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May I also add another alternative? The Miterset. I have the Incra 1000HD with their miter sled for the SS, but that is kind of apples and oranges since the miter bar does not fit in the SS table slot. Once adjusted, the Incra is very precise every time and I presume the V120 is the same.

I suggest the Miterset because you wrote about minimal space. The Miterset is quite compact and has had repeatable accuracy. Price is $30 plus shipping.

For the record, I like the Incra 1000 so much that I had considered buying the V120 for my SS miter gauge, but I think I'll hold off and see how the Miterset holds up over time.

Just my 2 cents.

PS - the reason I don't use the sled and 1000 all the time is the reduced depth of cut.

Be well,
Ben

I recently bought the MiterSet Set. When it arrived, I compared it to the Incra V120 - every setting was an exact match, so no real reason to own both, unless you need the half degree increments available with the MiterSet (the V120 has a detent at 22.5 degrees).

Mike

beeg wrote:So your saying that the resolution is "accurate to ONE degree", but the accuracy of those degrees are unstated?

I am saying resolution and accuracy are two different things.

A reasonable 'assumption' is that with a resolution of one degree, that any error would be substantually less(accuracy).

Think of it as the 'resolution' is the target and the accuracy is the closeness of the rounds.

Recently there has been much taking liberties with these things especially with digital devices. Often as you described, the accuracy 'deviation' is greater than the resolution.

A wixey like angle gauge that has a resolution of .05 degrees and an accuracy of +- .1 degree. I consider such stuff as having redundant 'resolution'(worthless, better ignored).

I have seen this scenario with stuff from China and 'consider the source'.

It also makes me suspicious of excessively small 'resolution'.

I do NOT think any Incra items are in that category.

However they are not stating any meaningful specs. I be disappointed there!:(

freedomlives wrote:I think I'll go with the SS original style miter gauge with new hold down for now. I can imagine making a jig like that miterset for commonly used angles.

I have in mind for the present year to make different home furnishings as needed for us, like cabinets, hopefully a rocking chair for my wife (her big desire to have), some doors for the house...

How useful would it be to get the miter-slot extension for the saw table? I know a 510/520 upgrade would be better, but those parts won't all fit in a suitcase and cost a whole lot more!

For a M5/V500 another no-brainer!(and a Model 10 as well)


P.S. Realize there are two versions for the M5. Rarely an older version surfaces(fits the greenie/older Goldie table).

beeg wrote:So your saying that the resolution is "accurate to ONE degree", but the accuracy of those degrees are unstated?

Let's see if I can help explain the metrology jargon.

"Resolution" refers to the smallest change that an instrument can select, sense, and/or display. If the "display" consists of notches that are one degree apart, then the resolution of the device is one degree. You can't make a change of less than one degree, and the device can't "display" a change of less than one degree.

"Accuracy" refers to the deviation of the setting or display from the absolute "truth". For example, if you set the miter gauge to 45 degrees, and then measured the angle with a perfectly accurate instrument that said the angle was 45.2 degrees, that would equate to an accuracy error for the miter gauge of 0.2 degrees. Assuming that was the worst error anywhere in the measurement range, then the manufacturer could legitimately claim an "accuracy" for the device of 0.2 degrees, even though the "resolution" is only one degree.

"Repeatability" refers to the ability of a device to repeat the same position (setting or display) time and time again. Lets say that you set the miter gauge to 30 degrees. Then you measure it with your perfect instrument, which says that the actual angle is 30.10 degrees. Then you change the position setting, and again move it back again to 30 degrees. This time, your perfect instrument measures 30.00 degrees. So you repeat this experiment a zillion times, and the perfect instrument always measures a position in between 30.00 and 30.10 degrees. This gives a "repeatability" for the miter gauge of 0.10 degrees, or +/- 0.05 degrees.

Clear as mud?

I've had my V-120 for less than a month so I haven't put it through all that much. The SS gauge worked well but always seemed "loose". The Incra adjusts nice to the slot.

JPG40504 wrote:However they are not stating any meaningful specs. I be disappointed there!:(

"THEY" meaning SS? Whereas reible provided some Incra specs. http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showpos ... stcount=20

beeg wrote:"THEY" meaning SS? Whereas reible provided some Incra specs. https://forum.shopsmith.com/viewtopic.php?p=159202&postcount=20

'They' was Incra at Incra.com.

What Ed posted was sales propaganda(albeit with useful information(inferred, not specific)).

BuckeyeDennis wrote: . . .

So you repeat this experiment a zillion times, and the perfect instrument always measures a position in between 30.00 and 30.10 degrees. This gives a "repeatability" for the miter gauge of 0.10 degrees, or +/- 0.05 degrees.

Clear as mud?

That's extrapolation!(sorta) Sounds like 30.05 +- 0.05 to me. or 30.0 -0.0, +0.1.

The rest is well done!:)

You know, its a good thing I don't live in the U.S. anymore. Because if I did, I would realize that rather than piece-meal upgrading, it would be better just to watch Craigslist for a good deal on a Mark V 510 or 520. Like someone has a 510 now in Atlanta for $800 obo with a bad motor. I can imagine buying that "just for the tables, resale the rest for parts" and instead ending up fixing the motor and having two shopsmiths!

Hmm... and a 510 would probably already have a two bearing quill, and maybe I could just get my mother (she's a flight attendant for Delta) to just slowly bring over tables and such when she's comes to visit. I think that even the tubes would be acceptable in place of a checked bag if wrapped in bubble-wrap. Is the headstock under 50lbs? And now I see someone has an older 510 (I say older based on the switch on the headstock) for $680.

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