Speed increaser comes loose

[charlese]

The SI is not only coming off of the spindle, it is slidng on the way tubes.

Looks like you need to tighten the clamp on the way tubes. Don't be afraid of denting the tubes.
They won't dent.

[jimthej]

I couldn't hear the sound on the video, but the description sounds similar to what you hear when the bandsaw is operating and the machine needs the parameters changed.
Better call Shopsmith.

[algale]

First of all, please take the gosh dang cutters off the speed increaser as you experiment with that thing.

Second, I don't have the speed increaser but I do have a speed reducer which has similar clamps that attach to the spindle and the way tubes.

Even though you say in your video that the quill is locked and everything is tight, it doesn't look like either of your clamps on the speed increaser are adequately tightened.

The one to the quill is tightened with the 5/32 allen wrench through the socket head screw on the part of the speed increaser that goes over the quill. The video doesn't show you tightening it. The one on the way tubes has a large wing nut that you tighten by hand. In the video I can plainly see the part of the clamp that rest on the way tubes lift off the way tubes a fraction of an inch just before the whole assembly starts sliding (with cutters spinning ).

In addition, when the speed increaser pulls away from the head stock in the video it looks to me like you are either missing the knurled nut on the quill, or it has been captured within the speed reducer. I'm talking about part no. 65 here. http://www.shopsmith.com/service/headst ... iagram.htm

[joshh]

I would start with figuring out what happened to the quill nut. Did it stick inside the speed increaser?

The black powder is probably belt residue.

I suspect the way tube clamp was/is loose and the reducer was clamped to the quill nut (it should be clamped on the quill itself BEHIND the nut.

OR

Something is binding to the point it exceeds the clamping force and shoves the increaser off the hub, but I doubt this. Does the motor give any indication something is binding? Slowing down, humming, etc.

[SDSSmith]

First of all, please take the gosh dang cutters off the speed increaser as you experiment with that thing.

Second, I don't have the speed increaser but I do have a speed reducer which has similar clamps that attach to the spindle and the way tubes.

Even though you say in your video that the quill is locked and everything is tight, it doesn't look like either of your clamps on the speed increaser are adequately tightened.

The one to the quill is tightened with the 5/32 allen wrench through the socket head screw on the part of the speed increaser that goes over the quill. The video doesn't show you tightening it. The one on the way tubes has a large wing nut that you tighten by hand. In the video I can plainly see the part of the clamp that rest on the way tubes lift off the way tubes a fraction of an inch just before the whole assembly starts sliding (with cutters spinning ).

In addition, when the speed increaser pulls away from the head stock in the video it looks to me like you are either missing the knurled nut on the quill, or it has been captured within the speed reducer. I'm talking about part no. 65 here. http://www.shopsmith.com/service/headstock/headstock_diagram.htm

I believe that the knurled knob is there, it just is not completely exposed. I would agree that it appears that the way tube clamp and socket head screw (at the quill) are not tight enough. Looks like a case of the right hand rule in action.

[bdegarmo53]

Thanks everyone for the comments, but I can assure you, I have tightened everything. The quill nut remains tight on the main spindle and does not get trapped inside the SI. The quill nut is as tight as I can get it with 5/32 allen wrench, as is the large wing nut on the way tube support (used both hands to tighten it and have actually had trouble getting it loose after this happens). I'm not sure what folks are seeing in the video, but I don't find any shifting in the way tube support after the SI comes off the quill. There seems to be a vibration within the SI and the spindle of the SI seems to go "off-balance" when this happens (both nuts for the spindle are tight and remain so).

Jimthej, what do you mean by needing the parameters changed? If you're talking about the speed, the SS is set at U for routing/shaping.

