Shopsmith, Are there shortcomings?

[sandyj]

I looked at that too. I don't see how it changes anything. Stock still tends to slide down the table toward the blade. If you tilt the SS table and mount the rip fence (with a sacrificial face) don't you have the same thing.

Hey Dusty,
The bevel ripping guide stays stationary on the table and the material slides along it. There are lips (@90 deg) either side of the blade that holds the material to stop it sliding down further into the blade. Their adjustable angle mitre gauge slides along the larger angle in a slot. The whole thing tilts from about 5 degrees to about 60 from memory.
I had one but rarely used it and when I did the material had to be long enough to be supported on the lips either side of the cut. Also getting the angle set to the same at both ends was a pain. But it overcame that systems shortcomings.
Regards
Sandy

[charlese]

To get back to Dusty's original question. No! The tilting table does not offer or present any shortcomings.

For those writing on the report Dusty read - They simply didn't understand the Mark V. As Nick said, (quotes from memory & completely out of context) "The Mark V is simply one big jig." "It is a tool for those with imagination" "The Mark V is not often used in professional shops because it is too complicated"

Observing that often those that can't work with a machine will criticize it. We all have read that the table will tilt or lean when we don't want it to. Others have pointed out the table can be stabilized by using the extension table and rail tubes, an/or support legs.

Does the Mark V become dangerous when sawing bevels? No! No more than sawing with a flat table. The changed feeling of ripping or crosscutting on a tilted table may be a little different, but if one only used the Mark V for sawing bevels, it would become second nature. Then if the table were made level - the question might be asked - when sawing with a flat table, is the Mark V dangerous or are there shortcomings?

Gotta love the old photo at the top of page 3 given us by easterngray (Alec)! There always are multiple ways to 'skin a cat'.

[dusty]

There has been some great discussion here but there could certainly be more. There has been 600 views of this thread but only thirty one responses from only eighteen respondents. Wouldn't it be great if more of the lurking viewers and the guests would comment.

No, a guest can't comment but a guest can register and become a viewer who can comment.

This forum would be so much more valuable to us all if more people would express their feelings and vocalize their experiences in the woodshop. All woodworkers or persons interested in woodworking.....speakup, come join the group.

[kd6vpe]

My wife wants me to make some more birdhouses. And they require bevel cuts to make staves for creating a round shaped house. I don't have a stand alone TS just my SS. Guess what the only thing that I can complain about is I have not had the time to get out there and do it. That old picture came out of the PTFE book I believe that is where I had seen it before. Anyway to keep things short I am learning that when I take my time and study what I want to do my SS it will do it. PTFE has examples and this forum has examples. And of course the sawdust sessions I just have to wait to get to work for those. So everyone as it has been said and I have learned.

Plan Test and Execute it is so much fun.

[brown_hawk]

25 years ago, the original Mark V had a table about half the size of the present ones, and one extension table, also much smaller than the present ones.

Given a 24" wide board needing to be crosscut, the small table and extension was hard to work with. And putting a bevel on a 24"x24" was a pain. (Imagine handling the top and bottom of the coffee table on that old machine. Because I actually did it.)

So pre 510, there was a little validity to the large panel and hard bevel argument. Large panels weren't so easy on table saws either, because their tables weren't that big.

With the 510/520, the argument no longer holds. It's 25 years out of date. Like comparing the things you can do with a 1982 Delta Saw with the capabilities of a brand new 520 in table saw mode. (Can you say "Dust Collection?')

As far as running a 4'x8' sheet of ply on your TS? Get real! It's a straw man argument unless you have all kinds of extension tables to properly support it, and that costs $$$, making it impractical for almost every normal person.

Bottom line, there are things I can do easier on a SS in TS mode than I can do on a Delta, and vice versa.

And as far as the 1980 Mark V, the ONLY reason the coffee table has turned posts is because the SS is also a lathe and I got the lathe tools with it. (Picture reposted so you don't have to go back and find it.

