Table Saw Blades

[jms]

Thanks for the personal comments - always good to hear from someone who has tried them both. I was basing my thoughts solely on this video, which of course could have been "rigged".

I did however already order the wood slicer earlier today, so I'll get to see for myself :-D

https://youtu.be/d29Tg6WPKUo

--jeremy

[jsburger]

Thanks for the personal comments - always good to hear from someone who has tried them both. I was basing my thoughts solely on this video, which of course could have been "rigged".

I did however already order the wood slicer earlier today, so I'll get to see for myself :-D

https://youtu.be/d29Tg6WPKUo

--jeremy

OK, I watched the video and that is a whole bunch of crap. I don't know who this guy is but that is total bunk.

[reible]

Well that was an interesting video. What I noticed was the different noise that came from the two different blades. The woodslicer sounded like the sound I would have expected.

I don't know what the issue was with the other blade, perhaps a different tooth count? I don't recall him saying they had identical specs. I tried to read the package to see if I could make out the information but could not. I believe that it should have been the Timber Wolf® 1/2" x 3PC. Anyone able to see this better then me?

edit: After listening to the video again it seems he had a 4tpi blade, still not sure of the model.
edit end

I like timberwolf blades but for resawing and for wet wood I get blades from Highland. Why woodslicer? Well I've had a bandsaw since the early 1970's and used a lot of different blades and resawing was always a test in the early years. I should point out this was not a shopsmith bandsaw. When the woodslicer came out I tried one and loved it. I figured there was no need to look at anything else cause it work so well. When I got my shopsmith bandsaw I went for another woodslicer. I see no reason to change. For the rest of my blades I've been using timberwolf.

I've thought about getting a larger bandsaw for deeper resawing but I really don't have a place to put it. If I did I'd look into the carbide blades for it. I know $150 is a lot but they really last so it might pay for itself in the long run and the cuts are really really nice. I don't think they would do so well on smaller bandsaws like the shopsmith but maybe I'm wrong, just don't want to chance it.

Ed

[masonsailor2]

I recently purchased a woodslicer blade on Ed's recommendation and the blade is excellent. Can't thank you enough Ed. I was having doubts about whether the SS band saw would handle slicing 12/4 Honduran Mahogany but with that blade it was easy and had great results. I think my next upgrade for the BS will be the Carted guide upgrade. I have used the cool blocks for years with great results but adding ball bearing guides seems like a no brainer.
Paul

[dusty]

Thanks for the personal comments - always good to hear from someone who has tried them both. I was basing my thoughts solely on this video, which of course could have been "rigged".

I did however already order the wood slicer earlier today, so I'll get to see for myself :-D

https://youtu.be/d29Tg6WPKUo

--jeremy

OK, I watched the video and that is a whole bunch of crap. I don't know who this guy is but that is total bunk.

What part do you not agree with, John? Don't allow yourself to "sound like a politician". Gives us the facts. Show us the proof. Do a video.

I have used both Timberwolf and Woodslicer for resawing and I believe they both work well. Right now I am running a Woodslicer. I pulled all of the life out of the Timberwolf breaking down fallen Mesquite. Fresh fallen Mesquite is a challenge for any saw blade.

dafixer: I do hope that you have gotten the answer to your questions regarding which table saw blades to use. For me, it is pretty much a toss up. I have Forrest and Shopsmith blades in the shop. Both are good but I prefer the Shopsmith blade. I wish I could tell you with certainty who makes these blades for Shopsmith but I can't. I have a hunch (only a hunch) that they are manufactured by Amana Tools.

Knowing the manufacturer reveals very little though. The blades would be manufactured to meet the Shopsmith specifications. Printed right on my newest saw blade is the statement "Made in Germany, Manufactured Expressly for Shopsmith", The Woodworking Co., Dayton, Ohio


If simply looking for blades with the proper bore, Forrest will bore any of their 10" blades (for a fee) to work on the Shopsmith.

