Are you getting a PowerPro?

[dusty]

Yes, Ed, you are a perpetual naysayer. You are also correct when you say you can buy a shop full of equipment for $1900. But a shop full of equipment is not what I want.

I want a shop full of equipment that will provide, quality, precision and sustainability for a couple decades or more. I can count on that from what I have from Shopsmith. I doubt that you would be able to with what you offer up for your $1900.

Now if you can get a shop full of Festool for that price - go ahead. You win. However, I doubt that you will even crowd your work bench with $1900 worth of Festool. It will be quality equipment though. Is it sustainable - I don't know. But my Shopsmith is!

[Ed in Tampa]

Yes, Ed, you are a perpetual naysayer. You are also correct when you say you can buy a shop full of equipment for $1900. But a shop full of equipment is not what I want.

I want a shop full of equipment that will provide, quality, precision and sustainability for a couple decades or more. I can count on that from what I have from Shopsmith. I doubt that you would be able to with what you offer up for your $1900.

Now if you can get a shop full of Festool for that price - go ahead. You win. However, I doubt that you will even crowd your work bench with $1900 worth of Festool. It will be quality equipment though. Is it sustainable - I don't know. But my Shopsmith is!

Dusty
Yea I guess I am the perpetual naysayer.
However how many in today's throw it away get it new generation cares about how long the tool lasts. Look around in almost every technology a tool that is over 5 years old is so far behind in features that no one wants it. If you haven't noticed most tool manufactures are adding new features, new technologies to their line each year.

Tell me this when was the last time you heard of a Unisaw needing a part? For that matter when was the last time you heard of a $600 Ridgid TS3650 needing a part? And even if they did need a part I would guess bearings would be the most common failure and they are sold on the open market. Even a very low quality saw used in the average home hobbiest shop should last 2 or 3 generations with no need for any part.

Hey I hope I'm wrong but I think this upgrade is priced too high. Had the price been $500-$900 range instead of the $1500-$1900 range I would be singing a totally different song.
Again my opinion. And to keep the peace and so I'm not accused of being a negative attitude I will say no more on this subject.

Editted to add this PS. If the economy of Europe continues it's trip south much longer I will be able to fill my shop with Festools for $1900.

[dusty]

Dusty
Yea I guess I am the perpetual naysayer.
However how many in today's throw it away get it new generation cares about how long the tool lasts. Look around in almost every technology a tool that is over 5 years old is so far behind in features that no one wants it. If you haven't noticed most tool manufactures are adding new features, new technologies to their line each year.

Tell me this when was the last time you heard of a Unisaw needing a part? For that matter when was the last time you heard of a $600 Ridgid TS3650 needing a part? And even if they did need a part I would guess bearings would be the most common failure and they are sold on the open market. Even a very low quality saw used in the average home hobbiest shop should last 2 or 3 generations with no need for any part.

Hey I hope I'm wrong but I think this upgrade is priced too high. Had the price been $500-$900 range instead of the $1500-$1900 range I would be singing a totally different song.
Again my opinion. And to keep the peace and so I'm not accused of being a negative attitude I will say no more on this subject.

Editted to add this PS. If the economy of Europe continues it's trip south much longer I will be able to fill my shop with Festools for $1900.

Ed, when you bring Unisaw into the discussion you are playing dirty. I would love to have a Unisaw sitting at the heart of my shop but if I did I would have no room left for a work bench let alone the rest of the tools that comprise a full up shop. You would also use up most of that $1900 you have to spend.

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=Delta+Unisaw&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=16400929181697848833&ei=j9wjTNrlJ8GqlAfhp4gx&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCsQ8wIwAA#

As for that low quality, long lasting saw. I don't think so. I find too many of them in garage sales, flea markets, etc.

REMEMBER, PLEASE - we are talking about small hobby shops and not commercial operations. When discussing the professional work shop, I believe a completely different set of rules prevail. What I have in my shop wasn't put there after a single shopping trip to the hardware store. It was accumulated over many years and was supported by a rather meager budget; that of an active duty, enlisted military member with three dependents.

[shipwright]

Just a note, a little off topic. Dusty, I just looked up your link for the Unisaw. Wow, that's up about 50 percent from what I payed six years ago and I have the Unifence which IMHO is twice the fence that the Biesemeyer is. Times change but prices only go one way it seems.

