Which to choose...?

[nduanetesh]

Hi all. I've been looking locally for a Shopsmith, and have found a handful of likely contenders. I need help making a choice...

Option 1: Shopsmith Mark V 510, built in 1989 (according to the serial number), with jointer and bandsaw. This machine is essentially brand new. The seller says his father bought it and "probably only turned it on once or twice". He said his father did a lot of buying tools that he never used. It's all very clean and looks like it just rolled off the factory floor. No rust. Price is $900, but I think I could get him to $800. Missing are the horizontal tubes that hold the floating tables.

Option 2: Shopsmith Mark V 510, built in 1992 (according to the serial number), with jointer and bandsaw. Also has parts of a lathe duplicator, and I saw a housing that looked like it was for a grinding wheel(?) though I didn't see the stone anywhere. This machine is well used, and has lots of extra pieces of this and that around (push bars, feather boards, etc). Everything on it needs lubrication and cleaning. Has some slight surface rust here and there, e.g. the band saw drive shaft, and the drill chuck. Jointer blades look great and are sharp. Price is $700 firm.

Option 3: Shopsmith Mark 7 (with PowerPro headstock). This machine is BRAND NEW. Bough at an estate sale, many of the parts and accessories are in the original plastic. Seller says it's never been used. I haven't seen it in person (it's a long drive), but the sellers says they have ALL of the parts. No extras (so, no jointer or bandsaw). Price is $3,500, FIRM.

My thoughts: option 3 is more than I want to spend, but I can't deny the appeal of getting a new Mark 7 at a huge discount. The jointer and bandsaw are important to me though, and the Mark 7 doesn't include them. Is it worth the huge price difference when I could get along just fine with a Mark V? Looking at the two Mark V options, the 1992 option has a "C" headstock (it has a red plastic switch with safety key), whereas the 1989 one has the previous version of the headstock (with the metal toggle switch). Other than the switch, is there any other difference in those headstocks? Was there a mechanical revision that gives the newer one any sort of advantage? If the headstocks are essentially the same, I'm probably more inclined to go with the older (but nearly new condition) 510.

I welcome any thoughts, inputs, or advice. Thanks!

PS, this will be my first Shopsmith. All three options include the manuals.

[RFGuy]

Welcome to the forum! I'll let others give feedback, but just to clarify are you sure that option 3 is a Mark VII? Could it be a Mark 7? Sorry, I know it is confusing, but the Mark VII is an older machine and Mark 7 is the more recent one that has the PowerPro headstock. Hard to believe an older Mark VII would sell for $3500, but you never know! A barely used Mark 7 could be reasonably listed for almost the new price though...

[nduanetesh]

Thanks for pointing this out. It's a Mark 7, with a PowerPro headstock. I'm still figuring out when Shopsmith uses Roman numerals or Arabic numerals. I'll edit the original post to correct it. Thanks!

Welcome to the forum! I'll let others give feedback, but just to clarify are you sure that option 3 is a Mark VII? Could it be a Mark 7? Sorry, I know it is confusing, but the Mark VII is an older machine and Mark 7 is the more recent one that has the PowerPro headstock. Hard to believe an older Mark VII would sell for $3500, but you never know! A barely used Mark 7 could be reasonably listed for almost the new price though...

[RFGuy]

Thanks for pointing this out. It's a Mark 7, with a PowerPro headstock. I'm still figuring out when Shopsmith uses Roman numerals or Arabic numerals. I'll edit the original post to correct it. Thanks!

Yeah, I know it is confusing and it makes sense that it is a Mark 7 for that price. I'll give some quick feedback, but hopefully others will give their viewpoints in more detail. First, do you know what kind of woodworking you intend to do with this purchase, e.g. what types of projects you hope to accomplish? Take my feedback with a grain of salt because I am not shy about pointing out the high prices for the PowerPro headstock and correspondingly the Mark 7, so I am not a fan of it. I have never owned a PowerPro, but have played around with it on someone else's machine. IF you intend to do A LOT of woodturning, especially making bowls or other large turnings then you might want to spring for the Mark 7. It's low speed ability and the option to reverse (for sanding woodturnings) is definitely a plus. You can still do this on a Mark V (minus the reverse option) but you will likely want the speed reducer from Shopsmith to get to the low range speeds. The Mark 7 also has a more powerful motor so if you are sawing thick lumber it will be more effortless than a standard Mark V, though it is more costly (both up front, but also when the power supply module or LCD module break and need to be replaced). With my Mark V and a sharp sawblade, I have cut 8/4 cherry regularly with no problems so it isn't that you can't use the Mark V for this as well, but the PowerPro won't break a sweat with thick hardwoods. In comparison a Mark V with proper maintenance can last a long, long time and repairs are much more affordable. Some owners use their Shopsmith for routing, but I do not. I much prefer a standalone router table. IF you intend to use this purchase for routing, you may prefer going with the Mark 7 for the additional power for routing and using shaper cutters on it. Anyway, just some quick thoughts, but wanted to give you some things to think about.

[nduanetesh]

First, do you know what kind of woodworking you intend to do with this purchase, e.g. what types of projects you hope to accomplish?

