dusty wrote:What is there about a table saw that makes it OKAY for cutting plywood while a Shopsmith is declared inadequate or unsafe?
For me its the table height. I'm 5'4", or I was a couple years ago, so when cutting the table is chest high! I'm much more 'comfortable' working at waist height with a saw. So I set up this table and break down sheet goods. Further my shop is in the basement and hauling 4 x 8 sheets down a flight of stairs - I don't think so. So the plywood or mdf comes out of the van onto my table http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showthr ... ting+table
We all have to find ways of working that fit our budgets, our shops, our needs.
They may be different but I'm not sure there is a right or wrong way unless its unsafe.
New Leaf Custom Woodworking
Berry Conway - Chief Dust Maker
Lack of support for the full sheet on both the infeed and outfeed side is the main reason why I think the shopsmith is a lousy tool for cutting such a thing.
Same standard and statement would apply to most construction site type table saws. Lousy tool for the job.
Both will also suffer from poor saw stability, awkward to impossible power switch access, inadequate power for the job, unpleasantly easy sheet skewing, and probably a dozen more reasons that both are lousy for the job.
A large workshop type table saw, with adequate mitre tracks and such, is quite capable of cutting full plywood sheets accurately, easily, and safely. They are also quite expensive and eat up a whole lot of shop space. Even if they are integrated into a workbench surface.
The use of a panel saw or a hand held circular saw with a cut guide is a far superior tool to the shopsmith or homeowner or construction site table saw.
foxtrapper wrote:Lack of support for the full sheet on both the infeed and outfeed side is the main reason why I think the shopsmith is a lousy tool for cutting such a thing.
Same standard and statement would apply to most construction site type table saws. Lousy tool for the job.
Both will also suffer from poor saw stability, awkward to impossible power switch access, inadequate power for the job, unpleasantly easy sheet skewing, and probably a dozen more reasons that both are lousy for the job.
A large workshop type table saw, with adequate mitre tracks and such, is quite capable of cutting full plywood sheets accurately, easily, and safely. They are also quite expensive and eat up a whole lot of shop space. Even if they are integrated into a workbench surface.
The use of a panel saw or a hand held circular saw with a cut guide is a far superior tool to the shopsmith or homeowner or construction site table saw.
"Lousey" is, in my humble opinion, sort of harsh but I do not otherwise disagree.
Infeed and outfeed support are a MUST HAVE to do this work safely.
The rip fence must be adequate so as to be able to guide the sheet the entire length of the cut. I find the 520 fence to be a great improvement.
The standard Shopsmith table is too small; but if using a 505 or later this can be resolved with standard extension and floating tables.
The table height is higher than ideal for most users.
"Making Sawdust Safely" Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
I'm talking about a full 4x8 sheet of plywood. I don't think even the 520 has adequate support on the infeed and outfeed side. Same a construction or homeowner type table saw.
I don't find the height of the shopsmith to be an issue with feeding large sheet stock. Neither a hinderance nor a help, at least to me.
And as always, in my opinion. While I don't like trying to slice big sheets of plywood on a tablesaw or shopsmith, that does not mean others cannot find it perfectly wonderful. Just that I personally would far prefer to use a panel saw first, and a handheld circular saw second.
Once sliced down to a manageable size, I'm perfectly happy using the SS. Though if I can feed through the bandsaw, I'll do that instead of using the table saw.
This 'discussion' reminds me of an ambitious project a few decades past. Creating a 5' tall over 3' wide about 30" deep speaker cabinet with truncated(45°) rear corners out of 1" plywood with an 8" plywood blade on a Mark 5. I had to position the blade just OFF the table to get the cut width for the bevel cuts.
I cut all the pieces from 4' x 8' sheets and only 'precut' the beveled parts but did so with the Mark 5. All cutting was done solo but with improvised outfeed support only.
Yes twas not easy but careful positioning(workpiece and myself) allowed for accurate straight cuts. Needless to say bowing of the workpiece was not an issue.
Key to the success was IMHO careful forethought of the process prior to implementation. That forethought included consideration of the moving/splitting weight distribution and how it was to be supported. The infeed side was 'manually' controlled.
I in no way recommend the off table blade setup, but it did allow me to make the bevel cuts.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
I don't think cutting a full sheet of stock on any table saw is a good idea.
If you have a sheet of stock in place you have to duck under it to turn the saw on and off. You have to eye the fit against the fence from at least 4 feet way unless you have enough helpers or support to stand at the saw itself.
To outfit a table saw to cut sheet stock the pro's build permanent infeed/outfeed and in many cases side tables. The get remote start/stop on the saw and many times they still have helpers.
Most see this as huge waste of resource, time and man power so they have gone to panel saw which is very expensive or a sliding table saw which demands huge amounts of space and are costly.
For the home owner he has a few choices get a team of helpers.
Build infeed and outfeed tables
Use infeed and outfeed rollers
Use guided saw system
Or if they have a ton of money a panel saw system
The helpers are the cheapest and best unless you have to keep them and feed them. However if they live with you, you are probably doing that anyhow.
The infeed/outfeed tables are great but impractical with Shopsmith since the table height changes with depth of cut.
Infeed/outfeed rollers work but they can tip and frankly are a pain to setup adjust teardown.
Both of the above do not solve the problem of either having to turn on the Shopsmith before lifting the sheet stock into place or ducking under the sheet stock to turn the saw on. Both are very dangerous in my opinion.
Guided saw system, you slide the sheet stock from storage or out of the bed of your truck. lay down the cutting guide and cut the sheet.
Simple safe and unless you do something completely crazy nearly impossible to injury yourself.
Panel saw best idea if you have the room and money. Make perfect cuts every time.
"The infeed/outfeed tables are great but impractical with Shopsmith since the table height changes with depth of cut."
Not quite so impractical if the infeed/outfeed table moves up and down with the main table.
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Dusty
I see this version of you outfeed table doesn't have that center support coming up from the bottom of the main table support tube. Is it just not mounted or is this a new change?
Ed in Tampa wrote:Dusty
I see this version of you outfeed table doesn't have that center support coming up from the bottom of the main table support tube. Is it just not mounted or is this a new change?
This is an image of the table from before the center support was added but the center support is used with one version of the table while it can be left off like the version shown here.
They work equally well but the version shown here takes a little longer to set up and tear down.
I install the outfeed table only when I am going to be using it because when installed it prevents me from walking around the Mark V. My work bench sets parallel to the outfeed side of the Mark V just out of view in this photo.
"Making Sawdust Safely" Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
