I've found that users on websites often have very good recommendations and procedures for accomplishng maintenance, repair and help to others. This site lacks one and it is necessary to search to find anything and that search often ends with no results.
I published this as an example of what I have in mind and would like this survey to determine if I'm OTL, FLF or ROT. A problem exists when users access one recommendation or procedure which may or may not have been changed by ShopSmith and then creates diffulty in following that procedure. For example, the PDF, found here, for adjusting the fence on a 510 (page 24) does not work with later models. In fact, attempting to do so will probably not result in damage but in a jammed set screw and frustration as well as foul language from some. For the later models the procedure is as follows:
Remove the octagonal pads from the bottom of the Miter Gauge using a wide blade screwdriver.
Using the hex wrench remove the set screws by backing one of them out of the top of the Miter Gauge and the other sufficiently to clear the hole in the side.
Reinsert the one removed into the bottom of the Miter Gauge and using a 1/4" stainless steel rod (which I used or any other rod that can fit), extend it 3-4" to the right of the Miter Gauge and tighten it using the set screw.
Check for alignment by sliding it from the back to the front of the fence. If it is out of alignment, loosen the back hex screw at the underside of the fence and tap the fence in or out as needed until it is aligned. Then reaching underneath without removing the fence re-tighten that screw. Remove the fence gently, tighten again and check again for alignment.
Replace everything as it was before this procedure.
Piece of cake unless you tried to follow the instructions in the PDF. That will not work because the hex screw is is inserted from the top to serve as a block for the caps on the bottom of the Miter Gauge.
Now, those instructions were very precise and work perfectly; however, they lack pictures which are worth more than thousands of words.
For those who wants I can produce a Word doc with pictures.
So, here's my proposal: Request that the Admin set up a new tab, perhaps after New Posts and before Search that would include Tech Articles created by users. These could be vetted by the Admin or someone close to the king who could verify that these recommendations worked.
There have been many such "how to" procedures posted which I have converted to Word Files for my own use. I know a couple of these have been converted to PDF by JPG. I don't have that capability.
What do members think about this proposal?
I'm going to post this as a separate post with options for members to vote on what they would prefer.
Recommendation for a Tech Articles Section
Moderator: admin
An excellent idea!
I, however, would only do Model 10 submissions, since that is what I know best.
steve
I, however, would only do Model 10 submissions, since that is what I know best.
steve
10 ER, stripped down.
Basic 10ER, Parts machine. Will be a semi-dedicated drill-press machine.
10 ER, a "survivor" of the trailer fire, in the back yard, needing restoration. Has a Mk5 headrest. Finally, stripped down.
Numerous parts, for Model 10 stuff. Except for lower saw guard, A and B adapters, I've got it.
Looking for one more, or some 9 inch extension table raisers.
Basic 10ER, Parts machine. Will be a semi-dedicated drill-press machine.
10 ER, a "survivor" of the trailer fire, in the back yard, needing restoration. Has a Mk5 headrest. Finally, stripped down.
Numerous parts, for Model 10 stuff. Except for lower saw guard, A and B adapters, I've got it.
Looking for one more, or some 9 inch extension table raisers.
[quote="db5"].... For the later models the procedure is as follows:
I'm sorry but this is nothing like the "correct procedure"... This might be your procedure but it not the shopsmith way to do it, ie btw the shopsmith way is the correct procedure.
For the correct information you do have to have the shopsmith manual which comes with the machine when purchased from shopsmith.
This is my fear, misinformation.
I will not post the manual but you will want to use an Allen wrench as the gauge. You do not need to remove the "pads" (glide). You do borrow the set screw from the tool rest to hold the Allen wrench in place....
I'm not saying that what you did will not work but I will say it is already covered in the manual and it is written by shopsmith, and it does tell you how they would like you to do it.
Remove the octagonal pads from the bottom of the Miter Gauge using a wide blade screwdriver.
Using the hex wrench remove the set screws by backing one of them out of the top of the Miter Gauge and the other sufficiently to clear the hole in the side.
