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French Cleat Question?
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:32 am
by cv3
I am going to build a french cleat storage system for my wife’s craft room. In every thing I have seen the cleat is made with ¾” stock or plywood. I do not think there will not be any items hung on this over 15lb’s. My question is would ½ “plywood be ok for this. I think it would work ok but I thought I would ask incase some one had done ½ “and it had not work. Maybe cutting the cleat at 50 degrees instead of 45 would give it some extra hold
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:10 pm
by dusty
cv3 wrote:I am going to build a french cleat storage system for my wife’s craft room. In every thing I have seen the cleat is made with ¾” stock or plywood. I do not think there will not be any items hung on this over 15lb’s. My question is would ½ “plywood be ok for this. I think it would work ok but I thought I would ask incase some one had done ½ “and it had not work. Maybe cutting the cleat at 50 degrees instead of 45 would give it some extra hold
I believe that 1/2" cleats will hold the weight. I suspect that the lesser depth of the cleat (1/2" vs 3/4") might be the issue. The hanging items would need to move less to come unhooked.
This may not really be an issue but that would be my only concern using 1/2" materials.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:11 pm
by JPG
You did not mention the size of the 'hanging object'. If relative small, two things come to mind.
With smaller size and lighter load, they could be inadvertently bumped off the cleat. The shallower cleat requires only a 1/2" vertical movement to 'disconnect'.
The second thing is wall flatness. A non-flat wall will not allow full 'seating' of the cleat and thus decrease the movement needed to 'disconnect'.
Perhaps a 'hook' design would be more appropriate.
http://americanwoodworker.com/blogs/shop/archive/2009/08/04/hyper-organize-your-shop.aspx
Just make them shallower.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:46 pm
by charlese
cv3 wrote:I am going to build a french cleat storage system for my wife’s craft room. In every thing I have seen the cleat is made with ¾” stock or plywood. I do not think there will not be any items hung on this over 15lb’s. My question is would ½ “plywood be ok for this. I think it would work ok but I thought I would ask incase some one had done ½ “and it had not work. Maybe cutting the cleat at 50 degrees instead of 45 would give it some extra hold
IMO 1/2" cleats should work well.
My cleats have all been made from 3/4" stock. The big thing (not before mentioned here) about using French cleats is to allow the appropriate extra width of the sides of the hanging. If you are going to use 1/2" cleats, allow an added 1/2" to the width of the sides. This 1/2" protrudes toward the wall from the back of the hanging.
I always made the wall cleat several inches shorter than the width of the hanging. This way the hanging can be adjusted sideways for best location.
In order to stop ANY MOVEMENT of the hanging, simply drive a couple screws through the inside of the hanging's back into the wall mounted cleat. Use pretty screws here because they will show on the inside of the hanging. I assume the upper cleat is already appropriately fixed to the hanging.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:21 pm
by cv3
I meant making a 60 degree cut, not a 50 degree I said in my post. Using a piece of ½”x 4” x 4’ Plywood and ripping it at 60 degrees instead of 45 degrees would give me a 7/8 ” deep cleat which would be 1/8” deeper and a more severe angle than using ¾ “stock at 45 degrees. My thought was that would hold just as well. I welcome any seed back I am a much better carver than cabinet/ woodworker.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:04 pm
by berry
PW worked fine for me. I've never cut anything but a 45, nor used less that 3/4" material. I've used them on 4 or 5 projects and they work great.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:13 pm
by charlese
[quote="cv3"]I meant making a 60 degree cut, not a 50 degree I said in my post. Using a piece of ½]
60°, 45° - it's your choice. My recommendation is to stick with 45°. As said earlier, two screws will prevent any shifting or jumping out of the cleat.
Remember - at 60° there is less wood to hold any horizontal movement away from the wall. 60° would result in a deeper cleat, but not as strong for horizontal pull.
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:33 pm
by SDSSmith
charlese wrote:60°, 45° - it's your choice. My recommendation is to stick with 45°. As said earlier, two screws will prevent any shifting or jumping out of the cleat.
Remember - at 60° there is less wood to hold any horizontal movement away from the wall. 60° would result in a deeper cleat, but not as strong for horizontal pull.
Are you sure about that?
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:05 pm
by JPG
SDSSmith wrote:Are you sure about that?
Deeper but weaker?? Sounds contradictory to me also!;)
Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:59 pm
by allmond2002
I'm a bit confused and want to know the answer.
With a 45 degree angle on .5" of thickness, the cleat surface yields .707" which allows vertical and horizontal to equalize on center of the surface.
With a 60 degree angle on .5" of thickness, the cleat surface yields ~.875" which allows vertical surface pressure to decrease and horizontal surface pressure to increase.
The increase of horizontal pressure makes it weaker at the tip of the angle, yet stronger at the point of pressure contact.
Is this in effect to what everyone is referring? Trying to understand the logic/mathematics.
