I just finished reading Ricks comment on the Harbor Freight work table and supporting China. Over the last few years, I have become so very aware of the selling of America. A few weeks back, I think I remember reading that the Crysler Building in NY had been sold to some outfit in another country. Is there anything left in NY and similar cities that still belong to us?
I am so fortunate to have inherited some very old hand tools from my uncle and father in law. It's with pride that I can look at any of them and see Made in America with the city and corporation stampted on them. I spent nearly a day on the computer looking to see if any of these corporations were still in business and guess what? Not a one of them. They were all made during WW1 and WW2 and during the great depression when my family could not even buy sugar.
Little by little we have been tempted to buy foreign and don't get me wrong, If I see a really quality product from a foreign nation that cannot be found here and want it bad enough then I will purchase it but I usually feel guilty afterwards. When I look back at some of the old planes and drill bits I have, I realise that some person in this country was sitting at a milling machine or lathe trying to feed his family with what ever means he had.
Everytime we go to Woodcraft or Rockler or similar stores, we need to inspect packaging and ask questions about the source and if finding that such tools were made in China then we need to put them back and complain. Eventually, merchants just might get the message that American people are tired of selling America to a foreign world. You and me are doing this to ourselves little by little. Its like a muffler going bad on a car. It wears out so slowly that you don't notice it until its too late and suddenly its blareing in our ears.
Shopsmith desperately needs our support and our help. Through the years they have been responsive to us and like our parents, now we need to be responsive to them when we can. I wish that somehow the Made in America show would consider doing a Shopsmith presentation. There remains a lot in this country to be proud of and Shopsmith is one of them. We are America and we make Shopsmith what it is. So many times in reading these forums, we tend to complain to Shopsmith about the tiniest and insignificant things but not many of us take the time to put ourselves in their place. We are too quick to complain but hardly ever to praise when they do something right.
Among all the misspelling I feel better now.
Arno
"I just finished reading"
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easterngray
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RobertTaylor
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while i agree with most of what you are saying i feel shopsmith has let me down. years ago they offered a great workbench obviously "made in america", where is it now? they used to offer pen mandrels at a reasonable cost "made in america" also. now i'm forced to buy the chinese. i'm sure others could chime in with many more "used to offer". with their current "just in time" inventory i feel they could supply us with more of the things that we need enabling us to buy more "made in america". thanks for listening to my rant, bob
Bob
1954 greenie, 1963 anniversary edition now a mini,
1984 500, 1985 510, 1987 510, pro-planer, bandsaw, dust collector
1954 greenie, 1963 anniversary edition now a mini,
1984 500, 1985 510, 1987 510, pro-planer, bandsaw, dust collector
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cincinnati
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- Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
I have worked in retail for over 20 years. When we do focus groups EVERYONE will say " I would buy American made a pay more for it" But you can put two items side by side, One USA the other an import, Customers will buy the import because of lower price. Customers shop price. Go to a Sears on a saturday (most hand tools made in the USA) Few customers shopping. then go to a Harbor Freight. The place is packed.
There is a saying in retail. We buy what we sell, We don't sell what we buy.
Go to any woodworking forum and ask about Shopsmith tools. Most all will jump on and Say "they cost too much". What are they really saying? "Buy an import, It cost less. Go back and post a message a week later about buying American tools and most will say "Do It" ????????????????? Don't make sense.
Maybe Shopsmith should go back to the green color and call it Festool. They could charge $15,000 for a Mark V and people would love it LOL!!!!
There is a saying in retail. We buy what we sell, We don't sell what we buy.
Go to any woodworking forum and ask about Shopsmith tools. Most all will jump on and Say "they cost too much". What are they really saying? "Buy an import, It cost less. Go back and post a message a week later about buying American tools and most will say "Do It" ????????????????? Don't make sense.
Maybe Shopsmith should go back to the green color and call it Festool. They could charge $15,000 for a Mark V and people would love it LOL!!!!
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a1gutterman
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- Location: "close to" Seattle
I am glad that there are others here that feel similar to me about foriegn made and US made. I hate to think that everyone is sticking their head in the sand; now I feel a little better.
Arno,
I have and do check for the Made in the USA label. I do complain about the lack of available US made product on the shelf and I do refuse to buy non-US made items when I CAN buy US made, regardless of the price.
lv2wdwrk,
Not only was it a large army, there NEVER has been a peace settlement: Only a cease fire. China is still at war with us, and with all the US public support they receive, in the form of financing their war machine with our continued purchasing of China manufactured goods and the selling of high tech knowledge to them, I fear they are winning.
cincinnati,
I do knot shop at Harbor Freight; I simply refuse to. I have been in the local store a total of two times, and do knot plan to ever go again. IMHO, Harbor Freight=Made in China=junk. Oh, and in case you did knot notice, along with the good US made Craftsman hand tools, Sears (K-Mart) puts a foriegn made alternative right next to them with the Sears name on them (not Craftsman).
Arno,
I have and do check for the Made in the USA label. I do complain about the lack of available US made product on the shelf and I do refuse to buy non-US made items when I CAN buy US made, regardless of the price.
lv2wdwrk,
Not only was it a large army, there NEVER has been a peace settlement: Only a cease fire. China is still at war with us, and with all the US public support they receive, in the form of financing their war machine with our continued purchasing of China manufactured goods and the selling of high tech knowledge to them, I fear they are winning.
cincinnati,
I do knot shop at Harbor Freight; I simply refuse to. I have been in the local store a total of two times, and do knot plan to ever go again. IMHO, Harbor Freight=Made in China=junk. Oh, and in case you did knot notice, along with the good US made Craftsman hand tools, Sears (K-Mart) puts a foriegn made alternative right next to them with the Sears name on them (not Craftsman).
