to push stock clear through the cut area without worrying about it falling on its own. It is a safety issue as well as a convenience.

Avoid the trap though. Bigger is not necessarily better. An OFT can do just so much to improve your table saw experience.

However, I sliding cross cut table built as a companion for your outfeed table does wonders. Again, the size of a cross cut table should be mandated by the sort of work that is normally on your table saw.

EXAMPLE: If you doing nothing more than door and window casings, you don't need a cross cut table that will accommodate 24" panels. But if you work with a lot of sheet goods for items like drawer bottoms or pictures backings, a deeper table is in order.

[claimdude]

Now that you have experienced the benefits of an OFT, I doubt that you will ever be comfortable without one. It is so nice to be able to push stock clear through the cut area without worrying about it falling on its own. It is a safety issue as well as a convenience.

Avoid the trap though. Bigger is not necessarily better. An OFT can do just so much to improve your table saw experience.

However, I sliding cross cut table built as a companion for your outfeed table does wonders. Again, the size of a cross cut table should be mandated by the sort of work that is normally on your table saw.

EXAMPLE: If you doing nothing more than door and window casings, you don't need a cross cut table that will accommodate 24" panels. But if you work with a lot of sheet goods for items like drawer bottoms or pictures backings, a deeper table is in order.

Excellent points! I am building a modified Jack Bench with a custom MFT style top on it right now. As soon as it is done ( a few weeks) I will look seriously at a sliding cross cut table. I ripped some 1/8" strips off a 1x10 today and really enjoyed feeding the whole board through without having to fighht to keep it against the fence and struggle with a forever at the wrong height support table for the out feed side. Slicker than owl snot ;-)

Jack

[algale]

I used to have band saw squeal when the band saw was operating under no-load. Whoop whoop whoop. As soon as cutting began, squeal would stop. By operating the band saw with the cover off and stopping the bearings one by one I determined the squeal was coming from the lower back up bearing. But I decided to live with it.

Now, however, my squeal is totally gone only I don't understand why. I changed the tires from rubber to silicone some months back. That was because the rubber tires had taken a set and some blades did not ride all the way back on the tire and thus did not consistently sit in the autotrack bearing groove. Sometimes both autotrack bearings spun. Sometimes just one spun. And sometimes none spun. You could only see this with the cover off (until I added a window).

After changing to the silicone tires, all my blades consistently ride in the autotrack bearing groove and both autotrack bearings consistently spin. I also no longer get squealing from the lower back up bearing.

It makes no sense to me, but that's how my band saw squeal problem was solved.

(I also agree with the posts below that building an outfeed table for the table saw is essential and once you do it, you will never want to rip without one again. I think it is even better than having a helper because the outfeed table does not accidentally pull the stock away from the fence).

[BuckeyeDennis]

In post #11 in this thread, I reported that I had installed new bearings on my new-to-me bandsaw right after I bought it, and that I had experienced no squeals after about a year of all-to-occasional use. That changed a couple of weeks ago. It first began squealing for a few moments when started, and got progressively worse from there.

Today, I worked at tracking the problem down. The noise seemed to be coming from the dual Auto-Track bearings next to the blade tensioning spring. When I pressed a piece of wood against the side of the bearings, the squealing immediately stopped.

So I inspected the dual bearing set, and discovered that the outer races had some "play". By which I mean that I could either push them tightly together, or pull them apart by a few thou. Which made me suspect that the squealing was due to the bearings themselves resonating. Others have reported that the squealing goes away with new bearings, but then comes back all too soon. From this, I suspect that a full packing of grease in new bearings tends to dampen out the resonance, but that the damping effect lessens as the excess grease is lost over time.

Now I'm not a mechanical engineer, so take this with a grain of salt. But I've worked closely with several over the years, and they tell me that ball bearings are supposed to be loaded such that there is no free play, and the balls are forced to roll against the races. In the SS bandsaw application, this is not the case. The inner races are a loose slip fit on the shoulder bolt, the outer races are unconstrained, there is no axial load on the bearings, and the radial loading from the bandsaw blade is extremely light.

So I decided to add a bit of axial preload to the bearing pack. I measured the free play between the outer races at about 0.005". So for my first attempt, I used thee thicknesses of 0.002" clear packing tape between the outer races. Actually, I just cleaned the outside of the bearings with denatured alcohol, stuck pieces of tape to an entire side of the bearing, and then trimmed the tape away from the I.D. with a razor knife.

When I reassembled the bearing pack, three thicknesses of tape proved to provide a bit too much axial preload. The bearings still turned smoothly, but with more drag than I thought that the bandsaw blade could overcome. So I removed one layer of the packing tape, leaving 0.004" of total shim between the outer races. This eliminated the free play, but still allowed the bearings turn with very low drag.

At that point, I clamped the head of the shoulder bolt in a vise and used the razor knife to trim the packing tape flush with the bottom of the groove between the outer races. Then I reinstalled the Auto-Track bearing pack and fired up the bandsaw. The squealing was completely gone. The bandsaw purred like a kitten, once again.

In addition to shimming out the free play, I suspect that the packing tape has some pretty good vibration damping properties. Quick, easy, and cheap.

Chances are that there are other potential sources of squeal in a SS bandsaw. I'd guess that those include every other guide bearing, at minimum. I was lucky to catch mine when there was a problem at ony a single point.

[JPG]

IIUC, you maintained solid contact of the inner races to each other, and decreased the outer race clearance by shimming with tape.

AIUI that would decrease 'wobble' of the outer races and create a consistent width of the 'groove' between the bearings(blade 'slot') which is likely wider than when the bearings were new.

This is similar to Bill Mayo's use of shims between the home brew upper and lower blade dual bearings, but his shimmed the inner races as well thus also increasing the groove width.

My thinking is add a pop can shim or two(0.003 each) that has a clearance hole in the center to clear the inner races.

I will try that when the squeak appears.