Preping for the Double Tilt

[jsburger]

JPG, You made a statement earlier in this post that I thought was incorrect. I am here now to tell you that I was wrong. The Tube Tie Down does not force the Bench Tubes outward until they contact the holes in the castings. The ribs, of which you spoke, establish the lateral limit.

SS Teardown 003 (Large).JPG

This image, probably in addition to some you posted, show the ribs on the sides of the Bench Tubes. It also shows that the through holes are just a little bit larger than the tubes.

I am now ready for my Dual Tilt Kit. To reduce weight, I dropped the motor pan, removed it and the motor, removeds the headstock and carriage and removed the Base Arm Assembly from one end of the Tubes. The other Base Arm Assembly will come off when I am ready to install the new ones.

I said that the end casting holes were just clearance holes and that the tube position position was determined by the bosses inside the casting in this thread and you dismissed it.

http://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/viewt ... 15#p210315

Thanks JPG for reiterating what was said before.

[JPG]

The tip of the 'arrow'. Is that small added projection on the rib 1/16"?

BASE CASTING 2.jpg (6.2 KiB) Viewed 2096 times

[dusty]

I received the Double Tilt Kit today and began assembly. I will not be going much further than I am right now UNTIL I have had a chance to verify measurements. At this point I know that the Way Tubes are dead on with respect to one another. I also know that the Bench Tubes are NOT. This may be an assembly error but I am inclined to say that the dimensions of the new castings is just a tad different. Time will tell.

I am posting a picture so that ER won't have a reason to doubt the Double Tilt. It doesn't show much except that there some parts of a double tilt in my garage shop.

[algale]

Off what way?

[reible]

I'd like to know how the diagonal measurements come in, a test of squareness of the parts. You know like this:

d1.jpg (116.74 KiB) Viewed 2033 times

Ed

[dusty]

I'd like to know how the diagonal measurements come in, a test of squareness of the parts. You know like this:

d1.jpg

Ed

They measure just a hair off of 53 5/8". One diagonal is a tad long and the other short.

If you read this before this edit occurred, ignore (at least for now) what you read. I have made changes.

The diagonals now read 53 3/8" and they are the same. This will be a challenge to maintain because each time you take off a Pivot Arm there will be an opportunity for it to change. That would not be an issue IF the Pivot Arms bottomed out on the Way Tubes but they do not. I am really thinking spacers in the Way Tube holes to eliminate this.

I altered the separation between Pivot Arms as measured on the Way Tubes. I now have exactly 48" of Way Tube exposed between the Pivot Arms. This is a good number (if I don't have to make changes later) because it will be easy for me to remember. Whenever I have had the Pivot Arm removed, I will know where to locate it when I put it back on. I also now need to locate (or make) some split lock collars that fit the Way Tubes.

The Pivot Arms now fit snugly between the Pivot points which measure an exact 50" (inside to inside) between the two ends.

A Datum Addendum: With the Bench Tubes and Base Units inverted (bottom side up) I measure 48 1/16" of exposed Bench Tubes between the two Bases. I would bet, based on all my experience measuring various parts and clearances on the Shopsmith, that the specification for this is 48". I could easily make it 48" by filing a little bit off of the 'stop rib' in one of the Bases but I am not going to do that.

Also, while the undersides were exposed, I loosened the hold down bolts at one end of the Bench Tubes and applied a little downward pressure. Doing this eliminated all of the diagonal rocking that I had experienced. With that done, I believe I an through with the Bench Tubes and Base Assemblies. It is now time to remount the legs and put her back on her own feet.

Extension Tables...well they will just have to wait even though they are a major reason for why I got into this. I do not want to have a reason to dismantle anything once I have returned to operation.

[robinson46176]

I had not read this thread but just now read all of it...
Makes me very glad that I own an old Mark VII which was double tilt from the beginning. I still believe that SS would have been better off "improving and refining" the old Mark VII and keeping it in the line-up.

Dang guys, I didn't put that much worry into that quadruple bypass a couple of years ago.

Dusty, the only thing that matters is that you enjoy the challenges and the time in your shop (which is disgustingly tidy in your picture backgrounds).
While I sadly lack your patience for attention to fine detail I do appreciate all of your efforts at not only carefully studying these matters and possibilities but the effort it takes to share them with all of us. I keep learning from them and appreciate them even if I poke at you with a friendly sharp stick now and then.
If we lived a few thousand miles closer together I would probably be poking my head in to say hello once in a while.

Now I am off to a few garage sales to buy more stuff I don't need but find interesting...

[dusty]

I do not mind the poking at all but I must say that I learn as much from you as you could possibly learn from my posts.

The time that I spend on most of these projects is being done for my own entertainment and education mostly. You think the shop is tidy only because I am careful about where I point the camera. Either that or you are just being nice. The shop has been a catchall area for nearly a year now. Now that I am out there every day, I will slowly get it back to safe.

[reible]

My hypothesis when putting mine together was that for the machine to have functional ex-changeability it needed to be squared as you have done. I marked mine before I put on the headstock as you loose that ability to make the measurement easily once it is in place. When I put it back together I used those marks to reestablish the location..... I really don't know if that is needed but I figured it was worth a try.

I look forward to your end results. Still wondering if I just got lucky or if the dual tilt does allow the alignment to be good enough for extension table swapping.

Ed

[dusty]

I was a bit dissatisfied when I first started this installation but that has changed.

I have done nothing extra ordinary as I put this back together. I am thankful that I torn it down as I did. I did that to reduce the weight of any one item that I had to move around. I pulled the carriage and table, I dropped the motor pan, I removed the headstock and then, with what was left sitting atop barrels, I removed the legs. At this point, the only thing sitting there that was going to remain was the tubes.

This probably all took me a bit longer but it was fun and I didn't strain anything.

As for measuring with everything installed, consider sliding it all to one end, mark the tubes and then slide everything to the other end.

Speaking of measurements, mine have changed from what I posted. I was unable to retain the exact 48" between castings. To get the Pivot Arms to properly engage, I had to change the locations. The separation between Pivot Arms (on the Way Tubes) is now 48 1/8". That will change the diagonals too but as you said, Ed, with everything mounted there is no way to measure those now. Suffice it to say that the Way Tubes in conjunction with the Pivot Arms form a precise rectangle.

I won't get to the Extension Tables today. Hopefully tomorrow, temperatures permitting. It was over 100° in the shop yesterday and promises to be just as hot today.