Tim
Buying US made products will help keep YOUR job or retirement funds safer.
Buying US made products will help keep YOUR job or retirement funds safer.
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weelildaddy
Well guys...I was of talking in generalization and despite my support to Shopsmith as an American entity, I do agree with one of you over the prices in relation to what you get. I'm not sure they are testing the waters over their prices but I for one, despite them, have been supportive simply because I have too much invested and because SS makes somethings so darn easy for me to accomplish and with an ease that most other machinery just won't do.
Recently, one of you on the weekend trip stressed the quality control but I am here to beg a difference with you. I recently acquired a strip sander during the FD sale that is as shotty as something can get. The table does not sit level, the belt does not track properly over the platen and none of it can be adjusted out and believe me I am a big instruction reader. The hinges on the door were put on crooked and the flashing on the plastic door is anything but clean. The sharpening attachment I bought with it sits at least 1/4th inch off center from the belt. An email inquiry to SS about all of this resulted in nothing but still I support SS. Yes, I should have returned it but I have compromised on everything that is wrong and it does do as advertized. It's just too much trouble to resend something like that and go through all the red tape. I know that people from SS do read these forums and I have posted all of this before and if I worked there, and had read what I had posted, I would have had a new unit on my door step within days at no cost just as a public relations move.
I also agree that people seeing two products side by side, one being cheaper than the other, will by human nature buy the cheaper product. Given my human nature however, if at all possible, I'm going to buy American even at a price differential.
There is one thing I wish SS would do. We see the name Bob Folksworth often in relation to SS but we hear very little from him actually. Perhaps I'm missing something. It would be nice if Bob would every quarter, write a news letter to us SS owners and make us feel included as part of his establishment. After all, we are his family so to speak. I would like to know what is going on there. What are they working on, what are their long range plans etc etc etc. Of course we can hear all of that from others but its not like being included into the family by the man himself.
Good night everyone. I promise not to involve myself in this discussion any further.
Arno
Recently, one of you on the weekend trip stressed the quality control but I am here to beg a difference with you. I recently acquired a strip sander during the FD sale that is as shotty as something can get. The table does not sit level, the belt does not track properly over the platen and none of it can be adjusted out and believe me I am a big instruction reader. The hinges on the door were put on crooked and the flashing on the plastic door is anything but clean. The sharpening attachment I bought with it sits at least 1/4th inch off center from the belt. An email inquiry to SS about all of this resulted in nothing but still I support SS. Yes, I should have returned it but I have compromised on everything that is wrong and it does do as advertized. It's just too much trouble to resend something like that and go through all the red tape. I know that people from SS do read these forums and I have posted all of this before and if I worked there, and had read what I had posted, I would have had a new unit on my door step within days at no cost just as a public relations move.
I also agree that people seeing two products side by side, one being cheaper than the other, will by human nature buy the cheaper product. Given my human nature however, if at all possible, I'm going to buy American even at a price differential.
There is one thing I wish SS would do. We see the name Bob Folksworth often in relation to SS but we hear very little from him actually. Perhaps I'm missing something. It would be nice if Bob would every quarter, write a news letter to us SS owners and make us feel included as part of his establishment. After all, we are his family so to speak. I would like to know what is going on there. What are they working on, what are their long range plans etc etc etc. Of course we can hear all of that from others but its not like being included into the family by the man himself.
Good night everyone. I promise not to involve myself in this discussion any further.
Arno
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cincinnati
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- Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
"Yes, I should have returned it but I have compromised on everything that is wrong and it does do as advertized. It's just too much trouble to resend something like that and go through all the red tape. I know that people from SS do read these forums and I have posted all of this before and if I worked there, and had read what I had posted, I would have had a new unit on my door step within days at no cost just as a public relations move."
I find it amusing that it is too much trouble for you to send the unit back but expect Shopsmith to send you a new one.
Can you post pic's of the defective unit. After taking the factory tour last Saturday I find it hard to believe something like that would make it through the quality control.
I find it amusing that it is too much trouble for you to send the unit back but expect Shopsmith to send you a new one.
Can you post pic's of the defective unit. After taking the factory tour last Saturday I find it hard to believe something like that would make it through the quality control.
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RobertTaylor
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- Location: North Canton, Ohio
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weelildaddy
Cincinnati and Betty:
You misintrepret what I am saying. You don't know the full history of what I am talking about. I should not have gotten into all of that again and I apologize. No, I do not have a digital camera so cannot post a picture. Pictures don't show everything anyway because some of it is function. Anyway it does not matter. I'm sorry it amuses you that I would not want to return the unit. Im almost 70 now and don't have the patients I used to have. It may not be a hassle to you but it is to me. And no, I do not expect SS to place another unit on my doorstep. If I did, I would have arranged for them to do so by returning the one I have. This has gotten out of hand and and has strayed from the intentions of my orignial post. It more or less confirms that some people like to pick at the smallest and most insignificant things. Please just forget it all. Happy woodworking.
You misintrepret what I am saying. You don't know the full history of what I am talking about. I should not have gotten into all of that again and I apologize. No, I do not have a digital camera so cannot post a picture. Pictures don't show everything anyway because some of it is function. Anyway it does not matter. I'm sorry it amuses you that I would not want to return the unit. Im almost 70 now and don't have the patients I used to have. It may not be a hassle to you but it is to me. And no, I do not expect SS to place another unit on my doorstep. If I did, I would have arranged for them to do so by returning the one I have. This has gotten out of hand and and has strayed from the intentions of my orignial post. It more or less confirms that some people like to pick at the smallest and most insignificant things. Please just forget it all. Happy woodworking.