Why WW pubs look down on SS?

[kalynzoo]

[quote="frank81"]I've always believed in the saying "a good craftsman never blames his tools." Maybe you have to calibrate and service some tools more than others, but in the end if you can't build the same thing on a ShopSmith as you could in a fancy cabinet shop then its your own lack of skill. The expensive machines were just covering it up.

Grampa Vic, my woodworking mentor, had a beautiful finger jointed four draw tool cabinet with lid that he cherished and made on a bet using only his worm drive skill saw. I appreciate a well made tool, but I have learned not to blame my tools for any lack of perfection.
As for this thread. I definately believe the magazines showpiece the companies that purchase sustained advertizing. True too of travel magazines, and other hobby magazines.

[skou]

I would also counter that ShopSmith makes ShopSmith. (And, using Shopsmiths.)

Frank, in more than one way!

Shopsmith, to this day, has ERs on the production floor, making more Shopsmiths.

Find that in the other WW manufacturer's factories.

steve

[benush26]

My personal thoughts are that Shopsmith is an acquired taste that is valued by those who see elegance in design and are less swayed by sheep mentality.

There is a car that I admire (the Acura RL), that has a similar recognition factor. Frankly the car is rather bland looking and not designed to stick out in a crowd. The auto journalists and naysayers talk about it's lack of a big engine and lack of rear wheel drive which I guess the fanciest expensive models are supposed to have. instead, the RL practical All wheel drive car that is technologically incredible. Acura spends precious little on advertising. But this cars' adherents are fierce loyalists and understand the quality of what they have.

I think that Shopsmith owners are like that group. Yes, some here own festool, SawStop and other expensive toys (er, tools), but they also realize the incredible usefulness of this machine. Admire the precision and care in construction. The loyalty to consumers with a company philosophy that says it will not abandon the old guard in search of the all mighty buck.

As far as FWW ever presenting an article on the Mark V, VII, anything... not a chance. I truly enjoy that publication but also enjoy Wood and ShoNotes and Popular woodworking. But I am not the target audience of FWW just like when I had a subscription 30 years ago to Architectural Digest; Great pictures, but my house was never going to look like that. My bench chisels are Footprint not Two Cherry, I enter the festool contest each month to win something, but that's the closest I'll get to owning their stuff.
I am building a cabinet saw from an older HEAVY duty Craftsman TS that I bought for $35 (sans motor and hand wheels, and miter gauge etc) , but my thoughts on how to make something will be based on using the SS. I really want a Tormek (or at least a WorkSharp) but have figured out how to use the existing SS parts to utilize Tormek jigs. (As wells as the WorkSharp 3000 disks) Incra's precision fence makes me drool for it's precision but I figured a jig using Shopsmith's adjustable stop collar to achieve the same results.

I need to use my imagination to achieve rather than a checkbook. IMHO high end magazines would rather cater to those who can just say "I'll take it, here's my card". Nothing wrong with that, but until I win the lottery, not my world.
Maybe as I write this, I am just getting my self in trouble again.

but its just my 2 cents,

Ben

[Gene Howe]

WW pubs don't "look down" on SS as much as just ignore it. The reasons are probably financial, as everyone else has surmised.
Remember when Norm used a SS? Then, sponsorship of other brands forced a change.
Product placement works. Gibbs should use his more often.

[Ed in Tampa]

WW pubs don't "look down" on SS as much as just ignore it. The reasons are probably financial, as everyone else has surmised.
Remember when Norm used a SS? Then, sponsorship of other brands forced a change.
Product placement works. Gibbs should use his more often.

The reason Norm, mentioned above, isn't using the Shopsmith is the why Wood Working Mags ignore the Shopsmith.

Norm did not like the Shopsmith and felt that where it is possible to have separate machines that it was a better solution than the Shopsmith.

Before you get the rope to lynch me, think for a moment. Most if not all of us got our shopsmith because of space constraints. In my case I had to share my shop and garage.

Now I realize many of the newer Shopsmith owners are owners because they were able to buy the SS for a song.

Also remember the industry is constantly changing and now there are other solutions to the space crunch. Like bench top machines which once were pieces of junk but now win awards for their innovative designs and useability.

