Design Changes vs Long Term Maintainability

dusty · Post by **dusty** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:02 am

Shopsmith has done a fabulous job of supporting the Mark5/V over these many years. Parts are still available to repair nearly all of the older versions. Furthermore, the older models can be upgraded to just like a newer model.

I wonder, however, if there is a time bomb involved in all of this.

The catalogs and part lists are not always updated to reflect the older models.

A SIMPLE EXAMPLE:

If you have an old goldie that has been refurbished and is in excellent working condition but you do not have the keepers for the eccentric - can these be ordered?

OR

If you order a new eccentric (515616) and your intent is to install it into a machine that has the old sand cast headstock, will it fit? Is the part (515616) universally compatible to all versions of the Mark V.

If there is an issue here (and there might not be), we here on the forum could become the ultimate solution. In fact, we might be the only solution. It is not likely that Shopsmith will ever produce a "Master Cross Reference of Parts Old and New". Now, as long as we have Customer Service to fall back on, there is no problem but .....

billmayo · Post by **billmayo** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:47 am

dusty wrote:Shopsmith has done a fabulous job of supporting the Mark5/V over these many years. Parts are still available to repair nearly all of the older versions. Furthermore, the older models can be upgraded to just like a newer model.

I wonder, however, if there is a time bomb involved in all of this.

The catalogs and part lists are not always updated to reflect the older models.

A SIMPLE EXAMPLE:

If you have an old goldie that has been refurbished and is in excellent working condition but you do not have the keepers for the eccentric - can these be ordered?

OR

If you order a new eccentric (515616) and your intent is to install it into a machine that has the old sand cast headstock, will it fit? Is the part (515616) universally compatible to all versions of the Mark V.

If there is an issue here (and there might not be), we here on the forum could become the ultimate solution. In fact, we might be the only solution. It is not likely that Shopsmith will ever produce a "Master Cross Reference of Parts Old and New". Now, as long as we have Customer Service to fall back on, there is no problem but .....

Unique Greenie/Goldie sand cast headstock casing and Gilmer Drive parts are not available from Shopsmith. The good news is that most of the latest Mark V headstock parts will fit with no problems.

The eccentric bushing keepers are not needed with the new eccentric bushing which will fit all headstock casings. I discard the keepers when using the new eccentric bushing.

I will be happy to respond to any list of items or questions as to what current parts replace or what does not and how to handle each situation when there is a unique Greenie/Goldie part no longer being made or available from Shopsmith. I can say that I have no problem rebuilding Greenie headstocks using early and later parts. Only if Shopsmith cease to exist will I/we have a problem in this area.

dusty · Post by **dusty** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:23 pm

If I understand what you are saying, Bill, current parts are universally backward compatible to the goldie and the greenie; therefore, there are no parts critical to the maintenance of a greenie/goldie.

This would then mean that as long as Shopsmith parts for the current model remain available, the Mark V is forever sustainable.

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 3:48 pm

[quote="dusty"]If I understand what you are saying, Bill, current parts are universally backward compatible to the goldie and the greenie]

The 'Gilmer' parts are no longer available from ss, but the poly-v parts will work! The quill 'connector'(plastic piece) for the gilmer version is also a problem(IIRC) and I think the gilmer splined shaft etc.

Complicating also(if ss customer service 'disappears') is the various 2 bearing quill versions.

dusty · Post by **dusty** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 4:39 pm

JPG40504 wrote:The 'Gilmer' parts are no longer available from ss, but the poly-v parts will work! The quill 'connector'(plastic piece) for the gilmer version is also a problem(IIRC) and I think the gilmer splined shaft etc.

Complicating also(if ss customer service 'disappears') is the various 2 bearing quill versions.

Explain, please, about the various 2 bearing quill configurations. Is there any difference other than what bearings they use and the fact that some of them have 2 piece shafts.

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:17 pm

dusty wrote:Explain, please, about the various 2 bearing quill configurations. Is there any difference other than what bearings they use and the fact that some of them have 2 piece shafts.

I was referring to different versions of the two bearing quill. The bearings do differ and the shafts differ(in other words, the answer to your explicit question is 'not that I am aware of'). I believe they determined that the 'original' 2 bearing quill had problems. I believe these changes were made shortly after the production began, so probably not too many of the 'early' vintage are out there.

In addition to the 2 bearing quill variations, the gilmer quill is different from the poly-v quill. The splines are different.

Sir Bill could describe these differences far better than I.

FWIW there have also been non-ss modifications out there!

nuhobby · Post by **nuhobby** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:12 pm

JPG40504 wrote:
FWIW there have also been non-ss modifications out there!

One of these is in the following article available for purchase, an upgrade of the Quill to make the machine work for metal milling:
http://www.shopmachineadventures.com/in ... &Itemid=54
I found this particular article (#7) to be very interesting, even though I don't think I'll ever do anything like it.

mmorris · Post by **mmorris** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:24 pm

JPG40504 wrote:The 'Gilmer' parts are no longer available from ss, but the poly-v parts will work! The quill 'connector'(plastic piece) for the gilmer version is also a problem(IIRC) and I think the gilmer splined shaft etc.

Complicating also(if ss customer service 'disappears') is the various 2 bearing quill versions.

Damn! I just ordered a quill "connector (plastic piece) for the gilmer on my greenie. They said it would "probably fit, but wouldn't guarantee it". So I guess I've probably wasted my $:).
I did have the 1981 supplement parts catalog that covered earlier models, including a part number, but of course the part number wasn't applicable anymore.