Model 500 rip fence upgrade?

alaskanexile · Post by **alaskanexile** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:08 pm

Checked mine with two different centers and am afraid I have to lean toward wobbly. At 1st I thought it solid. A little side pressure and still solid. A little more side pressure - not much more - and they both moved.
Roger

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:56 pm

reible wrote:Interesting but on mine it is rock solid. And works just like advertised by shopsmith. And I mean rock solid, ones in place it will not even move a fraction of a thousands of an inch. You slide it in and it just fits...

Wonder what makes yours and mine so different? My fence came with my unit when I got it in 1976. I guess I would have to see how your fences differ from mine.

If you have the PTWFE with the yellow cover that is 7-1/2" x 10-1/4" you can check page 263 where it is used as pivot with the disk sander (two pictures and text), page 219 where it is being used with the jig saw (couple more pictures and text)

If you have the yellow one called the revised edition check page 274.

The 4th edition page 222....
[ATTACH]3217[/ATTACH]

Ed

Interesting pix of a 510/fence! This discussion is about 500 fence! I still think we have a different definition of solid/wobbly. There is NO WAY a tapered shaft will seat solidly into a straight sided hole with out shifting sideways when sufficient side ways force is applied. You CAN force it into the hole, but you have NO guarantee it is 'straight".
Also your pix did not show a #2 tapered device that I could see.
Yes light work OK. Critical exacting work...NO!

reible · Post by **reible** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:16 am

I guess you didn't bother to look at the books or to look at the photos very well, it is very clear that photo "a" is a 500 fence and that photo "b" shows a work around method for the 510 fence (it also works for a 520). It is also clear if you were to read that they are calling for the use of the "lathe cup center". That term can be checked at:
http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/cata ... enters.htm
see item "b".

I would total agree that we have a difference in how we think about things. I also submit that when used as shown it works... This is a tried and true method. Now I'm not saying to turn your table up and use it for a lathe.... And yes given enough force it will move... and if you pull on it it will come out but that is not the point. The point is shopsmith thinks it works and so do I. If you don't want to believe me or believe shopsmith fine. I'm just not in the mood to play silly games.

Now I can't control what you want to see verses what is pictured but if you take the time to read and understand it would make all of our lives easier. Since you can't seem to do that then I think I'm finished here with your questions.

For everyone else go to:

http://www.shopsmith.com/academy/discsa ... htm#curves

then scroll down the page to where you can see figure 17-26. You can then read the text to the left.

You can also check out:
http://www.woodshoptips.com/tips/061702/061702pt4.pdf

If any of you still don't think this works then take it up with shopsmith, it was their idea, I am but a humble user and all I can say it has worked for me. OK enough is enough. I'm finished on this post and I will not be commenting farther on this subject... so like I said take it up with shopsmith.

Ed

jpg40504 wrote:Interesting pix of a 510/fence! This discussion is about 500 fence! I still think we have a different definition of solid/wobbly. There is NO WAY a tapered shaft will seat solidly into a straight sided hole with out shifting sideways when sufficient side ways force is applied. You CAN force it into the hole, but you have NO guarantee it is 'straight".
Also your pix did not show a #2 tapered device that I could see.
Yes light work OK. Critical exacting work...NO!

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:11 am

reible wrote:I guess you didn't bother to look at the books or to look at the photos very well, it is very clear that photo "a" is a 500 fence and that photo "b" shows a work around method for the 510 fence (it also works for a 520). It is also clear if you were to read that they are calling for the use of the "lathe cup center". That term can be checked at:
http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/cata ... enters.htm
see item "b".

I would total agree that we have a difference in how we think about things. I also submit that when used as shown it works... This is a tried and true method. Now I'm not saying to turn your table up and use it for a lathe.... And yes given enough force it will move... and if you pull on it it will come out but that is not the point. The point is shopsmith thinks it works and so do I. If you don't want to believe me or believe shopsmith fine. I'm just not in the mood to play silly games.

Now I can't control what you want to see verses what is pictured but if you take the time to read and understand it would make all of our lives easier. Since you can't seem to do that then I think I'm finished here with your questions.

For everyone else go to:

http://www.shopsmith.com/academy/discsa ... htm#curves

then scroll down the page to where you can see figure 17-26. You can then read the text to the left.

You can also check out:
http://www.woodshoptips.com/tips/061702/061702pt4.pdf

If any of you still don't think this works then take it up with shopsmith, it was their idea, I am but a humble user and all I can say it has worked for me. OK enough is enough. I'm finished on this post and I will not be commenting farther on this subject... so like I said take it up with shopsmith.

Ed

Well where do we start?

1) No I did not have the benefit of 'reading' the referenced material, I do NOT have it! Had I been ABLE to 'read' both the text AND the information under each picture as shown in your second reference I WOULD have recognized the two pix were of 500/510 tables.

2) Had you provided the link to the relevant text/pictures in your previous post("they fit rock solid") I would have better understood your position/opinion.

3) I DO agree with SS that this is a way to accomplish the task illustrated. Consider however that the amount of side force MUST be kept low so as to NOT cause the cup center pin to move through the piece being sanded. This procedure also allows for movement(wobble) of the center since if it moves it will do so early on and assume a position from which further movement away from the sanding disc is impossible/unlikely without also causing the cup pin to also move within the piece being sanded.

4) This is NOT a game! I agree I did NOT know all the details of what SS was suggesting when the 'subject' of tapered shanks in straight sided holes was started. If this example you finally provided to all of us is typical of doing so then there is NO question the suggested procedures ARE effective even though precise positioning is not possible(IT IS GOOD ENOUGH for the task being done).

5) Yes we saw things differently, but we did have different sets of information input. Your information was far superior to what I had. I just wish you had injected the links into your previous post!

johnmccrossen · Post by **johnmccrossen** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:19 pm

Wow!! I wonder if Eastern Grey now knows some of the differences between the original 500 fence and the upgrade fence? (I am referring to post #1.) My bet is that he does. Moving on ......

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:05 pm

johnmccrossen wrote:Wow!! I wonder if Eastern Grey now knows some of the differences between the original 500 fence and the upgrade fence? (I am referring to post #1.) My bet is that he does. Moving on ......

He certainly got more than his 2 bits worth!:D

dusty · Post by **dusty** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:18 pm

jpg40504 wrote:Well where do we start?

1) No I did not have the benefit of 'reading' the referenced material, I do NOT have it! Had I been ABLE to 'read' both the text AND the information under each picture as shown in your second reference I WOULD have recognized the two pix were of 500/510 tables.

If it is PTWFE that you need for reference, it is available online.

http://www.shopsmith.com/academy/welcome.htm

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:38 pm

dusty wrote:If it is PTWFE that you need for reference, it is available online.

http://www.shopsmith.com/academy/welcome.htm

I NOW know that since ed's SECOND post! Went to it to understand from whence he was speaking. Much greater clarity! Thanks for the additional link!

Have you seen his idea about having a "ptwfe" chapter of the week 'club'? GREAT idea!!