I probably should have mentioned this in the original post. I am an amateur luthier (guitar builder), so I see myself getting a lot of use out of the band saw, drill press, and jointer in particular. I do have some interest in trying my hand at making wooden bowls and mugs/drinking vessels. I am also a generally handy guy and in projects around the house I could definitely use a table saw. I have a small routing table (which I bought used and haven't had the chance to use yet), and a standalone planer. Space in my shop is limited, so I like the idea of getting lots of uses out of a single tool, though with something like a planer I ask myself if having a shopsmith planer that sits in a corner when it's not mounted and in use would actually be saving me any space.

The point you raise about maintenance/repair costs on the Mark 7 is something I've been thinking about too. To be honest, I think I'm really deciding between the Mark Vs. If the overwhelming opinion here was "you'd be crazy not to get that Mark 7!!" then I could be talked into it, but it's a lot more cost and I'd still have to buy a jointer and a bandsaw (which I've found locally for $150 each--putting my total cost at $3,800 for the whole shebang). I think for seven or eight hundred I'd probably be pretty happy with a Mark V.

BTW, thanks for the insight on the advantages of the PowerPro.

[RFGuy]

I probably should have mentioned this in the original post. I am an amateur luthier (guitar builder), so I see myself getting a lot of use out of the band saw, drill press, and jointer in particular. I do have some interest in trying my hand at making wooden bowls and mugs/drinking vessels. I am also a generally handy guy and in projects around the house I could definitely use a table saw. I have a small routing table (which I bought used and haven't had the chance to use yet), and a standalone planer. Space in my shop is limited, so I like the idea of getting lots of uses out of a single tool, though with something like a planer I ask myself if having a shopsmith planer that sits in a corner when it's not mounted and in use would actually be saving me any space.

The point you raise about maintenance/repair costs on the Mark 7 is something I've been thinking about too. To be honest, I think I'm really deciding between the Mark Vs. If the overwhelming opinion here was "you'd be crazy not to get that Mark 7!!" then I could be talked into it, but it's a lot more cost and I'd still have to buy a jointer and a bandsaw (which I've found locally for $150 each--putting my total cost at $3,800 for the whole shebang). I think for seven or eight hundred I'd probably be pretty happy with a Mark V.

BTW, thanks for the insight on the advantages of the PowerPro.

I forgot to point out the table systems. Do you know if either of the Mark V's have the 520 table system? The double tilt bases and the table system could also be differences between the Mark 7 and the Mark V's you are looking at. I have the 520 table system on my Mark V, but it was an expensive upgrade. Worth every penny to me, but the 510 is a good table system as well and some forum members prefer the 510 table system over the 520 table. I have the Mark V mounted planer and it is a beast (heavy) to lift on/off the waytubes, but it works very well and is high quality. IF space is a premium there is no reason why you can't buy a good quality lunchbox style planer instead. Another option for planing, if you are primarily a luthier, is to get a product like the Safe-T-Planer from Stewmac (a site you should know about as a luthier) and chuck it in the drillpress (https://www.stewmac.com/luthier-tools-a ... -t-planer/). I hear these work quite well, though they they scare me a bit. I bought my Mark V brand new and it was A LOT cheaper then (even accounting for inflation), so from a value standpoint you really can't beat the used prices on Mark V's out there in the marketplace. Not saying the Mark 7 doesn't have a place, but just trying to help you to understand the pros and cons of each.

[nduanetesh]

I forgot to point out the table systems. Do you know if either of the Mark V's have the 520 table system?

Both of the Vs have the 510 table system. Both are missing the horizontal tubes for the floating tables, but have the telescoping support tubes. I guess the horizontal tube just look like pipes so people who don't know aren't careful to keep them around.

There's a local seller who has the 520 table system for sale for $500, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. My understanding is it would mostly be useful for table saw use. Is that correct?

And yes, Stew Mac has a LOT of my money, lol. I have their Safe-T-Planer, but haven't been able to use it yet due to lack of a drill press. Soon, though!

[JPG]

#2 less $$$ plus two SPTs.

JMHO

Almost new #1 has minimal advantage.

[RFGuy]

Both of the Vs have the 510 table system. Both are missing the horizontal tubes for the floating tables, but have the telescoping support tubes. I guess the horizontal tube just look like pipes so people who don't know aren't careful to keep them around.

There's a local seller who has the 520 table system for sale for $500, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. My understanding is it would mostly be useful for table saw use. Is that correct?

And yes, Stew Mac has a LOT of my money, lol. I have their Safe-T-Planer, but haven't been able to use it yet due to lack of a drill press. Soon, though!

The 510 table system is a good system, but the 520 has a beefier and more stable (IMHO) fence. IF you are familiar with a tablesaw Biesemeyer style fence the 520 fence has a similar heft and feel. I always had alignment issues/movement with my 510 fence and didn't like it as well, but my Dad has been happy with his 510 for decades and other members here like the 510 table/fence so I would say try it first and see what you think. Try it first before contemplating the 520 upgrade. I don't think you can go wrong with either, i.e. it isn't necessarily a negative that it comes with the 510 fence and table system. Yeah the connector tubes are used for holding up the floating tables, but also for making the main tablesaw table more rigid by connecting it to the Aux table. Without it there is some small amount of play to the main table of the Mark V/7. You can either buy them or use pipe if you want. Some have used the appropriate size of EMT conduit, but others have upgraded by buying metal tubing online (TGP, etc.).

[nduanetesh]

#2 less $$$ plus two SPTs.

Sorry, but what are SPTs?