Reinsert the one removed into the bottom of the Miter Gauge and using a 1/4" stainless steel rod (which I used or any other rod that can fit), extend it 3-4" to the right of the Miter Gauge and tighten it using the set screw.
Check for alignment by sliding it from the back to the front of the fence. If it is out of alignment, loosen the back hex screw at the underside of the fence and tap the fence in or out as needed until it is aligned. Then reaching underneath without removing the fence re-tighten that screw. Remove the fence gently, tighten again and check again for alignment.
Replace everything as it was before this procedure.
Piece of cake unless you tried to follow the instructions in the PDF. That will not work because the hex screw is is inserted from the top to serve as a block for the caps on the bottom of the Miter Gauge.
Now, those instructions were very precise and work perfectly]
As you might guess I have no problem with things as they are. We do have an area for doing this now and other then the typical off subject and wrongly placed posts it does work reasonable well. I also have problems with some of the posts because people assume they know more then they do on a subject. I just shake my head and wonder why. I'm not appointing myself as guardian or caretaker here so I leave it as I will with this subject.
-30-
I'm sorry but this is nothing like the "correct procedure"... This might be your procedure but it not the shopsmith way to do it, ie btw the shopsmith way is the correct procedure.
For the correct information you do have to have the shopsmith manual which comes with the machine when purchased from shopsmith.
This is my fear, misinformation.
I will not post the manual but you will want to use an Allen wrench as the gauge. You do not need to remove the "pads" (glide). You do borrow the set screw from the tool rest to hold the Allen wrench in place....
I'm not saying that what you did will not work but I will say it is already covered in the manual and it is written by shopsmith, and it does tell you how they would like you to do it.
Remove the octagonal pads from the bottom of the Miter Gauge using a wide blade screwdriver.
Using the hex wrench remove the set screws by backing one of them out of the top of the Miter Gauge and the other sufficiently to clear the hole in the side.
Reinsert the one removed into the bottom of the Miter Gauge and using a 1/4" stainless steel rod (which I used or any other rod that can fit), extend it 3-4" to the right of the Miter Gauge and tighten it using the set screw.
Check for alignment by sliding it from the back to the front of the fence. If it is out of alignment, loosen the back hex screw at the underside of the fence and tap the fence in or out as needed until it is aligned. Then reaching underneath without removing the fence re-tighten that screw. Remove the fence gently, tighten again and check again for alignment.
Replace everything as it was before this procedure.
Piece of cake unless you tried to follow the instructions in the PDF. That will not work because the hex screw is is inserted from the top to serve as a block for the caps on the bottom of the Miter Gauge.
Now, those instructions were very precise and work perfectly]
As you might guess I have no problem with things as they are. We do have an area for doing this now and other then the typical off subject and wrongly placed posts it does work reasonable well. I also have problems with some of the posts because people assume they know more then they do on a subject. I just shake my head and wonder why. I'm not appointing myself as guardian or caretaker here so I leave it as I will with this subject.
-30-
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dusty
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 21530
- Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
- Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona
Recommendation for a Tech Articles Section
I would probably use the information provided and I would probably contribute my thoughts and opinions.
However, I believe we already have an appropriate place to put information like this. I think that it belongs in the "Maintenance and Repair" section of the forum.
Likewise, if you are talking about procedures for processes like cutting, joining, gluing, measuring, marking, etc, I believe they too already have their place in either the "Beginning Woodworking" or "General Woodworking" sections of the existing forum.
What is lacking cannot be corrected by changing the forum format. What is lacking, in my opinion, is a discipline that causes each and everyone of us to place our contributions in their appropriate sections.
If there is no place to put it, maybe it doesn't belong at all. In making that statement, I must include the "Community" section which seems to be a catch all for our random thoughts.
One change that I would like to see in the forum is a REQUIREMENT to place a title on everything that is posted. As it stands right now, we cannot initiate a thread unless we apply a title to that thread. I would like to see this requirement extended to each and every post.
I do not mean that the post needs to use the title of an existing thread, only that it needs to have a title. Requiring a title causes the poster to stop and think about where this should go. If that is hard - it probably doesn't have a logical place in the forum.
