Shopsmith Forums

WOW even more information that is bound to interest some of you.

http://nebula.wsimg.com/a689a7745026977 ... oworigin=1

Haven't finished reading this but the first few pages gets the old mind going on some new ideas. Love to be working for some company that could afford the forward looking work on projects associated with this. It would be enough to get me out of retirement for sure.

Ed

I wonder if Tekna Tool is going to introduce smaller motors for things such as small lathes. A 35 pound motor on a midi lathe might be too much to handle. Also how does the price of the Teknatool motor and controller compare to a VFD drive with a motor of a similar rating?
Our woodworking club recently purchased a Delta floor mounted drill press and a Grizzly hybrid cabinet saw and both have flat belt drive systems so those belts are becoming more popular on machine drive systems. Pulleys may be difficult to find now but in the future I am sure they will be more readily available.
Bill V

wa2crk wrote:I wonder if Tekna Tool is going to introduce smaller motors for things such as small lathes. A 35 pound motor on a midi lathe might be too much to handle. Also how does the price of the Teknatool motor and controller compare to a VFD drive with a motor of a similar rating?
Our woodworking club recently purchased a Delta floor mounted drill press and a Grizzly hybrid cabinet saw and both have flat belt drive systems so those belts are becoming more popular on machine drive systems. Pulleys may be difficult to find now but in the future I am sure they will be more readily available.
Bill V

Rotary Encoder/Speed Wheel - sweet!

I don't expect it to happen, but it would be great to get the firmware for the shopsmith shared in such a way that it could be loaded onto one of these more flexible controller boards. Its no surprise that the basic controller is so simple.

Hmm, I wonder is teknatool would sell just the HMI board? Ultimately for the "average" SS user the current interface is ideal...but man oh man the possibilities if the expanded functionality were available

Ed in Tampa wrote:Charles
What are you basing you statement that the electronic unit is a whole lot lighter? .

Sorry for my choice of words, Ed. I intended to say a whole lot smaller. The PowerPro's motor controller looks (to me) quite a bit larger than the black box on top of the shown motor.

Ed in Tampa wrote:Come on $200 is way below the actual costs and includes a profit.

But if it floats your boat add $400 and you are still way below what SS is charging. And I guarantee that $400 is way over the price of the additions plus a normal profit.

Also I'm told there are 1 million SS out there. That means there is 1 million potential customers. That is not a low volume market for most small manufactures.

If SS had priced the upgrade below the $1000 mark they would have sold a ton more than they have.

Maybe so, but if there is no profit with each sale the result is called "bankrupcy". Remember what profit is. Profit is that amount left in the bank after ALL of the bills are paid. That includes the cost of dumping the trash.

damagi wrote:Rotary Encoder/Speed Wheel - sweet!

I don't expect it to happen, but it would be great to get the firmware for the shopsmith shared in such a way that it could be loaded onto one of these more flexible controller boards. Its no surprise that the basic controller is so simple.

Hmm, I wonder is teknatool would sell just the HMI board? Ultimately for the "average" SS user the current interface is ideal...but man oh man the possibilities if the expanded functionality were available

Coding might be a real challenge without access to design details of the controller. Example: The PowerPro adjusts speed according to the operation being performed. If the controller is preset as a band saw how does it detect that the user is actually cutting hard wood on the table saw?

dusty wrote:Coding might be a real challenge without access to design details of the controller. Example: The PowerPro adjusts speed according to the operation being performed. If the controller is preset as a band saw how does it detect that the user is actually cutting hard wood on the table saw?

I'm not convinced the PowerPro changes its algorithm based on, for instance 900rpm bandsaw vs. 900 rpm drilling. I suspect the closed-loop speed control mainly checks the optical speed/position sensor in the motor, and goes for proper achieved speed. If there *were* a fool-proof way to know what loads are connected to the headstock shafts (e.g., high-diameter/inertia wheels vs. small chucks), then the PowerPro could probably have finer levels of control-loop stability. But, as it is, the left-most speed button (900rpm) can be applied to many work modes. When you have a 900rpm "fast button" for the bandsaw, it will get used a lot more than going through the mode-selection menu steps each time.

That said -- was the old headstock perfect? Nope. Speed control gear-wear, continual black dust from the lower belt & sheaves, numerous vibrational modes, tendency to fill up with sawdust.... The PowerPro is a big improvement.

dusty wrote:Maybe so, but if there is no profit with each sale the result is called "bankrupcy". Remember what profit is. Profit is that amount left in the bank after ALL of the bills are paid. That includes the cost of dumping the trash.

Since this is a community thread, and I feel chatty, I am going to expand on what Dusty has said.

Watching the nieces and nephews on both sides of our families, all who are out of college now, I've been amazed at the belief that has been conveyed to them that profit is a bad thing. Yep, it's socialism - or as I call it, "warmed-over Marxism run a muck". Recent surveys have shown this younger generation would prefer to work for non-profits, as if non-profits don't depend on the profits of others, and as they have come to believe, profit is a dirty word. When we see the Facebook posts of our N&Ns, my wife (I'm not on Facebook) tries to engage them gently about how economically ignorant they are. She does so "gently" because as she says, she doesn't want to shut down communication. But the worst one is her niece who teaches sociology at the junior college level. I shudder to think what Marxist clap-trap she is instilling in the next generation. But of course, it's not all about her. I well know that before and since the 1930's, capitalism has been under assault. The great disconnect is they (N&N) don't see that their wonderful standard of living has its roots in capitalism.

I don't know if SS is gouging or not. Hard to determine. What I do know is all new technologies are high priced and they eventually come down if left to the market place (i.e. government keeps their fingers off). I can't believe (now) what I paid for my first computer. In November my son rebuilt our "brain box" with memory, speed, and versatility that I could only dream about in 1985, and all for $350. I have a hunch the PP will become more accessible and cheaper in price. Whether some of us live to see it is another question.

nuhobby wrote:I'm not convinced the PowerPro changes its algorithm based on, for instance 900rpm bandsaw vs. 900 rpm drilling...

I agree. Any current programming would sense speed and direction then make adjustments based on what it senses. A sanding disk would act like a damper or flywheel when hooked to the other end of a bandsaw.
Maybe some future device could be programmed to react to different attachments. But then the motive force would have to monitor what devices are attached. Programming becomes like a trip to Mars, huge:rolleyes:
Dan

nuhobby wrote:I'm not convinced the PowerPro changes its algorithm based on, for instance 900rpm bandsaw vs. 900 rpm drilling. I suspect the closed-loop speed control mainly checks the optical speed/position sensor in the motor, and goes for proper achieved speed. If there *were* a fool-proof way to know what loads are connected to the headstock shafts (e.g., high-diameter/inertia wheels vs. small chucks), then the PowerPro could probably have finer levels of control-loop stability. But, as it is, the left-most speed button (900rpm) can be applied to many work modes. When you have a 900rpm "fast button" for the bandsaw, it will get used a lot more than going through the mode-selection menu steps each time.

That said -- was the old headstock perfect? Nope. Speed control gear-wear, continual black dust from the lower belt & sheaves, numerous vibrational modes, tendency to fill up with sawdust.... The PowerPro is a big improvement.

I am not doubting that at all.