Is my Mark VII motor/switch wiring correct?

[n240sxle91]

Sorry, I don't think I was very clear. I meant it's one more amp than the GE motor listed in the new manual.

[everettdavis]

Success!! It worked both forward and reverse!

I'll try both switches and report back.

Thanks so much!

Slow down grasshopper!!

Wire the RED/BLK/ORN and VIO wires to the switch as follows.

But before doing that let's determine if the reversing part of the switch works properly.

The switch has three positions forward, off, and reverse.

I assume you know which button to push for each position.

So get out yer ohmmeter and check the following:

Switch forward. T5 to 5(middle one) T9 to 2 <<<< s/b reverse

Switch reverse. T5 to 2 T9 to 5(outer one) <<<< s/b forward

IFF ok connect motor wires as follows:

RED to T5
BLK to T9

other wires:

ORN TO 2

VIO TO both 5(JUMPER THE TWO '5')

That should be it.

MVII GE MOTOR WITH RELAY.jpg

MVII GE MOTOR WITH RELAY B.jpg

Sorry JPG.

I missed this entirely while reading on my phone. I will take this and build a 4th wiring diagram for the GE with External Relay.

Everett

[everettdavis]

Here's the new drawing. I will update my Google Drive with a PDF to accompany the other files.

Thanks to you both for being willing to share the info that helped us close a hole in the documentation for the 1960's Mark VII we have collected and shared.

Everett

And yes, JPG I will consider updating the Mark VII Owner's manual with this new drawing, however I would first like to know n240sxle91 actual name so I may credit both n240sxle91 and James Grange Sr. properly for their contributions to this knowledge base on the 4th type of motor which I have listed as 50XXXX not knowing the actual model number issued at the time.

50XXXX GE Motor - Shopsmith Mark VII with External Motor Start Relay.png (286.21 KiB) Viewed 5724 times

[JPG]

I consider the 'purple' wire to be a questionable 'detail'. It is reasonable considering 'his' had a purple jumper. On the internal start switch GE motor there is a purple motor wire. All other motors have a yellow wire for that 'function'. We will likely never know what evolved back then.

[everettdavis]

I consider the 'purple' wire to be a questionable 'detail'. It is reasonable considering 'his' had a purple jumper. On the internal start switch GE motor there is a purple motor wire. All other motors have a yellow wire for that 'function'. We will likely never know what evolved back then.

I totally agree. It's why I included the notation that "Wire Color may Vary On point to point wiring for external connectors." Equally, if the motor has ever been in someone's shop for a rebuild, it is possible that the repair center used whatever wire they had suitable to the job.

Since his photos had the Violet wire, that's how I drew it, and you listed it as well.

Indeed the other two connected wires in that section (motor and jumper) of the circuit were yellow. Very easily all could have been yellow. Indeed it will be difficult to determine the 1960's OEM supplied wire.

I'm just thankful we can reasonably document the wiring diagrams themselves for the 4 motors we now know of. Last year you were the one who clued me into the fact there was supposed to be a 4th type in the first place.

I am so glad we were able to document it now. I sent all four also to simone the eBay motor re-builder so he can provide them to his customers when he repairs a Mark VII motor.

Everett

[n240sxle91]

So what originally made you guys believe there was four types of motors? Was it my post last summer, or was there something else that made you believe there was another motor?

Also, do you guys have any thoughts on why my motor has a higher amperage, but same HP? Seems odd to me. I would have thought a higher amperage would equal more HP.

[everettdavis]

Here's a non-standard A.O. Smith re-wiring job someone did on one as an example of what's out there in the wild.

Everett

Mark VII A O Smith Motor with interal centrifugal switch rewired with non-typical wire colors.jpg (172.38 KiB) Viewed 5677 times

[everettdavis]

So what originally made you guys believe there was four types of motors? Was it my post last summer, or was there something else that made you believe there was another motor?

Also, do you guys have any thoughts on why my motor has a higher amperage, but same HP? Seems odd to me. I would have thought a higher amperage would equal more HP.

JPG had interacted with another owner quite some time ago who had one, but the owner never followed up with pictures. He mentioned it quite some time ago when I drew the first series of motor wiring from some of the OEM manuals. Indeed in one I drew that appeared wrong, it came from the OEM wrong and JPG later found it was one he sent me originally from an OEM manual for the Mark VII that was illustrated wrong from the factory.

He has known about it for several years. I, only the last two, which I learned from him. He is definitely the Mark VII guru among us.

Could you by chance post a clear photo of the GE Motor data plate?

Everett

[JPG]

So what originally made you guys believe there was four types of motors? Was it my post last summer, or was there something else that made you believe there was another motor?

Also, do you guys have any thoughts on why my motor has a higher amperage, but same HP? Seems odd to me. I would have thought a higher amperage would equal more HP.

Indeed it was!

Amperage and horse power are co-dependent, though not directly. I would surmise a design difference. Perhaps a result of the dual shaft armature.






All we need now is a fifth!

[n240sxle91]

Here is the label on the Motor. If there's something you can't read off from it let me know, and I'll try to get a better angle.

GE motor with external relay.jpg (336.03 KiB) Viewed 5645 times