It has been said that I insist that the table is rigid; I did not know that. But I do believe that neither rigidity nor flexibility is the root cause of my alleged problems.
My tables are not flat; none of the three but one is much worse than the other two.
I have been in contact with Shopsmith Customer Service and they have directed what I am to do. I will do as directed but at the same time I shall not hold my breathe.
It is interesting to note that securing the tables to the trunnions makes a significant difference in the degree of flatness. Much more so than I would have thought.
Shopsmith instructs that flatness tests be conducted with all four trunnion bolts loose. I measured, initially, with the tables all aligned and ready for work. The alignment procedure included the use of a dollar bill (as recommended by Nick). As expected, I had some highs and some lows (on all three tables).
The interesting part is that the locations and degree of those errors change when the trunnion bolts are loosened.
Unfortunately, the tables that pass the flatness test (with the trunnion bolts loose) may not do so when installed and aligned.
Like...between a ROCK and a HARD SPOT!!:mad:
I'm not through following the Shopsmith instructions. If anything significant comes of that I shall so report.
Just thinking. Trunnions. Could trunnions be the root of all evil?
Drill Press Table Not Square to Bit
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JPG
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I think that 'proves' that the flatness can be affected/corrected by shimming.
Rigid is subject to definition(nothing is absolutely rigid).
If the table is flat and a screw tightened to the trunion makes a 'low' area, the amount of 'lowness' may be corrected by a shim of the same thickness. This assumes the table rests on the trunions at all 4 points when 'flat' and the other three in both cases.
However it ignores all those right angles mentioned above. A good starting point however IMHO.
Rigid is subject to definition(nothing is absolutely rigid).
If the table is flat and a screw tightened to the trunion makes a 'low' area, the amount of 'lowness' may be corrected by a shim of the same thickness. This assumes the table rests on the trunions at all 4 points when 'flat' and the other three in both cases.
However it ignores all those right angles mentioned above. A good starting point however IMHO.
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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dusty
- Platinum Member
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- Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
- Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona
I received the results of the flatness evaluation today. Customer Service called me to inform me that all of the tables are within manufacturing specifications.
I was asked to prepare a detailed explanation of what I had experienced that caused all of my concerns. Engineering wants to evaluate that information and may have some ideas for how I can resolve the issue. I will work on that over the weekend.
They offered to remill or otherwise correct my tables if I wanted to send them back. I opted not to do that.
I must say that the cooperation that I received from Customer Service and Shopsmith Engineering was, as usual, excellent.
BTW, during these conversations they learned that I have one rear trunnion with 3/8" bolt holes. They are sending me one as a warranty replacement that has 1/2" bolt holes. Jan said they would have also replaced the two that I drilled out if they had known of the defect. One could not ask for more.
I was asked to prepare a detailed explanation of what I had experienced that caused all of my concerns. Engineering wants to evaluate that information and may have some ideas for how I can resolve the issue. I will work on that over the weekend.
They offered to remill or otherwise correct my tables if I wanted to send them back. I opted not to do that.
I must say that the cooperation that I received from Customer Service and Shopsmith Engineering was, as usual, excellent.
BTW, during these conversations they learned that I have one rear trunnion with 3/8" bolt holes. They are sending me one as a warranty replacement that has 1/2" bolt holes. Jan said they would have also replaced the two that I drilled out if they had known of the defect. One could not ask for more.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
You guys get "customer service!" I'm jealous!
My "customer service" stopped when Shopsmith left
South San Francisco and Berkeley, lo those many years ago.
But, I STILL have Skip! (Praise the Lord!) I also have me.
(Let the customer figure out his own fix.) On Model 10 stuff,
not so bad, as long as you have replacement parts. (Which
I do.)
steve
My "customer service" stopped when Shopsmith left
South San Francisco and Berkeley, lo those many years ago.
But, I STILL have Skip! (Praise the Lord!) I also have me.
(Let the customer figure out his own fix.) On Model 10 stuff,
not so bad, as long as you have replacement parts. (Which
I do.)
steve
10 ER, stripped down.
Basic 10ER, Parts machine. Will be a semi-dedicated drill-press machine.
10 ER, a "survivor" of the trailer fire, in the back yard, needing restoration. Has a Mk5 headrest. Finally, stripped down.
Numerous parts, for Model 10 stuff. Except for lower saw guard, A and B adapters, I've got it.
Looking for one more, or some 9 inch extension table raisers.
Basic 10ER, Parts machine. Will be a semi-dedicated drill-press machine.
10 ER, a "survivor" of the trailer fire, in the back yard, needing restoration. Has a Mk5 headrest. Finally, stripped down.
Numerous parts, for Model 10 stuff. Except for lower saw guard, A and B adapters, I've got it.
Looking for one more, or some 9 inch extension table raisers.
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"Wild Bad Bob"
- Platinum Member
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- Location: Germantown, Wi
Then there is Linda????!!!!!!!!!
Measure once, cut as many times as needed to get it right! Bob
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
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"Wild Bad Bob"
- Platinum Member
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- Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:03 pm
- Location: Germantown, Wi
Steve.
Who is Skip?? or was that a Ha Ha??
I feel like a rescue dog/cat person!!! Just closed a deal on this for 250.00 a Gentlemans agreement till I can PU in the first week in Sept, not totally in the drivers seat do to distance and a promise!!
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/tls/4617197128.html
Who is Skip?? or was that a Ha Ha??
I feel like a rescue dog/cat person!!! Just closed a deal on this for 250.00 a Gentlemans agreement till I can PU in the first week in Sept, not totally in the drivers seat do to distance and a promise!!
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/tls/4617197128.html
Measure once, cut as many times as needed to get it right! Bob
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
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JPG
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 35600
- Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 7:42 pm
- Location: Lexington, Ky (TAMECAT territory)
Good Boy!rbursek wrote:Steve.
Who is Skip?? or was that a Ha Ha??
I feel like a rescue dog/cat person!!! Just closed a deal on this for 250.00 a Gentlemans agreement till I can PU in the first week in Sept, not totally in the drivers seat do to distance and a promise!!
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/tls/4617197128.html
Skip as in MKC Tools.
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╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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"Wild Bad Bob"
- Platinum Member
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- Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:03 pm
- Location: Germantown, Wi
Thanks JPg, will be most likely getting my belts for the Er speed changer from him, and instructions, in a few weeks.
Measure once, cut as many times as needed to get it right! Bob
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
56/57 Greenie with jointer, 85 Mark V with band saw, 63 Goldie with jointer, 3 ER 10s, 1951 vintage, Hernia from the Er 10s, Tool Shop SS clone 6" jointer, and 6" belt sander, Delta 10" TS, Buffalo 6" jointer, Craftsman 12" BS, 10" Ryobi planer. Compound Miter, and misc.
Not a problem!algale wrote:If the Wixey says it is off by 0.3 degrees it could be anywhere from 0.2 to 0.4 degrees in reality given the Wixey's advertised resolution is 0.1 degrees.
Just use a dirty, dull, dinged up drill bit and there'll be so much distortion in the hole you won't be able to tell how far off it is.
Mark V 520, Power-Pro!; Speed Reducer; B/S; Jointer; ShopMate DCS; SS Tenon Master; Rip-Strate; Incra; BCTW; DW734; var. SS sanding systems; Wood River;