[Ed in Tampa]

Well I don't know what to say but I disagree with Charlese post. I've been using glue line rip blades for some years now and they have worked fine for me. I no longer take the ripped boards to the jointer. What he said was true some years ago but no longer, well at least in my book....
Ed

Well, Well! With all due respect to Ed and Lover, I will have to back off the absolute condemnation of some special rip saws. But still, my hesitation to use saws for glue joints firmly remains.

My first exposure to glue joints in wood came as a three month college course titled "Wood gluing and physical properties". This was an elective course in my 5 year Forestry Education in Montana. Much of this course was aimed at the construction of wood laminated beams that were popular in the 50s and manufactured locally.

As said, this was in the 50s. Since that time much has changed in the field of glues, but wood is still the same.

Below is a few paragraphs from the USFS Forest Products Labratory's "Wood handbook". If you care to read it, the areas I highlighted are applicable to this discussion.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Surface Properties of Wood for
Bonding
Because adhesives bond by surface attachment, the physical
and chemical conditions of the wood’s surface are extremely
important to satisfactory bond performance. The surface should be free
of burnishes, exudates, oils, dirt, and other debris that form
a weak boundary between the adhesive and the wood.
Both mechanical and chemical properties of a wood surface
influence the quality of adhesive bonds. Wood whose
surface is highly fractured or crushed cannot form a strong
bond even if the adhesive forms a strong bond with the
surface. The weak wood underneath the surface is the weak
link in the chain and the location of failure in the bonded assembly.
In other cases, poor bond strength is due to chemical
properties of the surface. Sometimes natural extractives,
overdrying, or chemicals added to modify the wood alter
the surface chemistry enough to harm adhesive bond performance.
Physical deterioration and chemical contamination
interfere with essential wetting, flow, and penetration of
adhesive, and contamination sometimes interferes with the
cure of the adhesive and resulting cohesive strength of the
bond.

Lumber Surfaces
Surfacing or resurfacing the wood within 24 h before bonding
removes extractives and provides a more wettable
surface. Surfacing also removes any unevenness that may
have occurred from changes in moisture content. Parallel
and flat surfaces allow the adhesive to flow freely and form
a uniformly thin layer that is essential to optimal adhesive
performance.

"Experience and testing have proven that a smooth, knife-cut
surface is best for bonding. Surfaces made using saws are
usually rougher than those made using planers and jointers.
However, surfaces sawn with special blades on properly set
straight-line ripsaws are satisfactory for both structural and
nonstructural joints. Furniture manufacturers commonly use
precision sawing of wood joints rather than two-step sawing
and jointing to reduce costs for labor, equipment, and
material. Unless the saws and feed works are well maintained,
however, joints made with sawed surfaces will be
weaker and less uniform in strength than those made with
sharp planer or jointer knives. Dull cutting edges of planer
or jointer knives crush and burnish the cells on the wood
surface. Not only are these cells weaker, they also inhibit
adhesive wetting and penetration. Damage to the surface can
be revealed by wiping a very wet rag over a portion of
the surface, waiting for a minute or more, removing any
remaining water with a dry paper towel, and comparing the
roughness of the wet and dry surfaces. If the wetted area
is much rougher than the dry area, then the machining has
damaged the surface. A weak joint results if the adhesive
does not completely penetrate crushed cells to restore their
original strength.

I think the virtue of Charles post can be easily tested using the method described in the last paragraph of his quote. Before we say Charles's position is wrong or out date do the simple test. I don't buy the glue line high cost hype. I think some of the newer blades may produce a near finish cut but is that really worth a 2-3 time mark up in price?

A pass through the jointer is easy enough and certainly cheaper.

[jsburger]

Thanks for the personal comments - always good to hear from someone who has tried them both. I was basing my thoughts solely on this video, which of course could have been "rigged".

