Bosch has a new saw that .............

[rcplaneguy]

[BuckeyeDennis]

We are at philosophical odds here and that is not likely to change.

If one believes that one might be able to "right a wrong" then by all means - attempt to do just that. But when the odds are stacked high against you, why keep fighting a losing battle.

Then you say "Doing what is right is what built a huge part of this country and is far more important than getting rich". But that too is a contradiction. It is those who have the wealth that provide the opportunities for the rest of us. The first names that come to mind is Bill Gates, Michael Bloomberg, Mark Zucherberg, Charles Koch, George Soros and Warren Buffett to name a few. Without these people and the many others like them who hold the wealth in this nation there would be a whole lot of us without a pay check today.

Yes!

Before huge rewards are reaped, there are usually huge risks taken. If you take away the opportunity for the reward, why would any sane person take that risk? Indeed, that is the underlying rationale for the patent system.

[Ed in Tampa]

I see two philosophies there are empire builders and feeders. Empire builders build for tomorrow for their sons and daughters. Feeders grab whatever they can get, however they can get to amass a fortune.

To much is done with the idea of grab what you can and don't worry about anyone else. Greed is a terrible thing that destroys rather than builds. It destroys the hearts of men that have it and destroys all those along the way.

Also what seems to be lost is the answer of when is enough enough. I'm told that 2% of the richest hold more wealth than the rest of the world. To what end?

If you want money fine that is your problem but don't try to sale anyone on the idea you are trying to help humanity by forcing people to buy your product or trying to stop others from making a device that does the same thing.

[everettdavis]

I have heard a number of motivational speakers through the years as I am sure most of us have.

One notion has resonated with me through the years; that the ethical acquiring of wealth is not an issue if it comes in direct proportion to the number of people you helped through the process that enabled you to acquire it.

Most often that comes through making something happen for someone. In the case of Saw Stop I suspect it could equally apply to preventing something from happening to someone.

Everett

[JPG]

I have heard a number of motivational speakers through the years as I am sure most of us have.

One notion has resonated with me through the years; that the ethical acquiring of wealth is not an issue if it comes in direct proportion to the number of people you helped through the process that enabled you to acquire it.

Most often that comes through making something happen for someone. In the case of Saw Stop I suspect it could equally apply to preventing something from happening to someone.

Everett

I would place more emphasis on the detail of being TOTALLY honest in any dealings or communication undertaken during the process of 'acquiring'.

I do not think that applies in 'his' instance.

Yes I am jaded!

[wa2crk]

I recently posted at the beginning of this thread that we recently had an amputation injury in our community wood shop. This is the second serious injury at the shop in about 2 years. We did take action after the first buy buying a new Grizzly table saw but then we had the second incident. We are now seriously considering the Saw Stop system. Doing nothing may actually increase liability exposure just because we didn't react to the second incident in an appropriate manner. I have gone to the websites quoted earlier and read most of the responses.
They were typically " I don't like Glass and I will never buy his product" "I don't like Glass because he is a bully, a boor, a nincompoop' an idiot' a loudmouth and he tried to force his product on the industry through legislation. All of these may be true but is this mindset worth the loss of some fingers?
"I won't use his stuff because it destroys the blade 'and you have to use a Sawstop blade for the system to work" ( not true I just asked )
Many of the responses were in the same vein as the negative and unsubstantiated ones made about Shop Smith gear.
I don't have a lot of love for Glass because I have always have had an adversarial relationship with lawyers. (see my avatar)
However he does have one hell of a product. I have seen,touched, massaged one and even seen the demonstration and it is extremely impressive.
I am sure if we had one in the shop from the gitgo we would not have two members suffering from a form of PTSD trying to figure out what happened.
Sawstop did offer the system to the industry through a licensing agreement but the industry refused to take part. I believe that that was 10 or more years ago.
So the inventor eventually decided to develop his own product line and he succeeded. Now the rest of the industry suddenly woke up and his trying to mimic his device because of lost sales. That's OK. They are a day late and a dollar short.
There is at least one person who would say "he didn't build that, someone else did" but that is a different horse.
End of rant.
Bill V

[Ed in Tampa]

Getting back to the saw. I'm getting of the age that I forget, overlook, fail to notice and often do things not in the safest way.
I'm thinking seriously about my future of using a table saw. If I decide to continue I may buy one with this new technology.
Right now I find the Shopsmith is quickly getting into the same category of a single lens reflex camera without any automation. When I'm more suited to a point and shoot camera.

I get real forgetful missing speed control, carriage lock, quill lock, table height, headstock lock, fence lock, etc. etc. A simple table saw is looking like a point shoot.

Safety becomes more important when I take blood thinners and things. A tiny nick sheds enough blood that looks like a major accident.

[dusty]

Don't rely on gadgets in order to "be safe" in the shop.

[JPG]

Don't rely on gadgets in order to "be safe" in the shop.

AMEN!!!!!





That includes blade guards!!

[BuckeyeDennis]

At work lately, I've been spending a serious amount of mind-numbing time studying various safety standards for machinery, and working a with professional safety-standards consultantcy as needed. UL, NFPA, IEC, CSA et. al. Though details vary, there is one underlying theme. To wit, a single fault should not seriously endanger a human, unless there is just no way around it. After all, things do fail.

The underlying principle of all the standards is that there should be no significant danger unless two or more things fail simultaneously. And that is one whale of a lot less likely.

So yes, properly training the operator can generally prevent injury from almost any device imaginable. But humans are at least as fallible as machines. It's good to have a backup/redundant safety measure. As in, "I got your back".

Regardless of your SawStop leanings, their technology has undoubtedly eliminated the "there is just no way around it" exception.