10ER Restoration Detour

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Mon May 13, 2013 9:45 am

Progress. Completed the feet, and glued the legs up last night.

Decided to go a little bigger on the feet, and the entire top is going to be doubled up and making an attempt at haunched tenons.

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JPG · Post by **JPG** » Mon May 13, 2013 12:14 pm

Gotta admit I like the look of the dowels!:)

This is really looking good

(considering the 10ER is 'on hold').

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Mon May 13, 2013 12:35 pm

JPG40504 wrote:Gotta admit I like the look of the dowels!:)

This is really looking good (considering the 10ER is 'on hold').

The dowels really class up the wall studs haha. The only tools I'm using are the mitre saw, a fairly beefy belt sander (B&D no. 7450) I got them to throw in with the mitre saw, and a drill guide I bought at Sears last week...not the best made tool in the world but you can make it work and there aren't a whole lot of alternatives. I was able to design such that nearly all my mortise and tenons could be roughed out on the mitre saw, I'll have one cut on the top of each leg I need to hand saw and chisel out which isn't bad.

Just think of how quickly I can knock out the 10ER once I have open work surfaces and the ability to turn around in my shop!

Next question - do I run one dowel through each joint to allow some movement and rely on the dimensions being precise, or do I run two dowels and lock it down? I plan on both glueing and doweling the joints.

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Mon May 13, 2013 12:58 pm

Which joint(s)?

Leg bottom to feet?

Leg top to upper structure?*

*I am not clear how the legs will attach to the 'top'.

Methinks 'the one you generally trust' is the one to best answer your question!;)

BuckeyeDennis · Post by **BuckeyeDennis** » Mon May 13, 2013 1:43 pm

frank81 wrote: Next question - do I run one dowel through each joint to allow some movement and rely on the dimensions being precise, or do I run two dowels and lock it down? I plan on both glueing and doweling the joints.

Check out the "drawbored mortise and tenon" joint at this link: http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/videos/ ... ise-tenon/

I haven't tried it yet, but it looks like just the ticket for your project.

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Mon May 13, 2013 2:05 pm

[quote="JPG40504"]Which joint(s)?

Leg bottom to feet?

Leg top to upper structure?*

*I am not clear how the legs will attach to the 'top'.

Methinks 'the one you generally trust' is the one to best answer your question!]

All joints.

The upper structure will just be double 2x4's on top of the legs. I'm using a haunched tenon, but making them through tenons because I'd rather have the extra surface area and downward force on the legs is already the strongest point. The channel you see cut into the tops of the legs is for the short rails, and I will hand cut another channel for the long rails. Tenons will basically be half lapped with eachother.

There will also be a third rail a few inches above the legs in the rear, still deciding how I want to do that. Best option may be to just rest the edge on the feet and dowel into the legs with out any type of notching.

The top will then lay flat on the rails and leg tops, and I'll get up underneath and attach with 2x2 strips inside of the rails.

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Mon May 13, 2013 2:19 pm

BuckeyeDennis wrote:Check out the "drawbored mortise and tenon" joint at this link: http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/videos/ ... ise-tenon/

I haven't tried it yet, but it looks like just the ticket for your project.

I saw that over the weekend (found the charger to my tablet!) and thought...I already did that once or twice by accident

I don't see where drawboring would solve the issue of relying on extremely perfect shoulders to ensure squareness. In fact I would be concerned that it would amplify any little bit you are off and run the risk of misshaping the shoulders and/or face the mortise is cut into. And I would think the extra tensile load would make a tighter fit today but weaken the joint over the long term.

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Tue May 14, 2013 9:42 am

Cleaned up and sanded the legs, fine tuned the tenons, and dry fit to the legs last night. Tonights schedule is to dowel and glue up to the top of the frame.

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JPG · Post by **JPG** » Tue May 14, 2013 11:32 am

How are you joining the long rails to the short rails at the ends and middle of the long rails?

frank81 · Post by **frank81** » Tue May 14, 2013 11:50 am

JPG40504 wrote:How are you joining the long rails to the short rails at the ends and middle of the long rails?

I have another cut to make in the legs. The short rails are running through the channels that are already there. I'm making another channel perpendicular to that for the long rails to sit in, so looking down the leg will be make a + sign. Where the tenons would intersect each other I'm notching them like a half lap joint, so the short rail's tenons will be u-shaped and the long rail's tenons will be n-shaped. Leaving a 3/8" shoulder on the bottom of the rails, and running a dowel near the end of the "legs" of the "n" or "u" so they don't interfere with eachother. Not sure if I want them to stop at the other side of the leg or continue into the shoulder of the other rail.

Sort of a combination of a bridle joint, haunched tenon, and lap joint. My idea started off as a haunched tenon but I don't care if I have exposed endgrain and the extra surface area is a positive so I simplified it into this.

I cut the legs a quarter inch long and made my measurements based on the shoulder of the bottom tenon rather than the end of the board so that when its all put together I can final sand the top of the leg to be exact with the top of the rails. I realized last night, I didn't set out to do this but the entire deisgn could be held together with gravity.