Help me understand.....

[teacherman]

All along I've seen SS as a company dedicated to preserving quality and reliability above all else. High prices with the "You get what you pay for" caveat. So, I ordered a set of Forstner bits and a bunch of other stuff, including the round insert for my cast iron bandsaw table.

So I get a set of bits all labeled "Made in China." I hope the metallurgy and machining are better than what they sell at Harbor Freight.

The insert, what I thought was a
"table insert assembly," with the IPL picture showing a machined disc with a tightenable retaining tab and a number of rivet holes indicating a likely second piece to stabilize and better anchor the piece to the table, is merely a very rough cut simple aluminum disc that does not even fit into the hole in the table. I get that I can file it down for a snug fit and all, but for 18.99 I could have made my own in ten minutes with some scrap stock if that's all it is. Pic attached.

I am seeing some inconsistency here. I wonder how those corporate board meetings go. Clearly they are trying to chart their course, but one wonders in what direction they intend to go. I apologize in advance to diehard SS fans and to the hosts of this site, but this does not seem to be right. That disc looks to be a $5.00 part at most, and I bought it because I thought it would be better than something I could cut out myself.

["Wild Bad Bob"]

I shop value and quality, if I want value and dont care about quality I go to HF. Besides all there hand tools are guaranteed for life. If I want quality I go to the quality places, shop around, watch for sales.
I would send it all back and tell them how unsatisfied you are in the quality and the price. Without doing that they dont realize they have an inferior product and an unhappy customer.IMHO

[teacherman]

I shop value and quality, if I want value and dont care about quality I go to HF. Besides all there hand tools are guaranteed for life. If I want quality I go to the quality places, shop around, watch for sales.
I would send it all back and tell them how unsatisfied you are in the quality and the price. Without doing that they dont realize they have an inferior product and an unhappy customer.IMHO

Well, with return postage and all, and the time involved, I'll likely not. But the drill press vise has a thread hangup, I have no idea about the metallurgy of the bits, and I don't happen to have any 3/32" aluminum stock lying around. I will likely call them up and discuss it, which in all fairness I should have done before posting this online. I figured maybe someone here can tell me if the bits are any good, and I can absorb the rest without worrying about it. I was mostly surprised, esp. given the prices of some SS items, such as table saw blades

[JPG]

All along I've seen SS as a company dedicated to preserving quality and reliability above all else. High prices with the "You get what you pay for" caveat. So, I ordered a set of Forstner bits and a bunch of other stuff, including the round insert for my cast iron bandsaw table.

So I get a set of bits all labeled "Made in China." I hope the metallurgy and machining are better than what they sell at Harbor Freight.

The insert, what I thought was a
"table insert assembly," with the IPL picture showing a machined disc with a tightenable retaining tab and a number of rivet holes indicating a likely second piece to stabilize and better anchor the piece to the table, is merely a very rough cut simple aluminum disc that does not even fit into the hole in the table. I get that I can file it down for a snug fit and all, but for 18.99 I could have made my own in ten minutes with some scrap stock if that's all it is. Pic attached.

I am seeing some inconsistency here. I wonder how those corporate board meetings go. Clearly they are trying to chart their course, but one wonders in what direction they intend to go. I apologize in advance to diehard SS fans and to the hosts of this site, but this does not seem to be right. That disc looks to be a $5.00 part at most, and I bought it because I thought it would be better than something I could cut out myself.

That would be the aluminum table insert.

The CI table insert is smaller and a single die cast piece. AIUI, it is the same as the CI jig saw insert. Do not file off the small 'tit'.

Call SS CS and see what they 'suggest' before any 'modificating'.

In case you have not noticed, almost all products that require 'dirty processing' are no longer produced 'here'. No EPA in China(yet).

[stephen_a._draper]

You need to realize that Shopsmith now is just Robert Folkerth and about six or seven employees. I anticipate that Shopsmith will die when Folkerth dies so get what you need now from them. They are not positioned for future growth at all. If they were you would have seen them invest money in new training books and materials that illustrate using the Mark 7 instead of the old Mark V. I think it a real disservice that someone pays almost $4000 for a new machine and gets outdated instruction materials.

