Shopsmith Forums

If you are able to get it, from your local library, check out the PBS video "Is Wal-Mart Good for America?" I just showed it to my Economics class. It really brought home the fact that as long as consumers look for the lowest cost goods, we will continue to see a huge trade deficit with China. As consumers, we really need to ask ourselves the question whether or not we are willing as a society to pay higher prices for consumer goods for the sake of preserving U.S. jobs? Although it is my assumption that we here in this forum would readiliy answer yes, what about the rest of the U.S. consumer market? I don't mind free trade with other nations as long as it is FAIR trade. I recently heard on the radio that this year the U.S. will be importing wheat for the first time. Why? Because we're too busy figuring out ways to use trade food production for fuel production.

We are doing the same thing in this country that we did when we were colonies: sending raw material to another country and then buying back the finished goods. With national elections this year, maybe its time that we look at those that we are sending to Congress to represent us and elect someone else that will be more viligilant in protecting U.S. production. While we can certainly blame others for our production woes (unions, corporate greed, cost of employee benefits, finite resources, etc.), it is ultimately the consumer who holds the final decision where goods will be produced since they will ususally pick the lower cost item. If this seems like a rant to you, so be it. All I can do is to look where the item I buy is produced and ,if it is domestically produced, purchase that item. I don't know of any other way to fix the problem.

BPR

Hi All
I already vented on this in the other thread so I will be brief here.

The problem in this country is Greed. We have insisted on higher wages without increased production and higher prices without increased quality or performance.

What made this country great once was increased production resulted in increased wages. Also increased production resulted in lower costs. Then everyone got greedy.

Corporations wanted to increase profitability without increase production, improved manufacturing technique or quality. Workers wanted increased wages without increased product and often less work.

Result our products are priced higher than the same product can be made in another country using either better manufacturing techniques, lower labor, higher production or a combination of all three.

I come from a family of many generations of steel production. I have seen greed effect both the corporation and the workers. Steel manufacturing in this country is virtually gone, but while it was still here it was made the same way it was 100 years ago, while steel in other countries was made by different and in most case superior cheaper ways. Workers got paid increasingly high wages and benefits while actual production actually fell. Net result the steel industry is a disappearing shadow of what it once was.

Today a company can mine the ore in Minn. ship it to the west coast, ship it across the pacific, have it manufactured into steel, shipped back across the pacific ocean, shipped across this country for cheaper than they can buy steel made here. Reason inferior steel production techniques and high wages and high profit demands.

Or a shopsmith?

scottss wrote:Or a shopsmith?

I hope and pray Shopsmith management doesn't circum to the bean counters and sacrifice "Made in the USA" on the altar of make a buck.

Personally I think running a tighter ship, looking for innovative ways of increasing production, and coming out with new and needed additions can and will make Shopsmith profitable.

I'm sure the idea has entered their head and I'm equally sure it looks tempting. But I can say with certainity that if I can help it I will not willing buy anything made in China. I believe that might well be the bullet that finishes Shopsmith off.

What must be focused on is quality. The Festool products prove that people will pay for quality. It is hard to imagine anyone buying a circular saw for $400yet they sell a ton. Why because they have a name known for quality.

Ed in Tampa wrote: What must be focused on is quality. The Festool products prove that people will pay for quality. It is hard to imagine anyone buying a circular saw for $400 yet they sell a ton. Why because they have a name known for quality.

I would guess that the vast majority of the Festool customers are ones who can write off their tools as an equipment expense and/or depreciate the cost or a period of time.

I went to Woodcraft with it in mind to but a Festool circular saw and guide. I came home with all my money still in pocket. It's a sweet tool and it does what they advertise, even the dust collection but I can't afford that. I went to Ace and bought two new blades for my ancient Skil saw and a long piece of 1/4" thick aluminum to use for a straight edge.

As a footnote: The Shopsmith is proof that people will pay for quality.

What must be focused on is quality. The Festool products prove that people will pay for quality. It is hard to imagine anyone buying a circular saw for $400yet they sell a ton. Why because they have a name known for quality.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but this makes me wonder where the Sand Flee is made? Anyone know?

