The Presidential Debate

[davebodner]

... 2) Carter left Reagan an even worse mess. Obama did the opposite of everything Reagan did. And I think the results speak for themselves.

Not even close. There was nothing the like the recent financial meltdown in 1980. The Fed raised interest rates to wring inflation out of our system. It was a bitter pill to swallow, but it worked. Reagan engaged in fiscal stimulus (without calling it that) by greatly raising gov't spending while lowering taxes. As the deficit exploded he agreed to re-raise some of those taxes.

[heathicus]

I guess it depends on how you look at it.

The Misery Index (Unemployment Rate + Inflation Rate) was 19.72 at the end of the Carter administration. It was 7.49 at the end of the GW Bush Administration. By that measure, Carter was worse. (As of March 2012, it was 10.85 - worse than Bush, better than Carter).

Unemployment at the end of the Carter administration was 7.2%. It was also 7.2% at the end of the Bush administration. Tie. (Today it has finally dropped to 7.8% - worse than either Carter or Bush.)

The Inflation Rate at the end of the Carter administration was 12.5%. At the end of the GW Bush administration it was 0.1%. By this, Carter was far worse. (Today, it's around 2%. Much better than Carter, worse than Bush.)

The prime interest rate at the end of the Carter administration was 20.35%. At the end of the GW Bush administration it was 4%. Again, Carter was far worse. (Today, it is 3.25%. Slightly better than Bush. Far better than Carter.)

Based on those factors (this doesn't take into consideration the banking collapse), Reagan inherited a much worse economy than Obama did. Yes, Reagan increased spending and debt. He wasn't perfect by any means. But overall, he did follow a more Austrian economic model and that brought about a staggering economic recovery. Obama followed more of a Keynesian model. We've "recovered" in some ways, but the spending and debt he's put us in is crushing what could have been another staggeringly successful recovery.

[fredsheldon]

What you say is somewhat true. Romney did do all of those things. It is what he was hired to do. Had he not performed, he would have been axed.

How do you think Pelosi and Reid and Kerry and Kennedy, etc, etc, etc got as rich as then did. They invested in companies that were making money doing what Romney did or by trading in China.

You have taunted your own investment returns here on the forum. Are any of them from companies who laid off people or participated in any of the tactics that Mitt has done?

Dusty,

I do not wish to get into a debate with you because I respect your advice on this forum and don't want to lose your friendship. I have no issue with somebody making a profit but when the whole campaign seems to be centered on jobs jobs and jobs, I just want everyone to know that companies that ship jobs overseas are making their profits at the expense of local jobs. If you accept that as a fact and have no problem with companies making as much profit as possible even if it means moving jobs overseas, then don't make it a campaign issue The current administration can't control what companies do nor should they. And yes, it's possible that some of the companies that make up my Bond Mutual Funds ship their jobs overseas, but since there are hundreds of companies in my funds there's not much I can do about it. Since I have already voted, what we discuss here today won't matter anyway. Time to go make some pens:eek:

[dusty]

Dusty,

I do not wish to get into a debate with you because I respect your advice on this forum and don't want to lose your friendship. I have no issue with somebody making a profit but when the whole campaign seems to be centered on jobs jobs and jobs, I just want everyone to know that companies that ship jobs overseas are making their profits at the expense of local jobs. If you accept that as a fact and have no problem with companies making as much profit as possible even if it means moving jobs overseas, then don't make it a campaign issue The current administration can't control what companies do nor should they. And yes, it's possible that some of the companies that make up my Bond Mutual Funds ship their jobs overseas, but since there are hundreds of companies in my funds there's not much I can do about it. Since I have already voted, what we discuss here today won't matter anyway. Time to go make some pens:eek:

Fred, thank you for your comments. But let me say that there is no chance of altering our relationship by what you post here on the forum. I believe that we are all allowed to have and express differing opinions.

There are other forums where that is not true. Members in those forums demand conformity and in that environment "I do not fit" therefore I do not go.

I feel comfortable here because I am allowed to have and express my misfit opinions. Even those that deal with woodworking or precision alignments and measurements. Some people actually believe that there is no need for precise measurements when dealing with wood.

[pennview]

Well let's see where the truth resides regarding Mitt Romney and Bane Capital, and especially regarding his shipping jobs overseas. These companies are among Romney's success story -- Staples, Domino's Pizza, Sealy, Brookstone, The Sports Authority. Pizza Hut, AMC Entertainment, Burger King, Burlington Coat Factory, Dunkin' Donuts, Toys R Us, Warner Music Group, Totes, The Weather Channel, and Steel Dynamics.

[heathicus]

One of the many reasons I'm voting Libertarian:





This article explains another reason: http://communities.washingtontimes.com/ ... n-says-no/

[fjimp]

Read any article you wish, watch any political ad you wish, then gather the "Truth" from your preferred source and still be a believer in lies. As has been said before truth is in the eyes of the beholder. I see, hear and believe very little. Jim

[pennview]

If Romney does what he promises he will do, and that is:

"immediately reduce non-security discretionary spending by 5 percent"

"cap federal spending below 20 percent of the economy"

"cut the deficit"

"reduce the size of government"

"get the national debt under control"

how in the world does he do that by having a budget of $4.9 trillion?

Clearly, someone is not painting a clear and accurate picture of what Romney's budget will look like.

[heathicus]

Clearly, someone is not painting a clear and accurate picture of what Romney's budget will look like.

That person is Romney himself.

(And don't take my criticisms of Romney as an endorsement of Obama. That knucklehead is even worse.)

[dusty]

Finally, it is no longer the Presidential Debates.

Today is the day to vote if you have not already done so.

I am so thankful that this day has finally come. I just hope that it brings with it an end to the bickering and negative campaigning that has been so predominant for the last six months or so.

I am also SO tired of hearing someone tell me who is leading in the polls and who is losing. I believe that knowing all these statistics is in itself an unhealthy influence on the outcome.

Statistics don't lie but statisticians might.

Let us hope that the next four years are better than the last four - no matter who is leading the country. Let us hope that the Congress grows up and that as a group they do their job - the one they were sent there to do. There is no room for their political bickering. Compromise is not a dirty word. Let us hope that our troops all come home and are allowed to stay home for many years to come. Let us hope that we spend our time and efforts making things right here at home and let Europe and Asia take care of themselves for awhile.