Total Unacceptable Prices

[reible]

I have a small list of part that I was thinking about ordering from shopsmith, well I was until I looked at the prices.

It looks like every screw/nut/spacer are all at least $3.95 each. I'm sorry but that is just not right.

To get the hardware I need for mounting the front and rear rails on a 520 table and the knobs and spring for the rails here is what it would take:

Knobs need 4 at 3.95 = $15.80
Springs need 4 at 3.95 = $15.80
Spacers need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Screws need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Washers need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Nuts need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70

That adds up to $126.40!!!!!!!

Need less to say there will be no order from me.

Ed

[jsburger]

I have a small list of part that I was thinking about ordering from shopsmith, well I was until I looked at the prices.

It looks like every screw/nut/spacer are all at least $3.95 each. I'm sorry but that is just not right.

To get the hardware I need for mounting the front and rear rails on a 520 table and the knobs and spring for the rails here is what it would take:

Knobs need 4 at 3.95 = $15.80
Springs need 4 at 3.95 = $15.80
Spacers need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Screws need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Washers need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70
Nuts need 6 at 3.95 = $23.70

That adds up to $126.40!!!!!!!

Need less to say there will be no order from me.

Ed

I couldn't agree with you more Ed. Most of your list is common hardware. A good hardware store like ACE or a True Value store that carries their full line of specialty hardware should have what is needed. The only thing that might not be out of line price wise is the knobs. The other thing might be the spacers of proper length.

[dusty]

I'll be waiting to hear what that "common hardware" cost in a hardware store.

The description here could be misleading.

[garys]

Here's another way to look at it. Good quality hardware will last a lifetime and a few more lifetimes after that. Consider what your cell phone costs and will it last even a couple of years?
Suddenly, that nice hardware looks cheap.

[JPG]

Here's another way to look at it. Good quality hardware will last a lifetime and a few more lifetimes after that. Consider what your cell phone costs and will it last even a couple of years?
Suddenly, that nice hardware looks cheap.

That simply is not 'fair'. You are comparing very simple things to very complex things.

Hardware screws, nuts bolts etc. are simply made and a highly reliable(durable, not prone to failure other than from over stressing) component whereas cell phones are highly complex devices that literally have thousands of components that are each susceptible to failure in addition to over stressing.

Hardware is supposed to be inexpensive basis stuff.

Now there are parts that are not 'common' and hence more costly due to their uniqueness(special design/low production).

IMO hardware is the big box stores is overpriced, but most long gone 'true' hardware stores folded because one cannot pay the rent selling nickel and dime screws, nuts, bolts.

In the past 0.80 was high.

3.95 is gouging.

Do not get me started on shipping by "if it fits it ships priority mail" for a few screws that would go by 'normal' first class for a buck or so.

[garys]

I feel the comparison is very fair. It comes down to value for your dollar. Any product that is expensive and has a short life is not worth the cost. A low priced item that lasts forever gives you the value for your dollar. My Shopsmith is solid and dependable and all the parts on it are the same. It is now 35 years old and still working great. Try to imagine what a 35 year old electronic device would be today, and add up the cost of maintaining one for 35 years, and you see that these small Shopsmith parts are a real bargain.

[beeg]

I'll be waiting to hear what that "common hardware" cost in a hardware store.

The description here could be misleading.

"common hardware"

Depends upon what your talking about. Up to a #14 screw or nut, I can buy those for 25 cents or less at my local Ace.

[thunderbirdbat]

I had to go through this not long ago and this is what I found. I ended up ordering some of the items from SS and either had some of them or purchased the others locally.

I am not sure how common 1/4 - 20 x 1 1/4" hex drive flat head screws are but the washers and nuts for them are very common so I can agree those are over priced. McMaster-Carr lists the bolts at $8.74 + shipping for a package of 50.

The spacers are probably priced about right. Without measuring them with closely to determine their actual specs they are about 3/8" which McMaster-Carr sells for $3.37 each.

The knobs are standard 1/4 -20 x 3/4" studded plastic knobs so maybe a little over priced but not much.

The springs are probably a conical compression springs so maybe priced about right, hard to tell without the specs.

[reible]

Here's another way to look at it. Good quality hardware will last a lifetime and a few more lifetimes after that. Consider what your cell phone costs and will it last even a couple of years?
Suddenly, that nice hardware looks cheap.

So the next time you go to the local hardware to get a few screw/bolts/nuts and the bins are marked $3.95 each you will be fine with it?

Ed

[everettdavis]

Not to take it too far down an off topic bunny trail but I have seen the prices going up as well.

I know that going to Ace or Lowe’s, Home Depot that I can find a nut, bolt, washer and screw hopefully the size and thread I need. I have noticed in recent years the quality has gone down. Deck screws I used to buy for 10% of what I pay now are not as strong and break off when being tightened or break when being loosened.

I went to Lubbock Nut and Bolt to get better quality and paid a premium price but got better quality. The discussion we had was over the quality of the various importers and the effects of globalization taking manufacturing to countries where the quality of the metals used were substantially less.

He used the example of weaker Chinese steel to illustrate his point. Two buildings on his family’s coastal properties were built using the same plans 15 years apart as they expanded.

When Texas was hit by Harvey, the original building weathered it with very little damage and the newer building cororgated steel panels were torn half and screws broke off and let them fly through the air.

As they recovered they took some samples of the materials from both buildings being repaired to the mechanical engineering department where one of the kids was taking classes

Tests indicated serious differences in the steel and The fasteners strength. The professor commented that these kinds of issues are seen in places today that affect architects and engineers alike as strength rating stamped on modern materials imported suggests once rating but don’t meet it in lab testing.

The highest quality bolts are at a premium cost and have foreign FOB Freight on Board costs to import the to America. The lesser quality have same freight cost and are only marginally cheaper so batch testing steel fasteners and structural steel has never been needed more to achieve design specifications are met or exceeded.

Costs have risen dramatically. Shopsmith buy American Made materials for every component they can. Obviously the New Zealand DVR motor is an exception.

Some folks stick an order processing fee out the door with every order. Others average it across item and raise the price. I don’t know what they do now.

Even in the 1940’s they listed nuts bolts and screws as a local hardware item.

I don’t see that being different much today. I will say their quality will be about the best available. Not always true in retail. Price some of these items through Fastenal and you may find similar prices

Everett