10ER Double Tilt idea

larryhrockisland

I had an idea for a way to have double tilt on a 10ER without modifying any shopsmith parts and I had too much time at my pc and it's raining. It's based on plans in Popular Mechanics, Aug 1967, pp148. You can read it on Google Books if you haven't seen yet.

https://books.google.com/books?id=rtMDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA148&dq=popular+mechanics+upgrade+shopsmith&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjnwY6f5rzhAhWO_J4KHUUcAxsQ6AEIKjAA#v=onepage&q=popular%20mechanics%20upgrade%20shopsmith&f=false

Comments and critiques welcome! Do you think it will be top heavy and want to tip over? I thing the 10ER will run at 6800 rpm with the factory pulleys and no speed changer.

Shopsmith 10ER double tilt2.pdf

JPG

larryhrockisland wroteI had an idea for a way to have double tilt on a 10ER without modifying any shopsmith parts and I had too much time at my pc and it's raining. It's based on plans in Popular Mechanics, Aug 1967, pp148. You can read it on Google Books if you haven't seen yet.

https://books.google.com/books?id=rtMDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA148&dq=popular+mechanics+upgrade+shopsmith&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjnwY6f5rzhAhWO_J4KHUUcAxsQ6AEIKjAA#v=onepage&q=popular%20mechanics%20upgrade%20shopsmith&f=false

Comments and critiques welcome! Do you think it will be top heavy and want to tip over? I thing the 10ER will run at 6800 rpm with the factory pulleys and no speed changer.

Well it looks good for a Mark 2. Now where ya gonna get bench tubes for a 10?

Whoops - missed the second link. Yes I would be concerned re top weight in drill press mode. I would make sure the footprint is large enough. interesting idea. What do you intend to use for hinges?

larryhrockisland

Leave the original 10 mounted to the original bench boards. Mount that entire unit to the new shorter bench with the original leg set mounted to the new bench. The original 10 would be 1.5" taller. The original 10, bench and all, tips up to the left but when down the drill press works like always. Does that help? Can't say much for my descriptive skills...

larryhrockisland

Whoops - missed the second link. Yes I would be concerned re top weight in drill press mode. I would make sure the footprint is large enough. interesting idea. What do you intend to use for hinges?[/quote]

I wouldn't think the drill press mode would be any different than original, it pivots on its base like always. I was worried about the under table setup wanting to pull unit over and wondered if the plywood legs would need to extend farther left?

JPG

Closer look makes the hinge ? moot.

I think the legs (left) should extend beyond the CG of the 'lowered' headstock etc.. The drawing does seem a bit short.

Are you sure re 6800 rpm without SC? I think 2x motor rpm is correct.

jsburger

larryhrockisland wroteWhoops - missed the second link. Yes I would be concerned re top weight in drill press mode. I would make sure the footprint is large enough. interesting idea. What do you intend to use for hinges?

I wouldn't think the drill press mode would be any different than original, it pivots on its base like always. I was worried about the under table setup wanting to pull unit over and wondered if the plywood legs would need to extend farther left?[/quote]

I don't think there should be a problem. You still have the full length original bench just as in the drill press mode. Plus when tilted left you have the added length of the tilt assembly on the floor and tilted left the weight is much lower.

JPG

Height does not affect tipping until the CG is beyond the pivot.

Ignoring operator induced forces.

larryhrockisland

JPG wroteCloser look makes the hinge ? moot.

I think the legs (left) should extend beyond the CG of the 'lowered' headstock etc.. The drawing does seem a bit short.

Are you sure re 6800 rpm without SC? I think 2x motor rpm is correct.

By moot do you mean pretty much any hinge system would work? I agree, I just have commercial grade 4.5x4.5 butt hinges on hand.

I pretty much just lined up the end of the plywood extension with the end of the existing bench so as to keep the footprint about the same. That put the left end 5" beyond center line of the way tubes. Another 3" would get it about to the center of the spindle. I wouldn't know how to figure the CG. I assumed (I know, never do that) that the motor and headstock pretty much cancelled each other out and the weight would be down the way tubes so to speak, but I don't know any of the weights.

You are correct, I misread the owners manual, it is 6800 with the SC.

chapmanruss

Interesting idea for the Model 10's.

For those wanting a double tilt Mark 2 there is a different way than building a wood "Mark VII" bench as shown in the article. We had a discussion about this a while back.https://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/beginning-woodworking-f6/just-bought-a-mark-2-t21811-s10.html It requires getting a second headrest end to replace the base/arm side and shorting the way tubes 3-1/2" to move the headrest end inward to the same distance from the end of the bench as the base end. For those with wood bench "tubes" you can replace the wood with 3-1/2" longer stock to move the bench end out so it the same on both ends. It will than work similar to the new Mark 7 for double tilt.

Larry said

You are correct, I misread the owners manual, it is 6800 with the SC.

Yes, the highest speed without a speed changer, a different RPM motor or changing pulleys is 3450 RPM's or double the motor speed. Below is a PDF of the 7 speeds with the stock pulleys for the Model 10's.EDIT: This is a chart I created a while back. It uses the same idea as the Mark 2 for different speeds by changing the pulley match-ups.

Table of Speeds Model 10s.pdf

larryhrockisland

chapmanruss wrote Yes, the highest speed without a speed changer, a different RPM motor or changing pulleys is 3450 RPM's or double the motor speed. Below is a PDF of the 7 speeds with the stock pulleys for the Model 10's.Table of Speeds Model 10s.pdf

Thanks for the chart. I didn't have that one.

rpd

This has come up before. :)

https://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/maintenance-and-repair-f10/double-tilt-10er--t21075.html#p245470

I think your base should work fine. For the left tilt position the table will need to be modified. It won't pivot 90 deg in that direction, and reversing it in the carriage results in the tie bar interfering with the spindle. There are pictures in the thread above that I copied from the yahoo group that show a table modification/solution.

larryhrockisland

rpd wrote
This has come up before. 🙂

https://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/maintenance-and-repair-f10/double-tilt-10er--t21075.html#p245470

I think your base should work fine. For the left tilt position the table will need to be modified. It won't pivot 90 deg in that direction, and reversing it in the carriage results in the tie bar interfering with the spindle. There are pictures in the thread above that I copied from the yahoo group that show a table modification/solution.

Thanks, I didn't remember seeing that one. I came up with a table using my old craftsman router table, parts from my 510 to 520 upgrade, aluminum angle from my brother and 1" tubes from old store fixtures.

JPG

Oh I DO like folks who's brains wander outside the box!!!!

larryhrockisland

JPG wroteOh I DO like folks who's brains wander outside the box!!!!

Thanks, even if I don't do the double tilt I got a router table set up out of the exercise. :D :D :D