New owner -- drill chuck runout

[mjl5007]

Hi folks,

I'm a fairly new owner of a 1982 Mark V 500, which I "inherited" from my wife's late grandfather. I had the headstock reconditioned by Jacob Anderson about a year ago, and at that time he commented that it "needed less than the typical" for machines of that vintage -- just new drive sleeve and control sheave bearings and Poly-V belt. The headstock then sat in my basement for 9 months or so, until earlier this summer I finally found the time to get the rest of the machine out of my grandfather-in-law's basement and bring it home. I cleaned it up and have been putting it to light use, mainly as a table saw.

I've now got reason to use it as a drill press, to drill out some 35mm hinge cups on a set of simple shaker-style cabinet doors I made. Last night I went to drill a couple of test holes in some scrap to see if the cheap Ryobi 1-3/8" forstner bit I have will work well enough, and discovered that I've got a fair amount of runout -- as in, I can plainly see the tip of the bit wobbling with the machine running. I tried a couple of other bits as well, both long and short, with the same results, though of course it's more obvious with the longer bits. Point is, I don't *think* it's a problem with the bit(s).

So, I'm looking for some guidance/direction in determining what the problem is, and whether or not I can fix it myself, have it repaired "professionally", or need to replace anything. I can post photos if that would be helpful.

I've been doing some reading here and elsewhere, checking various things, and here's what I know/have found (in no particular order):

• My chuck is a Cushman, not a Jacobs.
• Single-bearing quill, original bearing (presumably Jacob would've replaced it when he overhauled the headstock last year, if it was needed).
• I made sure to tighten the bits in the chuck using all three key holes, same result.
• I've also made sure to center the chuck setscrew on the spindle shaft taper via the "rocking" method.
• It doesn't look like the chuck itself wobbles. That is, if I run the machine with just the chuck attached but no bit, the chuck body itself doesn't appear to wobble -- at least not to a degree that I can easily see it with my naked eye, like I can with the bits.
• The chuck itself has some very minor surface rust, but the sleeve turns freely and smoothly, no gritty feeling. Looking inside with the jaws retracted there is a good bit of crud, so I'm presuming that a thorough cleaning and lube is in order -- what's the proper procedure for doing so? Do I need to look into completely disassembling the chuck? I do not have a press, though I do have a metalworking vice -- can I disassemble/reassemble the chuck somehow with that?
• There is some play in the quill when the quill feed lock is loosened and the quill is extended. At full extension with the quill feed unlocked, I can grab the quill and feel/see movement, mainly in the "vertical" plane with the machine in horizontal mode (towards the top and bottom of the headstock). If I lock the quill feed while extended, the movement is gone. Also no discernible movement with the quill retracted.
• I do not have a dial indicator with which to measure runout.

If measurement of runout is necessary, any places I might borrow a dial indicator, rather than purchasing one that I'll probably almost never use? Would an auto parts store potentially have a dial indicator for loan (thinking of someone trying to check runout on brake discs or something)?

Thanks in advance for any advice. So much great info here, looking forward to many years with my "new" toy.

[Gene Howe]

I'd guess it's the chuck innards. Especially, if there's no discernable run out of the chuck alone. You could check that by running it on "slow" and holding a 1X1, or similar, on the chuck body. You'll feel any run out. If there is any, you likely need a double bearing. I'd suggest that, in any case.
You might try soaking the chuck in a degreaser over night to loosen up any gunk that may be fouling the jaws.
If all else fails, order a new Jacobs chuck from Shopsmith.

[mjl5007]

I was contemplating a new chuck, though at least one post I read here seemed to indicate that the SS-branded chucks available new from SS now aren't the same high-quality chucks as the older "made in USA" Jacobs or Cushman chucks. So maybe I'm better off finding an older Jacobs 3326 on eBay, if it turns out I need to replace mine?

Is it safe to submerge the chuck in liquid -- degreaser and/or Evaporust? Will it remove the existing lubrication, requiring me to re-lube it?

[Gene Howe]

Wouldn't worry about lubricating the chuck. In 40 years, I've never seen the need. In fact, oil collecting dirt may be the problem with the chuck, now.
Evaporust may work, but a true degreaser like Zep or even Simple Green would work, and cheaper, too.
If you must lubricate it, use the lightest stuff you can find or a spray can of drylube.

[mjl5007]

OK -- I've got some Simple Green, I'll give that a shot. Assuming I'm not taking the chuck apart, do I need to flush out the degreaser afterwards? With what... WD-40? Mineral spirits? Something else? (I'm no machinist, as you can tell, so I'm not familiar with all the proper practices, types and applications of various lubricants, etc)

I believe I've got some spray graphite -- would that work as a dry lubricant, if necessary?

Oh, and I only mentioned Evaporust in the event that I get it back in working order and want to pretty it up by removing the minor surface rust.

[JPG]

I would not 'soak'.

Clean jaws with Mineral Spirits and an eye brow brush.

Check jaws for scoring/other damage.

Buff with 400 grit on the outside.

I assume if the spindle shaft was the cause, Jacob would have replaced the quill bearing.

Yes 3326 would be a good move.

The master craft by Jacobs a close second.

[ERLover]

@JPG, what is this in reference too,
"Yes 3326 would be a good move."??

[rjent]

@JPG, what is this in reference too,
"Yes 3326 would be a good move."??

The 3326 it's the one that comes with the 10ER

[ERLover]

@JPG, what is this in reference too,
"Yes 3326 would be a good move."??

The 3326 it's the one that comes with the 10ER

Thanks, I got about 3-4 of them. Skou will be all over this later with the attributes of an ER
On mine, and the ones from my Greenie and Grayling, I had no real problems except one 3326, it was just tight, visual inspection was okay, just PB Blaster penetrating oil, worked them from small to large bit opening, rinsed with some mineral spirits, buffed the out side with green Scotch Brite with MS on it to clean up external corrosion. Wipe clean with MS and a touch of thin/dry lube.

[reible]

Since the drill chuck fits on either end of the main shaft another simple experiment would be to mount it and the same bit on the non quill end and see if the wobble is still there........

Ed