However, I believe we already have an appropriate place to put information like this. I think that it belongs in the "Maintenance and Repair" section of the forum.
Likewise, if you are talking about procedures for processes like cutting, joining, gluing, measuring, marking, etc, I believe they too already have their place in either the "Beginning Woodworking" or "General Woodworking" sections of the existing forum.
What is lacking cannot be corrected by changing the forum format. What is lacking, in my opinion, is a discipline that causes each and everyone of us to place our contributions in their appropriate sections.
If there is no place to put it, maybe it doesn't belong at all. In making that statement, I must include the "Community" section which seems to be a catch all for our random thoughts.
One change that I would like to see in the forum is a REQUIREMENT to place a title on everything that is posted. As it stands right now, we cannot initiate a thread unless we apply a title to that thread. I would like to see this requirement extended to each and every post.
I do not mean that the post needs to use the title of an existing thread, only that it needs to have a title. Requiring a title causes the poster to stop and think about where this should go. If that is hard - it probably doesn't have a logical place in the forum.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
I voted "waste of time" not because having users submit what works for them is necessarily bad (although I agree with reible that some non-standard procedures are likely to be wrong and the quality is likely to vary depending on who posts it) but because there will still be no practical way to organize it all and search it.
As has been pointed out, we have a forum section on Maintenance and Repair where many types of suggested ways to improve upon or vary from the official Shopsmith procedures have already been posted. But that section, like the entire Forum, is organized chronologically, i.e. whatever has been most recently posted goes to the top (with the exception of a few stickies). So as more and more tips get posted, there's no organization of them by subject matter and no logical way to find them. In order to be really useful, a new Forum section would need to be organized something like the chapters in the existing Shopsmith manuals and without making significant changes to the way the Forum works, that's not going to happen.
In my opinion, what we really need is just a better search function within the Forum that allows boolean searches. The only way to do that now is to go outside the Forum and use the google search function for the site:shopsmith.net/forums.
As has been pointed out, we have a forum section on Maintenance and Repair where many types of suggested ways to improve upon or vary from the official Shopsmith procedures have already been posted. But that section, like the entire Forum, is organized chronologically, i.e. whatever has been most recently posted goes to the top (with the exception of a few stickies). So as more and more tips get posted, there's no organization of them by subject matter and no logical way to find them. In order to be really useful, a new Forum section would need to be organized something like the chapters in the existing Shopsmith manuals and without making significant changes to the way the Forum works, that's not going to happen.
In my opinion, what we really need is just a better search function within the Forum that allows boolean searches. The only way to do that now is to go outside the Forum and use the google search function for the site:shopsmith.net/forums.
I also agree that the Maintenance & Repair section already exists and is appropriate for this type of material. No need being redundant with another section (like General Woodworking and Beginning Woodworking is).
Dusty, I have to address your post, however. It's a complaint you've made several times before and I think I've responded a few times as well. I may be wrong, but I think you have the wrong expectations for what this forum is.
This is not a knowledge-base. This is not a wikipedia. It's not a technical manual. It's not designed as searchable repository of information. It's not a deliberative assembly with the need for a parliamentary procedure to outline the rules regarding what can be discussed when and by whom.
It is just a place for people to get together and chat. It's a discussion forum. It's a place for conversations to happen in a digital environment. It's the Internet version of standing around the office water cooler, sitting at the bar at the local dive, hanging out in the shop with some friends, etc. What happens to discussions in those (or really ANY situation)? They meander from topic to topic, even if the folks involved got together with a specific thing to discuss.
Sometimes the topic of discussion wandering annoys me - both here and in other internet forums and in real live vocal conversations. But, you just have to accept that it is. It happens. It's going to happen. It's just part of how humans communicate. And at least here it's much easier to back up in the conversation to a previous topic. Just quote and reply to a message 5 or 20 or 30 messages back that was still on the topic you want to discuss and add your reply. And just like that, you're back on topic.
