Looking at used SS - help!

rstl99 · Post by **rstl99** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:04 am

Hi all,
Glad I found this community.
Am going to see this SS for sale locally. There is rust on it. Owner bought it at a garage sale some years ago and never had time to fix it and set it up. Engine may not work. Price is cheap ($100) and I would plan on fixing it up for use in the woodshed of the new cottage I just bought, as a post-retirement project that can lead to some woodworking fun.
Any thoughts based on looking at it? Is this restorable? Anything I should pay particular attention to when looking at it, and seeing what attachments come with it?
Thanks.

thainglo · Post by **thainglo** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:21 am

Looks like the machine has been set outside for several years. The first one I worked on had tubes in bad enough shape that I couldn't salvage at the time and had to buy another set. If you've got the time to put in for repairs, this site has loads of helpful information, including tube electrolysis, paint methods, headstock rebuild tips, etc.

Would recommend watching the Shopsmith Sawdust sessions on steps to take before plugging it in and firing it up so you don't accidentally cause more damage.

$100 is a fair price for what you'd be starting with, but based on your mechanical skills and missing parts, the restoration cost can quickly add up to get a fully functioning machine. That being said, if you're looking for a fun project, can't beat restoring an old Shopsmith. I think I'm up to about ten or so over the last 18 months.

Have fun!

Matt

dan1999 · Post by **dan1999** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:53 am

There seems to be a fair amount of rust ot it but if you have the time $100 is not a lot to pay especially since you appear to get the bandsaw also. Go for it

Dan

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:56 am

Doesn't look as 'bad' as this un!

http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showthread.htm?t=3503

More 'encouragement':

http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showthr ... ht=greenie

AND MORE:

http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showthr ... light=1955

AND FINALLY:

http://www.shopsmith.net/forums/showthr ... ht=greenie

LOOK at post # 293,294

GO FOR IT!!!!

rstl99 · Post by **rstl99** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:28 pm

Thanks for the quick feedback, I appreciate it.
Went to look at it just now. It has indeed been sitting outside for a while, which is a shame. Anyway, the guy plugged it into a power cord and flicked on a switch. The motor hummed and turned slightly, then stopped. I was able to turn it by hand using the knobs sticking out on one side.
The tubes have a fair amount of surface rust on them, as do the side parts.
It comes with the bandsaw, and also a joiner (a heavy attachment). There is also a sanding attachment (metal piece with round plywood piece). Unfortunately doesn't seem to be a drill-press attachment (not sure what it looks like, but didn't seem to be there).
There is another one for sale locally, about $450, which looks in better shape, but possibly older. (see pic)
Anyway, still mulling over the $100 one. Might be a good deal, assuming the motor can be made to work. WOuld take some elbow grease, de-rusting and painting, but the table saw and band saws would be useful up at the cottage, where I would have this in the woodshed.
There was a serial number on the side of the engine, below a label that said Mark V, and it was 11752 I believe. Not sure how old this makes this specimen...

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:57 pm

rstl99 wrote:Thanks for the quick feedback, I appreciate it.
Went to look at it just now. It has indeed been sitting outside for a while, which is a shame. Anyway, the guy plugged it into a power cord and flicked on a switch. The motor hummed and turned slightly, then stopped. I was able to turn it by hand using the knobs sticking out on one side.
The tubes have a fair amount of surface rust on them, as do the side parts.
It comes with the bandsaw, and also a joiner (a heavy attachment). There is also a sanding attachment (metal piece with round plywood piece). Unfortunately doesn't seem to be a drill-press attachment (not sure what it looks like, but didn't seem to be there).
There is another one for sale locally, about $450, which looks in better shape, but possibly older. (see pic)
Anyway, still mulling over the $100 one. Might be a good deal, assuming the motor can be made to work. WOuld take some elbow grease, de-rusting and painting, but the table saw and band saws would be useful up at the cottage, where I would have this in the woodshed.
There was a serial number on the side of the engine, below a label that said Mark V, and it was 11752 I believe. Not sure how old this makes this specimen...

If EITHER of these said 'mark >>> V <<<' it is meaningless. NEITHER of these is a 'mark V'. DO NOT PANIC, they ARE MARK 5's. The distinction is relative to who manufactured it. The Mark 5's are older.

