JPG40504 wrote:Terminology again! The ground conductor(green when colored) serves to provide a path to "ground" in the event of a fault(short/leakage) to the external surface of the appliance(which would pose a hazard to anyone touching the appliance). The ground wire maintains the external surface of the appliance at 'ground' potental. The ground conductor is knot intended to serve any other purpose and should NEVER be conducting any current EXCEPT fault current. It is connected, but just sits there doing nothing until a fault occurs.
The neutral conductor(white when colored) serves to conduct any current due to 115v loads. Thus the neutral ONLY serves to conduct this imbalance in currents between the two 230v conductors. If two EQUAL 115v loads were on each of the 230V conductors, there would be NO current in the neutral.
Since the purpose of the breaker is to protect the wiring, an excessive current in ONE pole will cause the breaker to trip. Since this can cause an unexpected condition in any appliance connected, the second pole is simultaneously tripped(mechanically connected).
Not sure how this is helping putttn with his motor problem, but perhaps we are all learning something here.
That's what I said: The ground wire and the neutral wire service both hots: Each hot is knot serviced by it's own ground and it's own neutral.
Tim
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a1gutterman wrote:That's what I said: The ground wire and the neutral wire service both hots: Each hot is knot serviced by it's own ground and it's own neutral.
Perhaps, but I think a whole lot less. Not sure what you mean by "serviced". In 230v branches, pairs of wires are knot relevant. It is a 3 wire system(hot1,hot2,neutral).
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╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
JPG40504 wrote:Perhaps, but I think a whole lot less. Not sure what you mean by "serviced". In 230v branches, pairs of wires are knot relevant. It is a 3 wire system(hot1,hot2,neutral).
What I mean by "serviced" is that every circuit (code in WA anyway) must have a neutral and a ground. The 4 wire 220/240v circuit is actually two circuits (each one being fed by a seperate pole) but they share one neutral and one ground.
Tim
Buying US made products will help keep YOUR job or retirement funds safer.
a1gutterman wrote:What I mean by "serviced" is that every circuit (code in WA anyway) must have a neutral and a ground. The 4 wire 220/240v circuit is actually two circuits (each one being fed by a seperate pole) but they share one neutral and one ground.
A 240V Branch circuit to a 'dedicated'(single) appliance with NO 115v loads does NOT require a neutral. That does KNOT include a branch circuit with a receptacle. The use of a receptacle implies it is going to be used by a "portable" appliance. This implies a potential need for the neutral(What may at some time be plugged into the receptacle is UNKNOWN).
We only disagree in your insistence that a 230V(4 wire, 2 hot, 1 neutral, 1 ground) is actually TWO circuits. It is one branch circuit capable of supplying either 230V OR 115V loads OR BOTH(at the same time). The currents in each conductor(hot/hot/neutral) is determined by the load(s). Each 'hot' is protected by a breaker(mechanically connected) to limit the current flowing in each 'hot' conductor. The current in the neutral will NEVER exceed the current limit set for the 'hot' conductors. Only the difference between the currents flowing in the two "hot" conductors will flow in the neutral.
The 'ground' should NEVER conduct any current until a fault to external surface of the appliance occurs. It THEN provides a path to 'ground' and keeps the voltage on the surface of the appliance = 0 = earth(ground).
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╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
JPG40504 wrote:......
The 'ground' should NEVER conduct any current until a fault to external surface of the appliance occurs. It THEN provides a path to 'ground' and keeps the voltage on the surface of the appliance = 0 = earth(ground).
I've always been puzzled by this thinking. How can current flow through the neutral, but not through the ground, when in many cases they are connected to the same buss bar? Actually, aren't both the neutral and the ground wires grounds circuits? If the neutral wire in a metal appliance shorts to the case, it will be grounded, with no effect to the appliance user, as long as the user isn't grounded. But the green wire will carry a current.
Back when when everyone had two wire circuits and we got a shock from the case, we just turned over the two prong plug.
Octogenarian's have an earned right to be a curmudgeon.
Chuck in Lancaster, CA
