After reflecting on the postings about the financial problems at Shopsmith I began to think of what changes they might plan... bad things come to mind like changing the customer service, not stocking parts, higher prices, and well it is not to hard to come up with a lot of things that I would not like to see happen.
The most positive thing that I can personal do is to help their bottom line by stopping my ebay purchases and get my shopsmith needs filled by shopsmith. While I'm a retired person living on a pension this will be a bit of a financial burden for me but if it helps to keep the shopsmith company we all know and love around for more years it will be worth it in the long run. After all I have two shopsmiths I'm hoping to pass on to my kids.
So that is my plan... I always did like "Don Quixote"
Ed
Other ideas?
How can we help Shopsmith?
Moderators: HopefulSSer, admin
One of the most valuable things you can do, Ed, is to lean on the editors of those woodworking magazines to which you subscribe. Whenever they compare power tools, we are ALWAYS left out. To a certain extent, I can understand this -- the Mark V is a hard tool to classify. You really can't compare it to stand-alone power table saws and disc sanders.
On the other hand, we do manufacture some very good stand-alone tools. Our pro-planer, scrollsaw, and belt sander are second to none -- they would do extremely well in an honest comparison. The overhead router, if it were tested toe-to-toe with commercial router tables, would run away with the field. Many professional carvers use our strip sander with the sharpening attachment and swear it's the best sharpening system on the market. Yet we can't get most editors to consider us at all. The excuse is that all our tools, because they are designed to be mounted on the Mark V, are part of a unique, proprietary system. It seems to make no difference that they all can be mounted on their own stand with their own motor. Not only can't we get anybody to ask us to dance, we're never invited to the party.
Next time you see Shopsmith is left out of a tool comparison, complain to the editor AND his publisher. Believe me, that will get their attention. And maybe we'll get a few invitations.
With all good wishes,
On the other hand, we do manufacture some very good stand-alone tools. Our pro-planer, scrollsaw, and belt sander are second to none -- they would do extremely well in an honest comparison. The overhead router, if it were tested toe-to-toe with commercial router tables, would run away with the field. Many professional carvers use our strip sander with the sharpening attachment and swear it's the best sharpening system on the market. Yet we can't get most editors to consider us at all. The excuse is that all our tools, because they are designed to be mounted on the Mark V, are part of a unique, proprietary system. It seems to make no difference that they all can be mounted on their own stand with their own motor. Not only can't we get anybody to ask us to dance, we're never invited to the party.
Next time you see Shopsmith is left out of a tool comparison, complain to the editor AND his publisher. Believe me, that will get their attention. And maybe we'll get a few invitations.
With all good wishes,
Nick Engler
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
http://www.workshopcompanion.com
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dusty
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 21374
- Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
- Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona
How Can We Help
Nick
I have no basis to disagree with any of your comments but - take a good look at your own advertising efforts. Shopsmith does very little to promote anything other than the 5-in-1 power tool. Even at the trade shows (home shows) and Lowes demonsrations, we never see a surface planer or jointer.
Usually, there is a bandsaw. This is frequently offered as part of a promotional package.
Maybe the small Shopsmith van is not large enough. Consider going to these shows with more of the product line. Bring bits and pieces, spare parts, etc to the shows. Help me avoid shipping costs by stocking the consumables like bandsaw blades, knives, sanding disks, etc.
I know. The bean counters tell you there is no profit in that, the expenses are too great. It is too costly to staff a road team.
I'd bet that you could put together a road team to support a demo in a Tucson mall or Lowes without paying any travel costs.
Modify (update) the CDs. The Shopsmith demo cd is good but it is the same script that I have on the VHS video that I received with my Shopsmith way back when. Expand it to include the other tools, ACTIVELY MARKET something in addition to the 5in1 concept.
If I wanted a sanding station, I can find one advertised but it won't be a Shopsmith. If I am not a Shopsmith user, I don't even know about the power station, belt sander, strip sander, sanding drums and sanding disks. This is a powerful tool that could be used just as well by some guy with a big green table saw.
putttn could use it even after he gets his Williams and Hussey planer/jointer.