Re drill press. Remove the band saw(there is a splined round cylinder below it which secures it to the end casting / loosen it and lift UP on the bandsaw), unlock the other end(handle in pic of $100 one) and the carriage will lift up into a 'vertical' position. DO NOT do this unless you are sure the table carriage and headstock(engine) are secure(so they do not slide from end to end). The table will rotate 90 degrees so as to provide a horizontal surface when carriage is vertical.

IMHO $100 is more reasonable. The $450 is over priced, and has many modifications(may or may NOT be an issue). Of particular interest is the added switching on the side of the motor housing and the 'extended table'.

RE: humming motor: Not sure which you were referring to. Assuming it was the $100 one, the hum is a GOOD sign(It IS trying to run). Would be interesting to know if it 'stopped' because of tripped breaker/blown fuse. That WOULD be expected if the motor did not actually turn. The starting problem MAY be simply a dirty start switch or a start capacitor.

rstl99 · Post by **rstl99** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:08 pm

Sorry, I meant to say "Mark 5" (not sure where the roman numeral came out from my fingers :-)
Yeah, I thought it good that the motor is trying to turn on the $100 one. Possibly something rusted or seized up, or minor electrical contact issue.
Oh, so the drill press is something BUILT into the unit, that's good to know! (ss neophyte here...).
I was surprised at the weight of this thing, heavier than I would have thought. Seems built like a tank.
Maybe I should fork over the $100 and bring this baby home...

rstl99 · Post by **rstl99** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:14 pm

Just had a listen to one of the Sawdust sessions so I am much better informed now about what to look for in a used Shopsmith. The specimen I looked at is obviously missing parts (drill chuck, tail stock, miter gauge, etc.) but I suppose those could be picked up somewhere.

I'll mull over that $100 specimen again, and consider picking it up this weekend and start the restoration process.

Thanks for all the advice and encouragement!

billmayo · Post by **billmayo** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 6:45 pm

The $450 Shopsmith2 picture machine is a Total Shop (knock-off), not a Shopsmith. No parts are available for the Total Shop and the Shopsmith headstock parts will not fit/replace. It is only worth about $50 for the nice 1 1/2 HP 110/220 VAC motor (56 frame mount) if it operates.

The first Shopsmith is worth the $100. Most motors that has set for some time will not operate. A good cleaning is normally all that is needed. There is plenty of help and instructions available. Just take and include pictures of any thing that you are having a problem and someone will respond.

rstl99 wrote:Thanks for the quick feedback, I appreciate it.
Went to look at it just now. It has indeed been sitting outside for a while, which is a shame. Anyway, the guy plugged it into a power cord and flicked on a switch. The motor hummed and turned slightly, then stopped. I was able to turn it by hand using the knobs sticking out on one side.
The tubes have a fair amount of surface rust on them, as do the side parts.
It comes with the bandsaw, and also a joiner (a heavy attachment). There is also a sanding attachment (metal piece with round plywood piece). Unfortunately doesn't seem to be a drill-press attachment (not sure what it looks like, but didn't seem to be there).
There is another one for sale locally, about $450, which looks in better shape, but possibly older. (see pic)
Anyway, still mulling over the $100 one. Might be a good deal, assuming the motor can be made to work. WOuld take some elbow grease, de-rusting and painting, but the table saw and band saws would be useful up at the cottage, where I would have this in the woodshed.
There was a serial number on the side of the engine, below a label that said Mark V, and it was 11752 I believe. Not sure how old this makes this specimen...

etc92guy · Post by **etc92guy** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 9:43 pm

Mine didn't run when I found it at a garage sale. Did research on this site and told the owner what the problem might be. He said I was right and sold it to me anyways.

Watched the videos and was fortunate enough to spend some time with Bill Mayo. I tore mine down, cleaned and lubed. SWMBO said it definitely was quieter and smoother running after that.

Go for the $100 one. You will not have any regrets ( until the SS fever kicks in and you end up with 3 or 4

).

The one major difference I found is that you have to develop a different mindset as far as setup and the tilting table if you are used to a regular tablesaw. But the functionality and the fact that I now have 5 tools ( you'll have 7 ) has definitely boosted my woodworking quality.

If you don't buy it, PM me and I'll buy it. Your getting the bandsaw alone at less than half price!!!!! in the used market.