If you want a searchable repository of information, this isn't the place for it. There's too much noise. A discussion forum just isn't designed for that. The search feature on these forums is an afterthought by the programmers and highly inefficient and ignores short and common words. If you want that searchable database then it needs to be built elsewhere. Where the content can be controlled, edited, organized, indexed, and tagged with keywords. If that's what you want, then build a wiki and start filling it with content.
A forum like this just isn't the place for that level of controlled content. And trying to make it be such a place is just going to lead to frustration.
Dusty, I have to address your post, however. It's a complaint you've made several times before and I think I've responded a few times as well. I may be wrong, but I think you have the wrong expectations for what this forum is.
This is not a knowledge-base. This is not a wikipedia. It's not a technical manual. It's not designed as searchable repository of information. It's not a deliberative assembly with the need for a parliamentary procedure to outline the rules regarding what can be discussed when and by whom.
It is just a place for people to get together and chat. It's a discussion forum. It's a place for conversations to happen in a digital environment. It's the Internet version of standing around the office water cooler, sitting at the bar at the local dive, hanging out in the shop with some friends, etc. What happens to discussions in those (or really ANY situation)? They meander from topic to topic, even if the folks involved got together with a specific thing to discuss.
Sometimes the topic of discussion wandering annoys me - both here and in other internet forums and in real live vocal conversations. But, you just have to accept that it is. It happens. It's going to happen. It's just part of how humans communicate. And at least here it's much easier to back up in the conversation to a previous topic. Just quote and reply to a message 5 or 20 or 30 messages back that was still on the topic you want to discuss and add your reply. And just like that, you're back on topic.
If you want a searchable repository of information, this isn't the place for it. There's too much noise. A discussion forum just isn't designed for that. The search feature on these forums is an afterthought by the programmers and highly inefficient and ignores short and common words. If you want that searchable database then it needs to be built elsewhere. Where the content can be controlled, edited, organized, indexed, and tagged with keywords. If that's what you want, then build a wiki and start filling it with content.
A forum like this just isn't the place for that level of controlled content. And trying to make it be such a place is just going to lead to frustration.
Heath
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
-
BuckeyeDennis
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3813
- Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:03 pm
- Location: Central Ohio
Very well said, Heath. I do like the idea of a SS technical wiki, and would both use it and contribute to it. I would see it as an adjunct to, not a replacement for, this discussion forum.heathicus wrote:I also agree that the Maintenance & Repair section already exists and is appropriate for this type of material. No need being redundant with another section (like General Woodworking and Beginning Woodworking is).
Dusty, I have to address your post, however. It's a complaint you've made several times before and I think I've responded a few times as well. I may be wrong, but I think you have the wrong expectations for what this forum is.
This is not a knowledge-base. This is not a wikipedia. It's not a technical manual. It's not designed as searchable repository of information. It's not a deliberative assembly with the need for a parliamentary procedure to outline the rules regarding what can be discussed when and by whom.
It is just a place for people to get together and chat. It's a discussion forum. It's a place for conversations to happen in a digital environment. It's the Internet version of standing around the office water cooler, sitting at the bar at the local dive, hanging out in the shop with some friends, etc. What happens to discussions in those (or really ANY situation)? They meander from topic to topic, even if the folks involved got together with a specific thing to discuss.
Sometimes the topic of discussion wandering annoys me - both here and in other internet forums and in real live vocal conversations. But, you just have to accept that it is. It happens. It's going to happen. It's just part of how humans communicate. And at least here it's much easier to back up in the conversation to a previous topic. Just quote and reply to a message 5 or 20 or 30 messages back that was still on the topic you want to discuss and add your reply. And just like that, you're back on topic.
If you want a searchable repository of information, this isn't the place for it. There's too much noise. A discussion forum just isn't designed for that. The search feature on these forums is an afterthought by the programmers and highly inefficient and ignores short and common words. If you want that searchable database then it needs to be built elsewhere. Where the content can be controlled, edited, organized, indexed, and tagged with keywords. If that's what you want, then build a wiki and start filling it with content.
A forum like this just isn't the place for that level of controlled content. And trying to make it be such a place is just going to lead to frustration.