Which is better ?

[B-RAD]

I have both the Shopsmith router chuck with shield and the complete speed increaser setup. If I do not own a router which of the two is better ?

Thanks In Advance

Brad

[Ed in Tampa]

Before plunge routers I had a Sears router that was a monster. It screamed and jerked around like a crazy beast. I was scared to death of it. While it never bite me I wasn't going to give it a chance.

I got my SS and one of the first things I ordered was the Router package. I loved it. I routed everything and was perfectly happy until I read it turned to slow. That it didn't produce "quality" cuts. That it was a piece of junk. All of sudden I wasn't in love anymore. I longed for a new love a plunge router. I spent hundreds of dollars and got three different models to make sure I got the best. They don't jump, they don't scream and they are domesticated beasts but you know what they produce the same cuts my SS did.

Now everyone will tell you the SS can't possibly cut as clean as the number of cut per inch is so low. My response is, wood that never moves the number of cut per inch goes into inifinity. What I'm really saying is yes the SS router cuts much slower than a router but if you feed it slowly it will produce a cut that equals the router. You just have to feed it slow and not try to hog out all the wood with one pass. I usually make three or four passes. The first taking out half, the next taking out everything but a last 1/32-1/64 then one or two finish passes. It works for me. I'm totally happy with my cut quality and I never had my SS router attack me.

One caveat to all of this the bit holder will vibrate loose and when that happens it and the bit fall into the wood making the cut deeper. I have learned to tighten my bit holder to the spindle after each cut.

Truth be told I usually use my plunge router now but that is because I too busy to get my SS set up to do routing.
Ed

[dickg1]

I posted this back in mid April of this year. . .

When I started using my Magna Shopsmith Mark V back in the 60's I purchased the router set up available at the time. Now I have to admit I haven't used my 520 as a router yet (I did upgrade to the compatible router kit), but back in the old days nobody told me it wasn't a good router. So I just went ahead and made all my cabinet moldings. I used walnut and cherry and they turned out fine. So, now I find, after all these years that it really isn't that good, too slow, and I need to speed it up.

In my mind, this is another of those urban legends that some are keeping alive. It would be interesting to know how many have the router kit and have used it and how many just think it won't do a good job because somebody said it wouldn't.

I have three routers, a B&D (1/4" collet) bought before I bought my Mark V, a Bosch (1/2" collet) plunge router I picked up about three months ago and my Shopsmith. If you follow Ed's advice, in my opinion, the Mark V is a reasonable router that will do the job - maybe just not as fast.
Dick

[Nick]

Ed and Dick make excellent points; the Shopsmith Mark V routing system is more than adequate provide you feed the wood slowly and carefully. And without bringing up my usual prejudice for the OPR, I would add two cooments to theirs.

1. You cannot do everything with a stationary routing system unless you have the super-human determination (or the extreme avoidance to portable routers) that Ed possesses Ordinary mortals need the flexibility of both stationary and hand-held routing.

2. Slowly-running routers increase the risk of kickback. Under 3/4" in diameter, the risk does not increase enough to be a concern. But over 1" in diameter, you need to exercise caution.

With all good wishes,

[charlese]

Both Ed and Dick hit the nail on the head!!! I would summarize this way - "It's not the machine, it's the operator!"

I'm glad that someone is sticking up for the Mark V used as a router. I have very successfully used mine without a speed increaser. It needed little bites and slower wood movement, that's all. If a person doesn't want to invest (and invest it is) in a new router and a table to go with it, the Mark V will do just fine.

I now have a Porter Cable with two collets and an OPR. This is a wonderful combination and fun to work with. I got this set up because I wanted it rather that I needed it. Yes, this combination makes work a bit easier, and I don't think I would have done any pin routing without it, however I could have stuck with pattern routing using a flush cutting bit.

I still operate a 510 and use the same thinking about it. If I wanted a 520 bad enough I would get one. I don't think it will go out of style any time soon!

I'm always asking my self this question about tools - - What can I safely get by with - and what do I really need? The very best thing that's happened to me is not tools! It is, we sold the house where I was relegated to a part of the garage and bought where I could build a real shop.

Guess I'm lucky! Never had any problems with the router chucks coming loose. I did have a minor problem in that some 1/2" bits had to have their shafts polished down a bit in order to fit int the 1/2" chuck.

Hope this helps!

[B-RAD]

Thank you all for the replies. Has anybody used the speed increaser? This is one item I have not played with yet.

[dickg1]

Here's an unsolicited testimonial for the Mark V as a router from the "Maintenance and Repair" forum, "Mounting the Sharpening Jig" thread #9 by johnmccrossen.

I cut the slot in the jig on the Mark V set up as a router. It took a couple of tries and was good practice but need to be really careful.

This doesn't advance your question about the speed increaser, but I couldn't resist.
Dick

[a1gutterman]

IMHO a "real" router is better, but there is nothing wrong with the Mark V as a router. As Nick pointed out, though, a slow moving bit can increase the chance of a kickback. For that reason alone, I wood recommend using the speed increaser if you use the Mark V as a router.

[woodburner]

I have one, and I use it with the SS Shaper Accessory Kit. There are a couple of things you need to know about it before deciding on its purchase. If you use the speed increaser you can only use it under the table like a regular router table. It is not to be used in an overhead position. It is also only to be used at one speed setting (the Saw Setting on the speed dial). You can't use it at variable speeds.

Speaking of routing speed, the speed increaser has a speed of 10,000 RPM's, the same as a normal table-style shaper. If you have ever used a shaper, there is not much difference in its use. I really enjoy using it for shaper operations.

I also use the SS router table with the Incra System. The many types of router bits available makes it almost impossible not to want a regular-type of router, either the Shopsmith set-up or another kind.

P.S. to a1gutterman,
What constitutes a "real" router from the SS router accessories? They both hold router bits and turn them fast enough to get the job done. The only difference is with one you can use it hand-held. I find using a featherboard helps keep the wood from kicking back. You can mount the featherboards above the wood and beside the wood on the table as you feed it through. I'm sure breya is just wanting to know its use as a table router.

[a1gutterman]

...P.S. to a1gutterman,
What constitutes a "real" router from the SS router accessories? They both hold router bits and turn them fast enough to get the job done. The only difference is with one you can use it hand-held. I find using a featherboard helps keep the wood from kicking back. You can mount the featherboards above the wood and beside the wood on the table as you feed it through. I'm sure breya is just wanting to know its use as a table router.

Hi woodburner,

In answer to your question: Nothing at all, thus the quotation marks.

If I thought that the SS Mark V could not be used as a "real" router, I wood have said so. I still maintain that a single purpose router is better, but as I said in my original post, that is just my opinion. I will probably knot use my Mark V in the router position, as I have several single purpose routers. I will give you a perfect example: When routing the edges off of glued up laminates, I wood find it impossible to either handle my counter top on the Mark V or hold the Mark V around my counter top .

Another advantage to single purpose routers, is the availability of variable speeds, including speeds in excess of the 10000RPM that the Mark V is capable of. Oddly enough, I like my Mark V, in part, due to it's ability to operate at different speeds]http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/images ... /shrug.gif[/IMG]