I have no basis to disagree with any of your comments but - take a good look at your own advertising efforts. Shopsmith does very little to promote anything other than the 5-in-1 power tool. Even at the trade shows (home shows) and Lowes demonsrations, we never see a surface planer or jointer.
Usually, there is a bandsaw. This is frequently offered as part of a promotional package.
Maybe the small Shopsmith van is not large enough. Consider going to these shows with more of the product line. Bring bits and pieces, spare parts, etc to the shows. Help me avoid shipping costs by stocking the consumables like bandsaw blades, knives, sanding disks, etc.
I know. The bean counters tell you there is no profit in that, the expenses are too great. It is too costly to staff a road team.
I'd bet that you could put together a road team to support a demo in a Tucson mall or Lowes without paying any travel costs.
Modify (update) the CDs. The Shopsmith demo cd is good but it is the same script that I have on the VHS video that I received with my Shopsmith way back when. Expand it to include the other tools, ACTIVELY MARKET something in addition to the 5in1 concept.
If I wanted a sanding station, I can find one advertised but it won't be a Shopsmith. If I am not a Shopsmith user, I don't even know about the power station, belt sander, strip sander, sanding drums and sanding disks. This is a powerful tool that could be used just as well by some guy with a big green table saw.
putttn could use it even after he gets his Williams and Hussey planer/jointer.
customer support is worth $$$
Ed, I think you're right on about the eBay purchases. I'd bet at least 30-40% of the price of Shopsmith parts ultimately goes toward what I think we'll all agree is excellent customer support. Since I don't have much free time as it is, I'm happy to pay a higher price to continue that support.
I've only needed to call for tech support twice (bandsaw tracking and Lift-Assist installation issues). Both times the problem was fixed with less than 5 minutes of discussion, and I was back in the garage making sawdust.
A friend was telling me about the 8-10 hours on the phone, over a two-week period, it took to get his $300 Dell computer back up and running. Seems the technical support personnel in India just weren't all that familiar with the US versions of software he was using.
You know, I'd really hate it if Shopsmith was forced to outsource their customer support as a result of cutting prices....
All right, I'll get off my soapbox now.
Nick, thanks for bringing up an issue that I'd never considered!
Gary
I've only needed to call for tech support twice (bandsaw tracking and Lift-Assist installation issues). Both times the problem was fixed with less than 5 minutes of discussion, and I was back in the garage making sawdust.
A friend was telling me about the 8-10 hours on the phone, over a two-week period, it took to get his $300 Dell computer back up and running. Seems the technical support personnel in India just weren't all that familiar with the US versions of software he was using.
You know, I'd really hate it if Shopsmith was forced to outsource their customer support as a result of cutting prices....
All right, I'll get off my soapbox now.
Nick, thanks for bringing up an issue that I'd never considered!
Gary
Please if we can keep the postings to things WE can do and comments about that...... giving advice to shopsmith unless they ask for it will most likely result with little success no mater how good it is. By the way feel free to start a thread on advice for shopsmith if you wish.
To add on to Nicks idea... when was the last time you saw a shop project where a shopsmith was pictured and used for the project in one of the woodworking magazines?? How about someone upgrading the 500 to a 510 or 520..... someone restoring an older machine or how about someone showing a tune-up of a shopsmith.
I have no idea how many shopsmith machines are out there but one would think a magazine might be interested in some submissions.... especial if they got some email asking for some shopsmith coverage???
Heck even I would mind getting published....... how about you?
Ed
To add on to Nicks idea... when was the last time you saw a shop project where a shopsmith was pictured and used for the project in one of the woodworking magazines?? How about someone upgrading the 500 to a 510 or 520..... someone restoring an older machine or how about someone showing a tune-up of a shopsmith.
I have no idea how many shopsmith machines are out there but one would think a magazine might be interested in some submissions.... especial if they got some email asking for some shopsmith coverage???
Heck even I would mind getting published....... how about you?
Ed
Two ideas come to mind and both are a win win situation.
The first is that as many that can make it a priority to buy something from Shopsmith in the next 3 months. Add that belt sander or strip sander that you have been thinking about for years. They really do have many products that we all could use to benefit our shop and unless we help the only way in the future to get the product will be on e-bay.
