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[ATTACH]11967[/ATTACH] This is the specs for one that i bought a couple of years back at Home Depot.......... measures metric, decimal, and fractions. cost was $34.50 back then...........

charlese wrote:Most interesting to me is: To do the work shown in the ad, you don't need to have any really accurate measurements at all. The screw type, inside or outside calipers will remain at their setting until purposely moved. If a person wants to duplicate an item, just set the calipers at the desired diameter and match it to the new part.

Rambling down a side path as usual.
There you go... Sometime maybe 200 years ago some early craftsman makes a piece of furniture, maybe working much like I do sometimes. You know, I'll grab a tin can or a coin to mark a radius on all 4 corners of a piece just choosing a radius that looks nice. I don't give a rats whatsit what the actual dimension measures. I just want it to look about like "that".
Then on this other part I maybe was going to make it about "this" long but I happen to have two left-over pieces from another project that are 5/16" shorter than "this" long so I use those instead. When I put the top on I would like the top to stick over about "that" much all of the way around but when I get the top glued up and cut to size and I go around with the router (or molding plane) I get some tear-out at a knot or something. Rather than try to patch it or cut a new top I trim it back a little and go around with the router again. OK, That looks fine.
Fast forward 200 years... Some guy finds it in an antique shop and measures it up to draw a set of plans to use on a TV show to make a reproduction. He measures it carefully down to a 1/64th of an inch. When he makes it he spends tedious amounts of time following those dimensions even where I would have rather made it different but used what I had. That is alright if you are a tedious technician sort of person but then he suddenly makes a change of omission on some carefully crafted molding or something that loses half of the spirit of the piece and makes it just a plain old whatzit holder. The true art is now gone but by golly he got all of those dimensions right.
Yeah, OK, I am thinking about some of the New Yankee Workshop shows.
Yes I do like Norm and am going to miss him but he did lose the art/spirit in a good number of pieces.
I'm just saying (mostly to the young guys) don't just become a "tedious technician". Work as accurately as you reasonably can, just don't lose the art and spirit because you are only looking at the numbers.

robinson46176 wrote:Rambling down a side path as usual.
There you go... Sometime maybe 200 years ago some early craftsman makes a piece of furniture, maybe working much like I do sometimes. You know, I'll grab a tin can or a coin to mark a radius on all 4 corners of a piece just choosing a radius that looks nice. I don't give a rats whatsit what the actual dimension measures. I just want it to look about like "that".
Then on this other part I maybe was going to make it about "this" long but I happen to have two left-over pieces from another project that are 5/16" shorter than "this" long so I use those instead. When I put the top on I would like the top to stick over about "that" much all of the way around but when I get the top glued up and cut to size and I go around with the router (or molding plane) I get some tear-out at a knot or something. Rather than try to patch it or cut a new top I trim it back a little and go around with the router again. OK, That looks fine.
Fast forward 200 years... Some guy finds it in an antique shop and measures it up to draw a set of plans to use on a TV show to make a reproduction. He measures it carefully down to a 1/64th of an inch. When he makes it he spends tedious amounts of time following those dimensions even where I would have rather made it different but used what I had. That is alright if you are a tedious technician sort of person but then he suddenly makes a change of omission on some carefully crafted molding or something that loses half of the spirit of the piece and makes it just a plain old whatzit holder. The true art is now gone but by golly he got all of those dimensions right.
Yeah, OK, I am thinking about some of the New Yankee Workshop shows.
Yes I do like Norm and am going to miss him but he did lose the art/spirit in a good number of pieces.
I'm just saying (mostly to the young guys) don't just become a "tedious technician". Work as accurately as you reasonably can, just don't lose the art and spirit because you are only looking at the numbers.

Nice dose of perspective, there are times where dimensions are important but it is all too easy to get caught up in the madness.
You sound a lot like one of the mechanics at work, if memory served he mentioned the rat's whatzit as well and said he didn't care what highly specific blend radius one of the engineers called for in a repair, all he used was a quarter, dime, nickle, or penny.

Troy

Francis I agree with what you said in the context it was meant. As long as that randomly dimensioned part did not have to fit tightly to/with another part than 'close' is Aok. If you intend to make more than 'one' and make 'interchangable' parts, then no it ain't.

So 'It all depends'!:)

We can be a bit 'sloppy' with wood(after all it does shape shift), but with harder more stable stuff, better precision(measuring) is needed.

BTW Antique 'reproductions' need not be exact IMHO. Hey it is just a 'me too' after all and if it can be 'improved' or made prettier, than I think that be an ok 'embellishment' that adds to our pleasure both making and using it.

I feel the same way about actual antiques. To not 'clean them up' or make them more useful is IMHO elitist nonsense(unfortunately those elitist are the ones having the last say as to 'value'). To me it is the value to myself that matters.

Does all this discussion in this thread tell me no one is going to buy a pair and let me know if they are any good or not?

"To digitize or not to digitize that is the question." but not my quesition.

Ed: I bought mine because, it is to hard to read a regular caliper these days..........Those digits are quite large and easy to read....I can make enough mistakes reading those lines on a tape measure........

Ed in Tampa wrote:Does all this discussion in this thread tell me no one is going to buy a pair and let me know if they are any good or not?

"To digitize or not to digitize that is the question." but not my quesition.

My order for this tool has been shipped so I will post when I receive it.

Ed in Tampa wrote:Does all this discussion in this thread tell me no one is going to buy a pair and let me know if they are any good or not?

"To digitize or not to digitize that is the question." but not my quesition.

Ed,

Ordinarily, with Chinese made tools I would say not, but for $31.19 it is hard to go wrong. Chinese dial calipers aren't too bad and are certainly good enough for woodworking. Digital measuring devices can be problematic as some are serious battery eaters. If you have to go to Radio Shack for replacement batteries regularly it won't take too many trips until you exceed the cost of the calipers.
Also some will continue to function but give bad results when the battery gets low. As a rule the cheaper the caliper the more trouble you will have with the above but there are exceptions. At school, the guy who ran the machine shop bought Brown & Sharpe digital calipers and had trouble with all of the above. He banished them after ruining a part due to their inaccuracy.

It looks like Bill has volunteered to be the guinea pig, it will be interesting to hear his report.

Troy

horologist wrote:Ed,

Digital measuring devices can be problematic as some are serious battery eaters. If you have to go to Radio Shack for replacement batteries regularly it won't take too many trips until you exceed the cost of the calipers.
Troy

If you go to Radio Shack to buy your batteries you are WAY over paying. The 3 volt button batteries used in most of my measuring equipment can be had from Amazon for about $1 each and if you go to your local dollar store you can sometimes find them in a package of 3 for $1.

oldc6 wrote:Ed: I bought mine because, it is to hard to read a regular caliper these days..........Those digits are quite large and easy to read....I can make enough mistakes reading those lines on a tape measure........

Have you tried a "Blind Man's Tape" from Lee Valley? http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=32565&cat=1,43513