10ER rebuild

[everettdavis]

I am very encouraged to read your comment that you found the MickyD's 10ER Restoration thread from the link to it from hyperlinks that I embed in photos in my document restoration and other work that share here.

It is exactly the reason I take the time to link them. I want folks to find the full story behind the photo that validates what was being discussed about the photo, and allow folks to quickly access the thread and the wealth of information that our valuable members share from their combined experience and knowledge.

You made my day by posting that little tidbit that you found something of value the hyperlink in the photo provided.

I started out embedding hyperlinks in the very first document I created here "Buying a Used Shopsmith Revisited" back in March of 2015. As that thread expanded into more content than buying, it was eventually renamed "Shopsmith Large Format Drawings, Illustrations and More" last year.

I am working sharing on more information in topics such as a "Shopsmith Motor Guide" and one based on the Original Magna Bandsaw Patent both of which are in the background among other projects I am doing.

I am not going to reveal just yet another major project I have on the active burner that will be the largest single restoration project I have done to date. I am spending extra time in it to do due diligence in it. I am working on it and anxious to share it in coming weeks.

Truly, your comments that reading what I have contributed has filled your week is gratifying.

Finding value in the hyperlinks is even more meaningful to me for I know that you are reaching very deeply into the wealth of information contributed by our brothers and sisters here in the Shopsmith Forums that have done so much to help us all.

You have made my day!

Kindest Regards,

Everett

[everettdavis]

Have you seen MickuD's restoration thread? It is encouraging and informative to say the least.

HO-LY CRAP! I didn't dig around for it, but just came across that rebuild thread from a picture linked in Everett's bearing guide. I am amazed at what he got that thing looking like from what it was.
.

Speaking of linked pictures in documents, The "Got Rust" document (like the Shopsmith Bearing Guide) also links to MickyD's 10ER thread and others, but more than that, it links externally to other valuable information outside of Shopsmith Forums to content including videos that are quite relevant to restoring Shopsmith and other equipment.

Everett

[chapmanruss]

I have the Jointer setup like yours on my Model 10ER and as you have been already cautioned these parts are rare. One nice thing about the Jointer itself is many of the parts are the same as the current Shopsmith Jointer. After the Model 4E Jointer was made it was changed to connect to the Mark 5 with the mounting tubes used for all SPT's (special purpose tools.) The only difference between the Model 4E and the Model 620 was the outfeed/base changed to use mounting tubes for the Mark 5, it still had the holes for the Model 10 mounting bracket. Mine had the threads stripped out in the quadrant and I ordered a new one from Shopsmith. That like many of the parts hasn't changed in all these years. There are changes and upgrades though. The adjusting knob to change the thickness of the cut changed along with its threaded shaft and must be replaced together. The same is true for the fence lock handle which must be replaced as a set with the special "bolt" and "nut." More recently the cutter head diameter changed along with the blade wedges. The bearings are still the same as is the blades. There have also been safety improvements like the rear blade guard behind the fence and the drive shaft guard. Use caution removing the rust from in/out feed and fence surfaces to keep them flat. Check the surface of the in/out feed tables after reassembling them with a flat edge to make sure they are even. The last one I restored, a 620 Greenie, had to be adjusted to make the in/out feed tables true. It's also the one in the picture with rust still on the fence but the tables restored. Sorry it is so cropped down, I need a new photo editing program. The pulley assembly you have for it being a separate 5" pulley from the step pulley is needed when using a speed changer so you can reverse the step pulley leaving the 5" pulley out. Anyone not using a speed changer can use a 4 step 2/3/4/5" pulley connected directly to the motor shaft. My 4E Jointer attached to my Model 10ER works just as well as my newer one connected to a Mark V.

[rjent]

I have the Jointer setup like yours on my Model 10ER and as you have been already cautioned these parts are rare. One nice thing about the Jointer itself is many of the parts are the same as the current Shopsmith Jointer. After the Model 4E Jointer was made it was changed to connect to the Mark 5 with the mounting tubes used for all SPT's (special purpose tools.) The only difference between the Model 4E and the Model 620 was the outfeed/base changed to use mounting tubes for the Mark 5, it still had the holes for the Model 10 mounting bracket. Mine had the threads stripped out in the quadrant and I ordered a new one from Shopsmith. That like many of the parts hasn't changed in all these years. There are changes and upgrades though. The adjusting knob to change the thickness of the cut changed along with its threaded shaft and must be replaced together. The same is true for the fence lock handle which must be replaced as a set with the special "bolt" and "nut." More recently the cutter head diameter changed along with the blade wedges. The bearings are still the same as is the blades. There have also been safety improvements like the rear blade guard behind the fence and the drive shaft guard. Use caution removing the rust from in/out feed and fence surfaces to keep them flat. Check the surface of the in/out feed tables after reassembling them with a flat edge to make sure they are even. The last one I restored, a 620 Greenie, had to be adjusted to make the in/out feed tables true. It's also the one in the picture with rust still on the fence but the tables restored. Sorry it is so cropped down, I need a new photo editing program. The pulley assembly you have for it being a separate 5" pulley from the step pulley is needed when using a speed changer so you can reverse the step pulley leaving the 5" pulley out. Anyone not using a speed changer can use a 4 step 2/3/4/5" pulley connected directly to the motor shaft. My 4E Jointer attached to my Model 10ER works just as well as my newer one connected to a Mark V.