Paul M

[robinson46176]

Ed, part of your problem may be that you are living in the wrong place and it is depressing you...
The economy must be a lot worse there than here. Stuff "IS" down but nothing like you report. Our local economy got quite a boost from the REX gas pipeline coming through here from out west heading to the east coast. It is a 42" (IIRC) high pressure line and it passed across here just a mile south of me. "HUGE" operation. The local base camp was on about 60 acres. Huge number of employees and many had spouses along. Some rented houses, some stayed in motels. All ate at local restaurants and shopped at local merchants. They have moved on now but road construction has just gone nuts here.
The housing bubble was just crazy here before and it is seriously down. When the bubble broke there were 1500 homes ready to go up between me and town. Now I doubt that more than 20 homes are going up at the moment. I'm not sure that is all bad. Too much too fast before. County wide I doubt that there are more than 75 or 80 homes currently under construction right now.
They are ready to start a new 300 to 400 unit apartment complex between my farm and town. They haven't started actual work but the approval went through a while back.
When we went to lunch today we passed 3 new commercial buildings about half built and they have 3 more pads ready across the front of the center. One is going to be a White Castle. One of the anchor stores is going to be a Lowes home center.
There are two horse race track / casinos (called Racinos) in central Indiana. One is about 6 miles north of me and is making millions. The other is about 40 miles north of me and close to bankruptcy.
A grandson and the husband of a granddaughter both work in a local countertop factory and both are working overtime each week. Nobody that I know locally including my flock of grandchildren have had any problem finding work. Of course many are perhaps "under-employed" working at fast food jobs etc. I only go to one of the 3 McDonald's in town but I notice that they hire mostly senior folks. Walmart also hires a lot of seniors.
They put a new Honda plant in about 15 to 17 miles south east of me that was supposed to employee 2500 but I don't believe it is up to near that yet but it is still chugging along.
Things are fairly tough for a lot of folks here but nothing like reports I hear from other areas.
-
I do have one problem... My wife stopped at a BP station about a week ago and now our van is leaking oil...

[boostfan]

I am in the maybe later crowd. I need two things, first to hear some positive reviews. Second, I need to rationalize what I will use the added capability for?

In terms of the magazine reviews, I can't imagine them doing much until SS releases complete machines with the powerpro feature. I just can't recall an upgrade product to a specific manufacturer like that being reviewed.

I have worked closely with the performance automotive media and they are pardon my French "whores" to their advertisers. I quickly decided it was not worth the couple extra dollars I was making working for them. I hope I am wrong but i suspect that the woodworking industry would be the same.

[ryanbp01]

Well, to get this back on track, I've noticed that the "maybe laters" are a little above 38%. As I alluded to earlier I am willing to wait and see how others fare before I make the plunge. Maybe this would be a good time for Shopsmith to hit the road with the demos they used to do? Videos are nice, but I would prefer to see the real thing in use. That is how I purchased my 520 back in 2003. If I had to rely on what is on the internet, I doubt I would have gotten it. This would also introduce the new PowerPro to a whole new audience, some of whom I'm willing to bet think the Shopsmith is no longer being made. This reminds me of what Mark Twain said when his obituary appeared: "Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated".

BPR

[riot_nrrd]

DIY kit ordered from the second batch. Now I'm counting the days....

There have been a few people that seem to be questioning why someone would be willing to pay this much? Simple answers for me:

1.) Don't have space for a huge set up (I'll try to post pictures of my garage/shop sometime... I have all kinds of racks and such to maximize use of space)

2.) I do need(want) the HP upgrade. I'm tired of tripping the breaker when I try to cut a 45 degree bevel on a 2X4. The load center is in the basement, and its a pain to go reset. Having the extra HP (I'm thinking I'll run a 220 circuit so I can get the full beef) will be nice. A thin kerf blade and a well-aligned fence can only take you so far.

So for me, the convenience combined with extra push creates an option I could not otherwise enjoy. If I wanted to go with stand-alone tools, I could have a tablesaw OR a jointer OR a planer OR and bandsaw OR a drillpress OR a lathe. Prior to buying the Shopsmith, living in rural PA, I had a drill press, a table saw, a radial arm saw, and a workbench set up in the basement. When I moved to the DC burbs, it became nearly impossible to use them because I had no room in the garage. The Shopsmith (and now my fancy rolling workbench I built) have been a great solution. Adding the muscle will (hopefully) make it almost perfect.

[stephen_a._draper]

I will wait until a year after the Power Pro has been introduced. The price should come down by then when they have sales at 25% off. I just finished restoring my Mark V to brand new status so I can wait a little longer. New products have to recoup the R&D cost and there are 600,00 Mark V owners out there so there is plenty of market for the Power Pro for several years to come. Also, when Shopsmith is shipping new Mark V's with the Power Pro as standard fare instead of the current headstock you will know they have worked out all the problems and will be around to provide service for years to come.

[fjimp]

I will place my order in a few days. Today I am still shell shocked at the cost of weddings and travel.