"...where the Sand Flee is made? Anyone know?"

New Jersey. It's in America, I'm pretty sure.

With all good wishes,

Nick wrote:"...where the Sand Flee is made? Anyone know?"

New Jersey. It's in America, I'm pretty sure.

With all good wishes,

They way they talk, I wouldn't be so sure.

This is a very touchy subject and everyone needs to be careful what is said in this thread. It seems China is the one being put in question more than any other country, but what about our own country?

It is U.S. companies that have sent most of their production overseas, due to the savings and profits they will make by doing so. Ever ask why they really do this?
A good part of this is due to the workforce. The cost of living in this country is much higher than it was just 30 years ago. Remember when you could by a home for $50,000? A majority of our population couldn't survive on what they make if it wasn't for the cheaper prices made available from foreign made products.

My father bought a 35 acre olive and orange orchard/farm for $55,000 in 1975. Ten years later, he actually had to work an extra job to cover the bills because he couldn't make enough selling the olives and oranges. The labor/materials alone needed to run the farm nearly ruined him, and he and our family did most of the work. The labor I am talking about is having the produce harvested and the irrigation, sprays, etc. needed to make a farm of this type function.

Needless to say, small family farms like this do not exist anymore, at least not in this part of the country. He finally did sell the farm, to a corporation that was buying up all the small farms in the area and turning them all into one large corporate farming operation. Most of the raw fruit is now sent overseas (mostly Japan) to turn it into olive oil and orange juice. Some of this end product actually makes its way back here to be sold in supermarkets.

What I am getting at is that most of todays U.S. workforce would not be able to survive without the cheaper prices that overseas products cost. Most of our workforce unfortunately does not have the skills to perform some of these jobs. Also, many do not want to make a living doing the manual labor it takes for most jobs. Long gone are most of the assembly line work that was so common just years ago. I worked at a company that made yarn for carpet in the early 80's, and it was an assembly line. The company moved overseas 10 years ago.

Our workforce that is skilled in the trades (electrical, plumbing, carpentry, etc.) is shrinking by the day. Most contractors have to put you on a waiting list to get work done because the workforce isn't their for them to hire. Why do you think you pay a plumber $200-$300 an hour. This kind of work has actually become specialties, instead of common jobs just 25 years ago.

I live in central CA. All but one school that I know of has dropped their shop classes, when they use to be commonplace. The schools actually put more effort into their sports programs. An example (and this is a CA university). Fresno State University held a student election last week asking for a fee increase per semester. The ballot measure asked students to accept a fee increase of $90.00 per semester. The fee was divided up into two parts: $60.00 for the sports programs, and $30.00 for academic programs. It was voted "NO". Thank goodness. But now the school's adminstrators are wanting to overturn the election and do the fee increase anyway. This is a good example of the type of thinking that is going on. Only 12% of the school's student body are actually envolved with the sports program.

Even the schools are making it harder to find a decent workforce. The students are taught that sports are more important than making a decent living. They are taught that having a labor intensive job is no way to make a living. They are taught to let the foreigners in our country do that kind of work, or better yet, send the work overseas.

It is the U.S. companies that send the work there. But the odd thing is, there are foreign automobile companies that are actually starting to build plants here in the U.S. to have their cars built. Is this the trend to come? Will the people of China and other countries be reading labels on products that say "Made in the U.S.A." and be saying the same thing, "I will only buy products made in China".

Everyone wants a decent price on what they purchase. But when that country doesn't have the workforce to make the item, where do you turn?

Woodburner
For the most part you have a point. However China unlike most other countries we trade with is a declared enemy of the US. The have sworn they will destroy us. And for some reason everyone has forgotten that threat.

Either they forgot, they didn't care, or they think China is bluffing. Personally I think China is getting us right where they want us, by our financial throat and then they will slowly choke us to death.

I may be wrong but I they start offering Chinese language training class it might not be a bad idea to take them.

Ed