Page 2 of 2
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:43 am
by Ed in Tampa
I would love to see a test of any of these “protection devices” by dropping a hot dog ONTO the spinning blade.
I believe there are many saw injuries where the user feed his hand into the blade. However I think the highest percentage of injuries occur when the users hand falls onto the blade, due to kickback, tripping near the saw, losing balance while using the saw, or trying to catch something falling toward the blade, or slipping shoving hand into blade.
I think significant damage will result from such a test.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:59 am
by RFGuy
Ed in Tampa wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:43 am
I would love to see a test of any of these “protection devices” by dropping a hot dog ONTO the spinning blade.
I believe there are many saw injuries where the user feed his hand into the blade. However I think the highest percentage of injuries occur when the users hand falls onto the blade, due to kickback, tripping near the saw, losing balance while using the saw, or trying to catch something falling toward the blade, or slipping shoving hand into blade.
I think significant damage will result from such a test.
Ed,
Good points and I agree. I expect the SawStop isn't foolproof. I think the testimonials that I have read is that those whose finger(s) hit the sawblade before the brake actuated had a small layer of skin removed from their finger, more akin to a nick than a full fledged cut. Still miraculous and finger saving, but I wonder where the "grey" areas exist where this technology has trouble sensing and reacting in time. The more accidental exposures like you highlight are certainly ones of interest for this.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:11 am
by edma194
Ed in Tampa wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:43 am
I believe there are many saw injuries where the user feed his hand into the blade. However I think the highest percentage of injuries occur when the users hand falls onto the blade, due to kickback, tripping near the saw, losing balance while using the saw, or trying to catch something falling toward the blade, or slipping shoving hand into blade.
Agreed. I can keep my fingers from moving into the saw blade when everything is working right, it's the unpredictable that I worry about.
I'm not ready to call these guys frauds. I wouldn't put down a non-refundable deposit because even if they are sincere in their efforts they could still fail. If they do need cash to start up the business there are better ways to do it that don't make them sound like scammers.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:59 pm
by chapmanruss
The debate so far has been interesting reading. I sent a question to them asking if it can be used on Shopsmith tools. Below is the answer I received.
Hi Russell,
Thank you for reaching out, and I hope you are well. The Saw Shield Band Saw is compatible with the Shopsmith 11" band saw attachment. It just replaces the lower guide bearings.
We have not yet developed a bracket to fit the Shopsmith table saw, but this is something we would like to do. We know that Shopsmith's have a devout and loyal following, and we would like to make our technology accessible to these enthusiasts. If you pre-order, what we can do is work with you to design and create a bracket that will fit the Shopsmith table saw. The only other thing I would note is that it is difficult to tell the width of the dust collection shroud. For smaller dust shrouds, you may need to modify the shroud to provide clearance around the Saw Shield device. If you can provide us with a width for the dust shroud, we can give you a better idea if this would be necessary and what might be involved.
Also, if you are interested in both the band saw and table saw, you would need to order both kits. The devices actually use different methods of stopping the blade, and are not cross compatible.
I hope that answers your question. Please let me know if you have any other questions or if there's anything else we can help you with.
Regards,
Wes
Saw Shield Co-founder
I do find it interesting that to use on both the Bandsaw and the Table Saw mode on the Shopsmith that it requires ordering both kits as there must be some common components in both kits. Maybe they haven't really considered that yet.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:12 pm
by RFGuy
Russ,
Interesting. Thanks for contacting them and reporting back. I would be curious to know how they intend to mount the brake on the Mark V. I mean I doubt they would engineer a mount that attaches to the quill, but that would probably be ideal. Or, would they intend to attach to the carriage somehow? Dust collection would be negated and need a new lower guard solution with it.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:25 pm
by twistsol
RFGuy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 9:41 am
While I love the technology, I have my concerns of how SawStop or SawShield works. It appears this product is using capacitive sensing to detect a finger, or meat product, near the blade. Sometimes we cut wet lumber and the fact that SawStop can't do that without risking ruining a blade is a real turn off to me...
SawStop has the option to turn off the safety feature if you know you are going to be cutting wet lumber or conductive materials like aluminum. I would hope any competitor would also have that option. The SawStop cannot be used with a moulding head and of course with both, it appears to be extra if you want to use a dado.
My biggest issue with technology like this is that some people will become dependent on it and ignore common sense safety assuming the tech will keep them safe, much like people in 4WD trucks who think they can safely drive 70MPH in a snow storm.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 8:13 pm
by jsburger
twistsol wrote: ↑Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:25 pm
RFGuy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 9:41 am
While I love the technology, I have my concerns of how SawStop or SawShield works. It appears this product is using capacitive sensing to detect a finger, or meat product, near the blade. Sometimes we cut wet lumber and the fact that SawStop can't do that without risking ruining a blade is a real turn off to me...
SawStop has the option to turn off the safety feature if you know you are going to be cutting wet lumber or conductive materials like aluminum. I would hope any competitor would also have that option. The SawStop cannot be used with a moulding head and of course with both, it appears to be extra if you want to use a dado.
My biggest issue with technology like this is that some people will become dependent on it and ignore common sense safety assuming the tech will keep them safe, much like people in 4WD trucks who think they can safely drive 70MPH in a snow storm.
How wet is wet to trigger the device? How do I know when to turn off the device?
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 2:09 pm
by roy_okc
jsburger wrote: ↑Tue Dec 15, 2020 8:13 pm
How wet is wet to trigger the device? How do I know when to turn off the device?
As a fairly new owner of a Sawstop PCS, I've been following the SS FB forum. There are typically one or two activations mentioned per day not due to touching flesh. The people who can narrow it down to wet wood have typically cut just bought pressure treated wood that is still pretty damp and occasionally very green wood. I did see one yesterday about a guy whose best
guess was caused by crossing a glue up from the day prior, supposedly 60* overnight in his garage or shed or whatever.
Re: Saw Shield
Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 7:34 pm
by robinson46176
While I have not studied this concept I assume (always dangerous) that using it would preclude using things like molding heads, wobble dado cutters and other misc. attachments?
For over half a dozen decades my safety choice has been to avoid sticking my fingers into the saw blade... I understand that I may do something truly stupid tomorrow
but it has served me well so far. I've spent my whole life doing very dangerous work using all manner of tools and equipment who's primary goal on this planet was to remove blood from my body. So far the best they could do was three stitches in my left thumb from a razor sharp knife I was using in a factory cutting room. As a lifetime farmer I have seen many of my friends and neighbors become seriously mangled in "accidents" and it was always avoidable and sadly sometimes fatal and in most of those cases, a horrible way to die.
Thinking through every action is the best way to be safe working at dangerous jobs.
Now I did come close to a dangerous situation with an overly friendly lady who was working in a warehouse many years ago but I managed to escape that situation with everything intact too.