Hawk

[dickg1]

Dusty,

I'll stop lurking, athough I will revert after this comment. I bought my Mark V, new, in 1964. I have built quite a few cabinets and jewelry boxes and other stuff thru the years, as well as adding or finishing rooms to/in my various homes. (I retired from the Air Force in 1974). I know that I have tilted the table on occasion and except for counting my fingers after all cuts (horizontal and tilted) I never considered it a real problem. Frankly, even on that "small table" I guess it never crossed my mind that there should be another way. (I didn't read anything but my flight manuals and college text books thru those years).

Within the past year, my wife decided, with my concurance, that our present kitchen needed expansion so I decided to clean (de-rustify) my Magna Mark V, upgrade to the latest 520, get a few add-ons (actually quite a few add-ons) and fix a space in my garage for the workshop.

Except for making some interesting stuff for Ringling Bros. circus acrobats (I am good friends with a retired high wire walker who was with Ringling), it has been too cold here in NJ to spend too much time in the garage. So cabinet making starts in earnest in a few weeks.

But getting to the point, I do have a compound mitre saw, but have no qualms to tilting the table on the 520 for certain cuts. I will continue to count my fingers before and after every cut. Back in my pilot days, we figured the takeoffs and safe landings should be exactly equal, it's the same way with fingers, ten before and ten after every cut.

Now back to lurking and learning. Dusty, you started an interesting thread!

Dickg1

[dusty]

Thank you dickg1 for the kind words but with that having been said, I'm going to try to redirect this discussion to:

SS Tilting Table, Does it Create Limitations?

Please, if anyone feels that the Shopsmith has other limitations (like the table on the 500 is just too darn small) or (the rip fence is not reliable - it needs to lock on the outfeed end) state so here.

What I hope we can do is discover that those negative opinions of the Shopsmith are all being dealt with by Shopsmith and that they no longer need be true.

The fact that there are so many 500s out there, still being used is in itself a tribute to the quality and versatility of the Shopsmith. The fact that you can still maintain and/or upgrade those old machines is a tribute to Shopsmith, Inc and the staff that makes this a reality.

[dickg1]

Dusty,

I didn't bring this in my last note up because of changing the direction of the thread. When I started using my Magna Shopsmith Mark V back in the 60's I purchased the router set up available at the time. Now I have to admit I haven't used my 520 as a router yet (I did upgrade to the compatible router kit), but back in the old days nobody told me it wasn't a good router. So I just went ahead and made all my cabinet moldings. I used walnut and cherry and they turned out fine. So, now I find, after all these years that it really isn't that good, too slow, and I need to speed it up.

In my mind, this is another of those urban legends that some are keeping alive. It would be interesting to know how many have the router kit and have used it and how many just think it won't do a good job because somebody said it wouldn't.

O.K. I stopped lurking.

Dickg1

[paulmcohen]

There has been some great discussion here but there could certainly be more. There has been 600 views of this thread but only thirty one responses from only eighteen respondents. Wouldn't it be great if more of the lurking viewers and the guests would comment.

No, a guest can't comment but a guest can register and become a viewer who can comment.

This forum would be so much more valuable to us all if more people would express their feelings and vocalize their experiences in the woodshop. All woodworkers or persons interested in woodworking.....speakup, come join the group.

Even registered users don't have to comment. I have never used the tilting table feature of the table saw. I use the tilting table all the time for other features (drill press, sanding disk...) so what can I add, I still enjoy reading all the threads.

[paulmcohen]

Dusty,
In my mind, this is another of those urban legends that some are keeping alive. It would be interesting to know how many have the router kit and have used it and how many just think it won't do a good job because somebody said it wouldn't.

O.K. I stopped lurking.

Dickg1

Here I have an opinion, my first router was the Shopsmith and I was never happy with the results. Speed may have been one factor but router bits without carbide edges may have been a bigger factor.

I sold all the router stuff years ago and purchased a standalone plunge router and built a standalone router table. I am seriously considering selling the table and getting one integrated into the Shopsmith but that discussion needs to be in another thread.