I did however already order the wood slicer earlier today, so I'll get to see for myself :-D

https://youtu.be/d29Tg6WPKUo

--jeremy

OK, I watched the video and that is a whole bunch of crap. I don't know who this guy is but that is total bunk.

What part do you not agree with, John? Don't allow yourself to "sound like a politician". Gives us the facts. Show us the proof. Do a video.

I have used both Timberwolf and Woodslicer for resawing and I believe they both work well. Right now I am running a Woodslicer. I pulled all of the life out of the Timberwolf breaking down fallen Mesquite. Fresh fallen Mesquite is a challenge for any saw blade.

dafixer: I do hope that you have gotten the answer to your questions regarding which table saw blades to use. For me, it is pretty much a toss up. I have Forrest and Shopsmith blades in the shop. Both are good but I prefer the Shopsmith blade. I wish I could tell you with certainty who makes these blades for Shopsmith but I can't. I have a hunch (only a hunch) that they are manufacturer by Amana Tools.

Knowing the manufacture reveals very little though. The blades would be manufactured to meet the Shopsmith specifications. Printed right on my newest saw blade is the statement "Made in Germany, Manufactured Expressly for Shopsmith", The Woodworking Co., Dayton, Ohio


If simply looking for blades with the proper bore, Forrest will bore any of their 10" blades (for a fee) to work on the Shopsmith.

The way he tried to make the Timberwolf blade look like it wouldn't cut butter. I was expexting to see the smoke start rolling at any moment. You have used both as have I. Either that was a very dull blade or he was faking it. As reible said the noise it made didn't even sound right. As I said in another post there is nothing wrong with the wood slicer. It works very well but so does the Timberwolf. In my opinion it works equally as well so why pay almost twice the price for a wood slicer?

[reible]

"I think the virtue of Charles post can be easily tested using the method described in the last paragraph of his quote. Before we say Charles's position is wrong or out date do the simple test. I don't buy the glue line high cost hype. I think some of the newer blades may produce a near finish cut but is that really worth a 2-3 time mark up in price?

A pass through the jointer is easy enough and certainly cheaper."

I have tested but by gluing up joint and braking them. That is why I say what I say. Of course you can do the same testing I did or the water test if you like. Simple just open the pocket book and buy one of these "over priced blades".

This is the one I've been using of late, and I don't see it being over priced at $49.90. You need to have a rip blade anyway so why would you not get a glue line quality blade?

http://www.infinitytools.com/saw-blades ... t-097-kerf

Yes you still might want to joint sometimes but most of the time you just don't need to.

I feel rip blades like this are actually cheap when I pay much more for this blade:

http://www.infinitytools.com/saw-blades ... -thin-kerf

This being a combo blade I would and do rip with it for less critical uses. Not sure I would go to glue after the cuts but then maybe someday I'll test it and see what happens.

I'm very comfortable do my thing with the glue line blades and have been for a lot of years now. I'd say get one and do your own testing. If it works for you then you have learned something, if not you still have a good quality rip blade to use and then joint away.

Ed

[ChrisNeilan]

My saw blades from Rigid Carbide give me a great edge, however my technique sucks! I always plan on the jointer to fix my bad technique, whether is is bad measurement, set up or carelessness... I am getting better!

[benush26]

dafixer: I do hope that you have gotten the answer to your questions regarding which table saw blades to use. For me, it is pretty much a toss up. I have Forrest and Shopsmith blades in the shop. Both are good but I prefer the Shopsmith blade. I wish I could tell you with certainty who makes these blades for Shopsmith but I can't. I have a hunch (only a hunch) that they are manufacturer by Amana Tools.

Knowing the manufacture reveals very little though. The blades would be manufactured to meet the Shopsmith specifications. Printed right on my newest saw blade is the statement "Made in Germany, Manufactured Expressly for Shopsmith", The Woodworking Co., Dayton, Ohio

Hey Dusty,
According to Doug Reid, he believes the Shopsmith table saw blades are CMT.
That might explain the CMT relationship with dado blades.

Be well,
Ben