For a magazine to narrow it's focus down to the relatively small number of of customers that have space constraints and haven't solved them by other means to focus on the Shopsmith would nearly close their customer base. In other words only Shopsmith owners would be interested in the story.

Again before you get out the rope to hang me ( and please use a new rope ). If I was starting out in woodworking today and I had a reasonable amount of disposable income to spend on my pursuit the last thing I would consider would be a Shopsmith.

If I had the price of a new Shopsmith Mark VII in my pocket to set up a new shop I guarantee I would have some really nice machines, great lighting and other amenities and I would have absolutely no interest in reading a Shopsmith review story in any of the WoodWorking mags I get.

[Ed in Tampa]

Maybe a better answer to the question of "Why do WW pub look down on SS" would be for the same reason why a used SS in pristine condition sells for $71 or less than a 1/20 of it's original selling price.

Take the same age Delta Unisaw in the exact same condition and see what price it fetches. That will tell you how much interest there is in the Shopsmith in the wood working community.

Would you devote much of your magazine to that interest base? I wouldn't.

Now that I have won friends and influence many (please be kind and please remember I have a Shopsmith and I love it but I'm also a realist) I will listen to everyone tell me I'm all wrong and the fact that Wood working magazines don't do articles on Shopsmith is because they are stupid.

[dusty]

Maybe a better answer to the question of "Why do WW pub look down on SS" would be for the same reason why a used SS in pristine condition sells for $71 or less than a 1/20 of it's original selling price.

Take the same age Delta Unisaw in the exact same condition and see what price it fetches. That will tell you how much interest there is in the Shopsmith in the wood working community.

Would you devote much of your magazine to that interest base? I wouldn't.

Now that I have won friends and influence many (please be kind and please remember I have a Shopsmith and I love it but I'm also a realist) I will listen to everyone tell me I'm all wrong and the fact that Wood working magazines don't do articles on Shopsmith is because they are stupid.

I think this is a "chicken and egg" analysis. If Shopsmith advertised its capabilities more and better, some of those Unisaw buyers just might buy a Mark V or a PowerPro.

SHOPSMITH is an unknown entity to many (if not most) of today's buyers due to the lack of a wide based advertising campaign.

[dusty]

The reason Norm, mentioned above, isn't using the Shopsmith is the why Wood Working Mags ignore the Shopsmith.

Norm did not like the Shopsmith and felt that where it is possible to have separate machines that it was a better solution than the Shopsmith.

Before you get the rope to lynch me, think for a moment. Most if not all of us got our shopsmith because of space constraints. In my case I had to share my shop and garage.

Now I realize many of the newer Shopsmith owners are owners because they were able to buy the SS for a song.

Also remember the industry is constantly changing and now there are other solutions to the space crunch. Like bench top machines which once were pieces of junk but now win awards for their innovative designs and useability.

For a magazine to narrow it's focus down to the relatively small number of of customers that have space constraints and haven't solved them by other means to focus on the Shopsmith would nearly close their customer base. In other words only Shopsmith owners would be interested in the story.

Again before you get out the rope to hang me ( and please use a new rope ). If I was starting out in woodworking today and I had a reasonable amount of disposable income to spend on my pursuit the last thing I would consider would be a Shopsmith.

If I had the price of a new Shopsmith Mark VII in my pocket to set up a new shop I guarantee I would have some really nice machines, great lighting and other amenities and I would have absolutely no interest in reading a Shopsmith review story in any of the WoodWorking mags I get.

Now tell me, "How do you know that Norm did not like the Shopsmith"?

I believe that he better liked the money that was offered to him to "go Delta". I believe that if Shopsmith had offered more than did Delta, he would not have changed.

[frank81]

Now tell me, "How do you know that Norm did not like the Shopsmith"?

I believe that he better liked the money that was offered to him to "go Delta". I believe that if Shopsmith had offered more than did Delta, he would not have changed.

The question is, what did he choose when money wasn't part of the equation? Money changes everything.

I propose an indepenent review. A build-off on the attached plan, make one on the SS and the other on a dedicated machine and see if there is a difference. Excuse my squiggles but I stink at Sketchup (but am fine in professional Auto-CAD). There can be no money involved so we stay independent, but winner does get this drawing of a trophy.

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[joshh]

It will be difficult to build a box without any right angles, but I'll try