Interesting post Russ. Thanks for sharing that!

Amazing that the jointer works as good, testament to a good design ....

[badtheba]

I am very encouraged to read your comment that you found the MickyD's 10ER Restoration thread from the link to it from hyperlinks that I embed in photos in my document restoration and other work that share here.

It is exactly the reason I take the time to link them. I want folks to find the full story behind the photo that validates what was being discussed about the photo, and allow folks to quickly access the thread and the wealth of information that our valuable members share from their combined experience and knowledge.

You made my day by posting that little tidbit that you found something of value the hyperlink in the photo provided.

I started out embedding hyperlinks in the very first document I created here "Buying a Used Shopsmith Revisited" back in March of 2015. As that thread expanded into more content than buying, it was eventually renamed "Shopsmith Large Format Drawings, Illustrations and More" last year.

I am working sharing on more information in topics such as a "Shopsmith Motor Guide" and one based on the Original Magna Bandsaw Patent both of which are in the background among other projects I am doing.

I am not going to reveal just yet another major project I have on the active burner that will be the largest single restoration project I have done to date. I am spending extra time in it to do due diligence in it. I am working on it and anxious to share it in coming weeks.

Truly, your comments that reading what I have contributed has filled your week is gratifying.

Finding value in the hyperlinks is even more meaningful to me for I know that you are reaching very deeply into the wealth of information contributed by our brothers and sisters here in the Shopsmith Forums that have done so much to help us all.

You have made my day!

Kindest Regards,

Everett

The pic that linked me to mickyd's restore was in the bearing guide, can't remember which pic. Being that I work in computers, I have done a bit of document and image restoration, so I have an idea of the amount of hours you've invested into this. I'm sure the SS fanatics appreciate it as much as me, but it is invaluable for us noobs. If I hadn't taken the time to read up on a few things and figure out what I was looking at, I'm sure I would have broken something by now.

By the way, I'm one of the recent ones that emailed you about Skip's survey after I joined the Yahoo user's group. I'm trying to figure out who everyone is too.

Maybe you can clarify the question I was asking earlier about bearings? If my supplier has a Fafnir brand under the original part number, are they all the same, or are there C3 and C0 versions under the same part number? I had found a seller that had the part number with the "P" prefix that stated it was C3/loose, so I knew to avoid any bearing with extra prefix/suffix. But I'm still confused as to whether you were meaning Fafnir vs inferior brand in the "what were the original bearings" doc, or, say, Fafnir 205KLL2 vs Fafnir 205KLL2 being potentially different from each other.

[badtheba]

The pulley assembly you have for it being a separate 5" pulley from the step pulley is needed when using a speed changer so you can reverse the step pulley leaving the 5" pulley out. Anyone not using a speed changer can use a 4 step 2/3/4/5" pulley connected directly to the motor shaft. My 4E Jointer attached to my Model 10ER works just as well as my newer one connected to a Mark V.

Great info there, thanks for pointing the reversal out. Anything to alleviate later confusion. I'm watching the only speed changer on eBay right now, but with a few bids on it already I think it'll go out of my price range.

[badtheba]

While I wait for my rust dissolver to get off the delivery truck today, I actually did more on the jointer than any of the rest of the machine, as it seemed easiest to start on for now. I ordered those bearings (rubber sealed versions this time) and cleaned up the cutter head. If I tape off the surfaces that the blades and wedges seat against, and the shaft bearing seats, can I paint the cutter head itself?