The second is to attend a class with Nick at the Academy. It is easy to see they are working hard to add classes that will appeal to all. Why not plan on attending one in 2007?
The future of any company depends both on current customers and new customers. As our friends and family see all the things that the Shopsmith can do they will be bitten just like we were to own the fine product.
The first is that as many that can make it a priority to buy something from Shopsmith in the next 3 months. Add that belt sander or strip sander that you have been thinking about for years. They really do have many products that we all could use to benefit our shop and unless we help the only way in the future to get the product will be on e-bay.
The second is to attend a class with Nick at the Academy. It is easy to see they are working hard to add classes that will appeal to all. Why not plan on attending one in 2007?
The future of any company depends both on current customers and new customers. As our friends and family see all the things that the Shopsmith can do they will be bitten just like we were to own the fine product.
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Ed in Tampa
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 5832
- Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2006 12:45 am
- Location: North Tampa Bay area Florida
Nick
I tend to agree with the other Ed (two Ed's are better than one... sorry about that)
Shopsmith needs to market their other tools better. I know little about the planner, scrollsaw, belt sander, overhead router. Yes I know Shopsmith makes them but I have never seen Shopsmith really advertise them.
The overhead router in particular. I jumping on and off the horse trying to decide about a router table. I have a rough one I presently use but I'm really interested in replacing it. In one or two posts the overhead router has been hinted at to be better than a router table but that was all that was said. Why not make a demo CD showing what can be done, why it is more versatile and what it has over just a router table and send it out with the next catalogue.
I'm also thinking on and off about a scroll saw. I have tried a Dewalt, and Delta and even a Dremel and Ryobi but I have never had a chance to get my hands on a Shopsmith one.
In another thread I said I thought the SS planner was too expensive, that Dewalt or Delta presented a better bargain. Then someone mentioned something I can't remember what (I also can't find it in the thread) that made sense to me and to me justified the SS price. I know after reading that post I set a mental note if my planner ever quites to reexamine the SS. YOu know I have have been a Shopsmith owner from the 80's and even had a Shop Smith store in my city, in fact I worked there one day to help out. But I never saw the Shopsmith planner in action. Not once. Yet I ran countless tests through the Dewalt and Delta before I bought.
I have looked and looked at the strip sander, and I had a strong hunch it was better at sharpening tools than even those $400 machines, yet until now no one has ever made a comparision like that to me.
There I think I have made my point I'm ready to bite on overhead router, scroll saw and strip sander and a planner if mine ever dies. But in fact short of the tiny blurb in the catalogue I know nothing about them. Seems like a great marketing opportunity to me.
Ed
I tend to agree with the other Ed (two Ed's are better than one... sorry about that)
Shopsmith needs to market their other tools better. I know little about the planner, scrollsaw, belt sander, overhead router. Yes I know Shopsmith makes them but I have never seen Shopsmith really advertise them.
The overhead router in particular. I jumping on and off the horse trying to decide about a router table. I have a rough one I presently use but I'm really interested in replacing it. In one or two posts the overhead router has been hinted at to be better than a router table but that was all that was said. Why not make a demo CD showing what can be done, why it is more versatile and what it has over just a router table and send it out with the next catalogue.
I'm also thinking on and off about a scroll saw. I have tried a Dewalt, and Delta and even a Dremel and Ryobi but I have never had a chance to get my hands on a Shopsmith one.
In another thread I said I thought the SS planner was too expensive, that Dewalt or Delta presented a better bargain. Then someone mentioned something I can't remember what (I also can't find it in the thread) that made sense to me and to me justified the SS price. I know after reading that post I set a mental note if my planner ever quites to reexamine the SS. YOu know I have have been a Shopsmith owner from the 80's and even had a Shop Smith store in my city, in fact I worked there one day to help out. But I never saw the Shopsmith planner in action. Not once. Yet I ran countless tests through the Dewalt and Delta before I bought.
I have looked and looked at the strip sander, and I had a strong hunch it was better at sharpening tools than even those $400 machines, yet until now no one has ever made a comparision like that to me.
There I think I have made my point I'm ready to bite on overhead router, scroll saw and strip sander and a planner if mine ever dies. But in fact short of the tiny blurb in the catalogue I know nothing about them. Seems like a great marketing opportunity to me.