[reible]

I last paid $13.99 for the insert and had to wait 1 year 55 days for it to arrive. See this post:

https://forum.shopsmith.com/viewtopic.php?t=12699

Mine fit fine. I did think that I paid too much at the time and now it seems they have raised the price???

I also picked up some delta bandsaw blank inserts pretty cheap. Please check out this thread for details:

https://forum.shopsmith.com/viewtopic.php?t=8361

I don't tend to buy things like drill bits from shopsmith so the only bits I have of theirs are ones I got 30 plus years ago and not likely to be a good point of reference any more.

As always it is shopper beware, yes even at our beloved shopsmith.

Ed

[Ed in Tampa]

All along I've seen SS as a company dedicated to preserving quality and reliability above all else. High prices with the "You get what you pay for" caveat. So, I ordered a set of Forstner bits and a bunch of other stuff, including the round insert for my cast iron bandsaw table.

So I get a set of bits all labeled "Made in China." I hope the metallurgy and machining are better than what they sell at Harbor Freight.

The insert, what I thought was a
"table insert assembly," with the IPL picture showing a machined disc with a tightenable retaining tab and a number of rivet holes indicating a likely second piece to stabilize and better anchor the piece to the table, is merely a very rough cut simple aluminum disc that does not even fit into the hole in the table. I get that I can file it down for a snug fit and all, but for 18.99 I could have made my own in ten minutes with some scrap stock if that's all it is. Pic attached.

I am seeing some inconsistency here. I wonder how those corporate board meetings go. Clearly they are trying to chart their course, but one wonders in what direction they intend to go. I apologize in advance to diehard SS fans and to the hosts of this site, but this does not seem to be right. That disc looks to be a $5.00 part at most, and I bought it because I thought it would be better than something I could cut out myself.

My thoughts and concerns and I have been saying them for years and everyone tells me I keep forgetting about inflation. Inflation by butt!

Ps I have one of those bandsaw inserts, I keep it around for a reminder and get it out and rub it every time I'm about to call an order into Shopsmith.

[Ed in Tampa]

You need to realize that Shopsmith now is just Robert Folkerth and about six or seven employees. I anticipate that Shopsmith will die when Folkerth dies so get what you need now from them. They are not positioned for future growth at all. If they were you would have seen them invest money in new training books and materials that illustrate using the Mark 7 instead of the old Mark V. I think it a real disservice that someone pays almost $4000 for a new machine and gets outdated instruction materials.

I agree and I ask where are the John Mellon s, the Carnegie's, the Ford's that wanted to build something that lived after them. Today we see the Dot.com guys build a business sell it take the money and run leaving nothing behind.
If the company was run rightly it could supply the income for many many generations of Folkerth prodigy but it will probably go as you say to the grave with Robert.
If nothing else I would love to see it become employee owned or back being traded on the market.

[JPG]

I agree and I ask where are the John Mellon s, the Carnegie's, the Ford's that wanted to build something that lived after them. Today we see the Dot.com guys build a business sell it take the money and run leaving nothing behind.
If the company was run rightly it could supply the income for many many generations of Folkerth prodigy but it will probably go as you say to the grave with Robert.
If nothing else I would love to see it become employee owned or back being traded on the market.

Y'all ARE aware the second Folkerith generation is currently at the helm?


P.S. Those fellas were products of a different era. Not sure we would to want to totally return to those 'conditions'.

[teacherman]

It would be very very sad for this concept, this machine to become a thing only of the past. Each time I go out to the garage and fiddle with this thing I marvel at the elegance of its design, and the versatility of its parts. Realistically, I don't think it's practical to do much routing with it due to its slow max speed, and I really wish it went below 750 rpm for drilling larger holes or doing rough lathe work. Hard to imagine getting a reducer or increaser unless I find them used cheap, and they seem as though they would be ungainly and sacrifice precision of movement. However, I think this tool has opened up the world of woodworking to me, one I've always wanted to explore. With a good bandsaw and a dovetail jig (non-SS) down the road, I can make drawers and all kinds of stuff. I'm glad I discovered the world of SS while it is still functioning. I think I'll go ahead and keep the Forstner bits and use them. For what it's worth, I'd bet they are way better than Harbor Freight stuff. Heck, Milwaukee power tools are made in China, and they are still highly regarded.