[SDSSmith]

Thanks everyone for the comments, but I can assure you, I have tightened everything. The quill nut remains tight on the main spindle and does not get trapped inside the SI. The quill nut is as tight as I can get it with 5/32 allen wrench, as is the large wing nut on the way tube support (used both hands to tighten it and have actually had trouble getting it loose after this happens). I'm not sure what folks are seeing in the video, but I don't find any shifting in the way tube support after the SI comes off the quill. There seems to be a vibration within the SI and the spindle of the SI seems to go "off-balance" when this happens (both nuts for the spindle are tight and remain so).

Jimthej, what do you mean by needing the parameters changed? If you're talking about the speed, the SS is set at U for routing/shaping.

The support bracket and clamp that fasten the speed increaser to the way tubes clearly slide along the way tubes in your video. Do you have the manual for the speed increaser. If so, did you follow the alignment process outlined in the manual before using the accessory? Also as a side note the manual calls for setting the speed control to 'V' when using the speed increaser.

[charlese]

Thanks everyone for the comments, but I can assure you, I have tightened everything. The quill nut remains tight on the main spindle and does not get trapped inside the SI. The quill nut is as tight as I can get it with 5/32 allen wrench, as is the large wing nut on the way tube support (used both hands to tighten it and have actually had trouble getting it loose after this happens). I'm not sure what folks are seeing in the video, but I don't find any shifting in the way tube support after the SI comes off the quill. There seems to be a vibration within the SI and the spindle of the SI seems to go "off-balance" when this happens (both nuts for the spindle are tight and remain so).

How about tightening the horizontal part of the SI onto the quill collar. I'm speaking of the screw that is shown in the attached picture. It is the screw that is located just above the words "Three Point Clamping (at"... Are you sure that screw is tight?
http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/cata ... text_l.jpg

[reible]

This sounds like an interesting problem. I watched the video but it is not the same as being able to really watch everything like if it were in my shop. And, well I don't have one in my shop to watch so maybe we can get some help here that will help solve the issue.

I do have a few questions:

1) How long have you had the shopsmith and the speed increaser?
2) Were these purchased new or used?
3) Have you done a high speed adjustment on the shopsmith so you know that is reasonably correct?
4) You have the speed setting at "V" or less?
5) When attaching at the quill end have you tried to tighten then pulling it off?
6) Can you slide the increaser on the tubes when the bottom clamp is tight?
7) Is there an associated major amount of vibration difference when the speed increaser is attached?
8) Have you tried to start at slow and slowly increase speed towards "V"?
9) When doing #8 do you notice a point were the vibration starts getting worse?

When listening to the video it sounded like the speed might have been set to high. So my big guess is that the shopsmith is set higher then "V", or running above 4700 rpm.

It also could be the speed increaser is defective.

Ed

[bdegarmo53]

SDSSmith -- I don't see the way tube support moving. Perhaps it's my unsteady videography that makes it look that way. I have even placed a pencil mark on the way tube and don't see the support change. After the SI comes off the quill, I still can't manually budge the way tube support. I had the SI manual upon purchasing it, but can no longer find it and don't find it for download in the SS site. In the video, my speed is right at U, so I don't have it set too fast. If I move up to V, it seems worse.

charlese -- The nut is tight at the quill, or quill collar. I can't manually move the SI after tightening in onto the quill, and even after it starts to separate from the quill, I can't manually push it completely off the quill or pull it back on. It's still that tight.

reible -- 1&2: 21-2 years, everything bought new when we actually had a SS retail store here in St. Louis. The SI may have 20 hours of use, but no more. 3: Not really sure how to do a high speed adjustment, but will look into it. 4: Speed set at U-V. 5: (see above) when tightened on the quill I can't manually budge it one way or the other. 6: (See above) can't move it at all once tightened to the way tubes. 7: Yes 8: No 9: Will test it to see.

Today I tried the SI without the cutter attached, and only had time for a few attempts, but could not duplicate the problem. The cutter is basically brand new (20 years old but never used) and was the SS brand in the old retail store. Can't see any reason why adding the cutter would throw the spindle off balance.

I'm beginning to agree with 'reible' and think something has happened to the SI internally (defective).