Ed
Strip sander/planer
To Ed from Tampa:
I have the strip sander with the sharpening attachment and have found it
an excellent tool. It may not give you the super keen edge of the $400
water wheel but for under $100 it's good enough for everything I have
ever wanted to do. I have had the SS planer since the 80's, serial 01180,
and have put many a bf of oak through it. No problems, still runs like a
champ. I think that the lunchbox planers are only now getting as good as
the SS planer. When I bought most of my SS tools 20-26 years ago the
home shop hobbyist had few choices, there were only large stand alone
and SS. I chose SS and have no regrets. The asian sourcing of tools
has moderated the prices and given hobbyists more choices. I don't
think you would be disappointed with any of the SS products you are
considering. They do last forever.
All of the ideas to help the company are great. I can only remember
one mention of SS in a major woodworking magazine in the past few
years and that was in Popular Woodworking.
I have the strip sander with the sharpening attachment and have found it
an excellent tool. It may not give you the super keen edge of the $400
water wheel but for under $100 it's good enough for everything I have
ever wanted to do. I have had the SS planer since the 80's, serial 01180,
and have put many a bf of oak through it. No problems, still runs like a
champ. I think that the lunchbox planers are only now getting as good as
the SS planer. When I bought most of my SS tools 20-26 years ago the
home shop hobbyist had few choices, there were only large stand alone
and SS. I chose SS and have no regrets. The asian sourcing of tools
has moderated the prices and given hobbyists more choices. I don't
think you would be disappointed with any of the SS products you are
considering. They do last forever.
All of the ideas to help the company are great. I can only remember
one mention of SS in a major woodworking magazine in the past few
years and that was in Popular Woodworking.
I can not help but think thier is a lot SS could do to improve sales. I know I pretty much just stumbled upon SS while walking through the mall one day. For U.S. sales a well done Infomercal (yes I know most are cheesy but I did say well done). Sales to Europe and Asia a necessity. If you think our workspace is limited checkout the postage stamps they have around the rest of the world. The sales potential for this fantastic machine is just at the beginning. Better and more promotion combined with the great customer service has the potential to make sales and popularity sky rocket.
Enjoy a little sawdust therapy
Walt
520, Joiner, band saw, Planer, Dust Collector, 6: Belt Sander, OPR, Scroll Saw
Walt
520, Joiner, band saw, Planer, Dust Collector, 6: Belt Sander, OPR, Scroll Saw
Getting back to what "we" can do.......................
Increasing sales through "word of mouth" can be very effective if enough of us participate. We all have friends and relatives who perhaps know that we have a Shopsmith - but have never seen it or seen it in operation. Why not invite some of them over on a Saturday morning with coffee and donuts mixed with a little sawdust. Make it a couple of hours of casual no pressure demonstration with perhaps a little bit of "hands on" as well. This could even develop into a regular session. After all, the gals have their quilt night so fairs fair.
This would be a lot different from the "canned" demo's at Lowes
You will know when someone is beginning to "get the bug" when they ask to come over to saw or plane some boards. Sometimes the spark takes a while to generate but once someone sees what a Shopsmith can do they don't forget.
I'm planning to do this once I get finished with the re-model job on my garage/shop. Heck. I might even invite the tool manager from the local Lowes as well.
Increasing sales through "word of mouth" can be very effective if enough of us participate. We all have friends and relatives who perhaps know that we have a Shopsmith - but have never seen it or seen it in operation. Why not invite some of them over on a Saturday morning with coffee and donuts mixed with a little sawdust. Make it a couple of hours of casual no pressure demonstration with perhaps a little bit of "hands on" as well. This could even develop into a regular session. After all, the gals have their quilt night so fairs fair.
This would be a lot different from the "canned" demo's at Lowes
You will know when someone is beginning to "get the bug" when they ask to come over to saw or plane some boards. Sometimes the spark takes a while to generate but once someone sees what a Shopsmith can do they don't forget.
I'm planning to do this once I get finished with the re-model job on my garage/shop. Heck. I might even invite the tool manager from the local Lowes as well.