Shopsmith Forums

chapmanruss wrote: ↑Sun Dec 17, 2023 6:04 pm I have, to date, restored 24 Model 10's.

Russ,

I love the restoration pictures you have shown before on the forum. They are works of art IMHO, but also highly functional. Really would like to get my hands on one of them someday. I have an affinity for older (vintage) style tools that are well designed and the Model 10 is definitely one of those in my book.

RFGuy wrote: ↑Sun Dec 17, 2023 9:43 am ...The weak link in your system is the PP headstock IMHO. IF you have concerns about maintaining your investment, I might suggest you have replacement parts on hand or even a mechanical headstock as a backup...

From a maintainability and longevity perspective, the PowerPro is a concern. There is a lot that can go wrong with that supply chain, Shopsmith is only one link. And from my perspective, not the weakest link. I am a fan and will stick with PowerPro as long as it remains viable, but it ain't for everybody. If it becomes non-viable, I'll simply go back to the conventional headstock. Complete headstocks, parts to downgrade a PowerPro, and complete Marks are all readily available and I don't see this changing in my lifetime.

My preferred backup for those of us that have the space: I had a Power Station, it was adequate but I'm not a huge fan. I cut a conventional 520 down to a mini that I use as a preferred alternative to the Power Station. It's quieter, has more power, better speed range, will run a Jointer, etc. Only downside is a slightly larger footprint, but it can also store a second SPT. Comes with a complete set of extra tables to expand the table system of the M7. And has a complete fully functional headstock for those times when a PowerPro is down. If you don't want or need the extra tables you can typically do this for less money than a Power Station.

- David

DLB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 18, 2023 9:55 am From a maintainability and longevity perspective, the PowerPro is a concern. There is a lot that can go wrong with that supply chain, Shopsmith is only one link. And from my perspective, not the weakest link. I am a fan and will stick with PowerPro as long as it remains viable, but it ain't for everybody. If it becomes non-viable, I'll simply go back to the conventional headstock. Complete headstocks, parts to downgrade a PowerPro, and complete Marks are all readily available and I don't see this changing in my lifetime.

David,

Just to be clear, I wasn't saying Shopsmith was the weak link. I was saying should something happen to Shopsmith as a company, a PP is a weak link in a Shopsmith gear shop, i.e. the rest of the machine is more robust and not needing repair/replacement compared to the PP headstock. There are significantly fewer PP's on the street than conventional headstocks. Repairs of a conventional headstock will be more accessible and replacement parts more readily available as compared to the PP. This is exacerbated by Shopsmith having a full custom implementation of the StriaTech DVR motor done buy TeknaTool, so it isn't like you can easily shoehorn in replacement parts from the rest of the DVR motor marketplace. Unless one is willing and ready to get out their soldering iron, repairs of PP's in a post (apocalyptic) Shopsmith world will be much more difficult for PP owners compared to conventional headstock owners. At least, this is how I see it. Even if new service parts dry up for the conventional headstock, there will always be more used inventory that can be cannibalized for spare parts. Far fewer PP's out there to cannibalize is my point.

My statements are not meant to takeaway from the PP being higher performing, but like a high end sports car it can be hard to get parts and sometimes they can be fussy.

Honestly, I'm not so concerned about the ability to keep my current MK7 running, but rather that SS is discontinuing various accessories that I thought would be interesting to have, but I don't have a use for at the moment or don't want to spend the money on it just yet. For instance, when I first got the MK7, within a few months most of the shaper bits went on clearance. I know this is due to them not selling as well now that there are so many options for router bits. Around the same time, they discontinued the molder head and cutters. I know the jig saw went away a long time ago, but I'm rather surprised that the replacement - namely the scroll saw - wasn't a mark mounted accessory but just a product from a different vendor. I am glad that I picked up the planer before it went off the website. I'm not concerned about availability of parts for it as the main part would be blades, for which there are other sources currently. If my power pro were to give up the ghost, then I'd just get a used MK5 head on craigslist and keep going.

Basically, I had been looking at this as a system where I had gotten a great tool, and could expand it further in the future. However, it looks like the longer I go from the initial purchase, the fewer expansion options I will have. If nothing else, I can always just stick to what is being sold through Rockler/Woodcraft, but for many tools that I don't use often, I like the compactness of the SS system.

Adrian,

Thanks for the clarification and that makes sense. Yeah, this is why during the last bankruptcy scare a few years ago I went ahead and bought some extras like additional floating tables, UTR, speed reducer, etc. Because you never know when the company will breathe its last breath...though I hope it continues to survive. Also, why I sometimes fall into the complainer category on this forum because I wish they'd offer more SPT's and accessories than they do. I too see it as an ecosystem and when you have all of the components you need for it and they are working well, nothing is better. When parts get removed from that ecosystem and discontinued then you suffer. Being partially on the Festool ecosystem now, I have an even greater appreciation for this kind of system or ecosystem concept. I am only limited by my bank account when it comes to the Festool system and the more I acquire from them the more productive I am on their system. I have most everything I can get on the Shopsmith ecosytem, but I am only operating at maybe 70% capability because the SPT's haven't been refreshed and don't offer the capability than I need/want. IF Shopsmith could address this, I think they would have many more customers than just me, who chooses to publicly mention this deficiency in hopes they might address it.

adrianpglover,

As I said in my previous post the used market will go on. This already applies to those discontinued items you have been interested in. I like the Jig Saw and not too long ago bought a second used one to have in case my other one breaks to the point I cannot use it. Right now, it sits on the shelf although purchased on the used market, "new in box" waiting for its turn. I do have some extra Jig Saw parts too. The Shopsmith Scroll Saw can be found used in either the Mark Mount or free standing with motor in both the gray or teal models. I have the gray Mark Mount Scroll Saw with the later table and the Blade Mount upgrade. It sits on a Power Station for use which I prefer rather than using mounted on a Mark.

Shaper Cutters and the Moulding Head and Knives can be found from other manufacturers that will fit the Shopsmith's Arbors/Spindles. The last version of the Molder Head Knives were coming from a different company and probably the Head itself. That Molder Head was the only one that required an arbor to use. Prior to that all Shopsmith/Magna Molder Heads could be attached directly to the Quill's Spindle. The last version of the Molder Knives do not fit prior Molder Head versions.

It may not be in Shopsmith's best interest, due to cost considerations, to resell items to use on their tools from other companies. It could be helpful if Shopsmith would market the fact that these items from other companies can be used on a Shopsmith showing that not everything used on a Shopsmith tool has to be a Shopsmith brand item.

Sorry to Shopsmith for this but all my Mark's and SPT's have either been inherited of purchased used. I have spent several thousand dollars buying parts, accessories, consumables and upgrades from Shopsmith. Most notably upgrading my Mark V to a Mark 7 with the DIY Power Pro, Double Tilt and other upgrades. Supporting the existing Shopsmith users is a big part of their business.

I’m curious if SS is going to pivot to sponsoring some “influencers” out there to feature their product. At a minimum it would get some newer videos out there for younger folks to see and maybe get interested in. Everyone who has seen the Mk5 510 in my garage has never seen one before. We’re all under 40, so the exposure just isn’t there. It would also be nice to have some new how-to videos that weren’t filmed on a potato.

Watching mgr episode on the biscuit jointer accessory and realized that it's not being sold now either.