Shopsmith Forums

If I might let me cry on you shoulders for a minute.

I started yesterday by mowing the lawn. Of course I was out of gas so I jumped in my truck and immediately pulled the passenger tail light out of my truck by hooking it on the Shopsmith table. Made me real happy. Now I have a broken tail light and who knows what damage to the SS.

I got the gas filled the tractor and proceed to crank it. In the colder months it starts with 5 seconds of cranking in the summer it cranks and cranks before starting. Everyone said is was valve lifter adjustment so I did them about 2 weeks ago no change. I think it is flooded which says bad float or sticking jet pin to me. However the carb has more wires going into it than my car does. Anyone know why there is what appears to be solenoid attached to the bottom of the carb?


In any case it did barely cranked and I figured the battery was low so I got my jumpers and jumpered it. Nothing now the starter solenoid would not kick in. I figured bad battery connection. Cleaned them and still even the solenoid won't click.

So I used the jumper to starter and got the engine cranking again cranked forever. Then I remembered to turn the key on. Cranked some more and it finally fired. But I couldn't hear my truck running so it sat there and idled the whole time I mowed. Happiness!

Somewhere in the mowing dog crap got sling up on me and of course I didn't realize it until I ran my hands through it. Happiness again.

Got the lawn mowed, shut of the truck and started to try to figure out why the thing won't even crank. This thing as 3 wiring harnasses and they don't keep the same colored wire through a connector. I thought it might be where I jumpered around a bad clutch switch. Problem years ago. I checked and sure enough the jumper was broken and fell off in my hands.

Figureed that was the problem so this time I soldered the wires rather than jumper them. problem fix? No the thing still sits there like a lump.

I was so mad so tired so frustrated I simply pushed it into place and when inside. Pushing it back in place caused it to snag a throw rug my wife has by the door. I spent 15 more minutes trying to untangle it from the mower.

If you read through all of this you know my pain.

Three questions
The starter solenoid has 4 terminals. One from battery and one to start and two small control type wires. Any idea why two and not just one to kick in the solenoid?

Any idea of a obvious problem causing flooding only in very warm weather?

What is the solenoid or the thing that looks like a solenoid on the bottom of the Carb?

One more question anyone want to buy a Toro Lawn Tractor that won't start from the key but runs like a top.

That is quite some story. I've given up on Toro. I have a Toro 521 snow blower that is 28 years old and still starts just fine, but I had a 7 year old Toro Self-Pace lawn mower that was a major headache to start. I finally gave it away this spring. Like yours, once it started it was great! I had it in the shop more times that I can count. It would be fine for a few months and then the problem(s) would begin again.

Good luck!

Hey Ed-

Try goats or sheep to mow the yard!:D Seriously though I do feel your pain. One question: how did you manage to hook the taillight wire onto the Shopsmith?
BPR

I still believe a listening ear is worth a great deal when a day's work has gone really wrong, and of course if you can gain some wisdom then it keeps it from being a total loss. The dog crap part of your story is funny, as dog crap on others mostly is, but it's also a story most of us have had happen to us. I too have taken out a tail light on my truck, in my case by backing into a tree that I planted, and been shocked at the cost of replacing it which only added pain to emotional injury. So even though you can't buy a cup of coffee with those of us out here who empathize with your bad day, please know there are plenty of us.Finally, I don't know a damn thing about Toros. I'm a John Deere man.

Ed
Some older cars had a solenoid either mounted on the carb or somewhere near the throttle linkage. It's purpose was to hold the accelerator butterfly open slightly for idle speed but it would close when the ignition was turned off to prevent dieseling. When they were shut off the butterfly was pulled tightly closed and fuel/air mix could not get into the intake. Was part of some anti pollution systems. Don't know what the extra wires were for. Maybe a carb heater?
Bill V

Ed,

If that was a wonderful day, I'd hate to hear about one of your bad ones.

Roy

ryanbp01 wrote:Hey Ed-

Try goats or sheep to mow the yard!:D Seriously though I do feel your pain. One question: how did you manage to hook the taillight wire onto the Shopsmith?
BPR

Well I back my truck into the garage on the side where my SS sets. I pull over as tight as I can so no one can walk into my garage and take some tool that is stored along the wall. Also when I'm over far you can park the car more in the middle and swing all doors opened.

I was pulling out and I didn't want my mirror to hit the door frame so I swing the front of the truck away from the frame which swing the back in against the SS. The Aux table front rail hooked the bezel of the tail light which wraps around the side of the truck as a side marker light. Of course the bezel and part of the lense broke so I will have to epoxy it back together.

I don't want to get too fancy after all the truck is 24 years old 1990 Dodge Dakota. I use it to run to home depot.

I'm more worried about the SS but I'm afraid to look. I'll wait and do that Monday so I can still enjoy the weekend.

The light caught on the front rail. I am guessing I will probably have to rail alignment and then the Aux table.

However I might have to do the main because the Aux table was tight against the main table. Like I said I didn't look

I'm pretty sure I didn't bend the fence rail, or as sure as I can be with out getting close and looking.

Hi, Ed! I can feel your pain. Time for a cool glass of something and feet up for a while.

"Anyone know why there is what appears to be solenoid attached to the bottom of the carb?"

Is your fuel tank higher than the carb float?

If so, that solenoid is to prevent the fuel slowly leaking past the needle valve, and flooding out the engine. My brother's old Toro did that one winter, and leaked about a half gallon into the oil sump.

His replacement, 3 years old, has already had a new engine in it, and an ignition switch. The old one got converted completely to a tractor, and just needs a new gas tank to be finished (we pulled off the mowing deck.)

The new one has some kind of compression release mechanism, to make starting easier, but that doesn't work unless the engine is hot. We couldn't get it to turn over one day, so we got his 1/2 inch (POWERFUL!) drill, and pulled off the screen over the flywheel, and started it that way. That drill is so strong, if you hit a hidden nail or something in a piece of wood, it'll rip the drill out of your hands.

steve

The entire tailight assembly is $13 from Rock Auto and its usually a single bolt from towards the tail gate to remove. That's not enough time or money to risk the ticket or worse. That's a pet peeve of cops.

On a 4 pole starter solenoid:
1 is the hot wire from the battery
1 is the start from the ignition
1 is the hot wire to the starter motor
the 4th is ground.

As opposed to a 3 pole solenoid which is grounded through the housing.

As far as hard starting in summer, I would lean towards valves not completely seating or not enough spark to ignite summer blend gas with beau coup ethanol. Try and find ethanol free gas somewhere (we still have ethanol free premium in places near me) and use fresh plugs. If that doesn't work you may need to pull the head and have your valves lapped and seats ground.