[chapmanruss]

The Speed Changers always go for a high price on ebay. I could have made some money if I sold them there too. Instead mine sell with the restored Model 10 it came with and I add about $50 to the price. You might be better off watching your local ads like craigslist to find one with a Model 10 for a reasonable price. The most recent one I got for restoration was on the last day of an estate sale and it was free although it didn't have a speed changer it is on the metal bench ends with retractable casters. The Shopsmith retractable casters are pretty pricey on ebay too. In the mean time you are not limited to three speeds as the manual states. Buy realigning the upper or lower pulley a 1/2" you can add four more speeds. That lines up the 3" and 4" pulleys or the 2" and 3" pulleys. See the PDF (I hope it comes through). Good luck

[chapmanruss]

I do not see any reason you could not paint the cutter head as long as you keep the blade/wedge area and shaft ends clear for the blades, wedges & bearings. I restored my 4E Jointer over three years ago and the cutter head still looks new. I keep it stored with a Shopsmith Jointer Cover on it and it is still free of rust. Remember waxing any bare metal surface will help keep rust away. I do not remember if I waxed the cutter head but the table and fence surfaces have been done a few times now. I'll have to remember to wax the cutter head the next time I remove the blades. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

[everettdavis]

I am very encouraged to read your comment that you found the MickyD's 10ER Restoration thread from the link to it from hyperlinks that I embed in photos in my document restoration and other work that share here.

It is exactly the reason I take the time to link them. I want folks to find the full story behind the photo that validates what was being discussed about the photo, and allow folks to quickly access the thread and the wealth of information that our valuable members share from their combined experience and knowledge.

You made my day by posting that little tidbit that you found something of value the hyperlink in the photo provided.

I started out embedding hyperlinks in the very first document I created here "Buying a Used Shopsmith Revisited" back in March of 2015. As that thread expanded into more content than buying, it was eventually renamed "Shopsmith Large Format Drawings, Illustrations and More" last year.

I am working sharing on more information in topics such as a "Shopsmith Motor Guide" and one based on the Original Magna Bandsaw Patent both of which are in the background among other projects I am doing.

I am not going to reveal just yet another major project I have on the active burner that will be the largest single restoration project I have done to date. I am spending extra time in it to do due diligence in it. I am working on it and anxious to share it in coming weeks.

Truly, your comments that reading what I have contributed has filled your week is gratifying.

Finding value in the hyperlinks is even more meaningful to me for I know that you are reaching very deeply into the wealth of information contributed by our brothers and sisters here in the Shopsmith Forums that have done so much to help us all.

You have made my day!

Kindest Regards,

Everett

The pic that linked me to mickyd's restore was in the bearing guide, can't remember which pic. Being that I work in computers, I have done a bit of document and image restoration, so I have an idea of the amount of hours you've invested into this. I'm sure the SS fanatics appreciate it as much as me, but it is invaluable for us noobs. If I hadn't taken the time to read up on a few things and figure out what I was looking at, I'm sure I would have broken something by now.

By the way, I'm one of the recent ones that emailed you about Skip's survey after I joined the Yahoo user's group. I'm trying to figure out who everyone is too.

Maybe you can clarify the question I was asking earlier about bearings? If my supplier has a Fafnir brand under the original part number, are they all the same, or are there C3 and C0 versions under the same part number? I had found a seller that had the part number with the "P" prefix that stated it was C3/loose, so I knew to avoid any bearing with extra prefix/suffix. But I'm still confused as to whether you were meaning Fafnir vs inferior brand in the "what were the original bearings" doc, or, say, Fafnir 205KLL2 vs Fafnir 205KLL2 being potentially different from each other.

I think you mean 202KLL3 (Quill Bearings 102-18) opposed to 205KLL3 (Drive Sleeve Bearings 102-21) which are indeed different specs.

I never have wrapped my head around why only one end was precision, but that is what they did. Precision C0 on the quill side, and C3 (motor grade bearings) on the auxiliary spindle.


I suspect that it was that they only measured run-out on the quill and any quill with greater than 0.0015" run-out were rejected as out of tolerance.

That Western Machinery and Steel World article from January 1951 stated: “The headstock is one of the most precise, frictionless and efficient transmitters of power in general use today” and “Axial and radial thrust are accommodated by high-precision ground steel ball bearings mounted individually in the quill.”

Changes through the years in ownership has changed numbering and that has complicated matters some for bearings of that physical dimension that are used in many other applications in industry that does not require those tolerances.

Here's what I bought the last time I ordered the quill bearings.
https://www.motionindustries.com/produc ... u=00051563

I am not endorsing this seller per-se, but with that link you can request that whatever vendor you choose validate the bearings they intend to sell you are that spec. 202KLL3 - Radial/Deep Groove Ball Bearing-Metric - 16 mm ID, 35 mm OD, 14.4 mm Width, Double Seal, C0.

Everett