New to the hobby; looking for tips

[br549]

ehbowen,

Don't know if you were able to see the one in Austin or not before the listing was deleted, but a few more thoughts about your previous post.

Based on the fence (a Vega Pro 40) you are looking at to add to a Craftsman table saw, I get the feeling you may be disappointed with a model 10E/10ER or a Mark 5/V/500. Both have relatively small tables and much shorter fences. I have never owned a stand alone table saw, and have always felt more comfortable cutting larger panels or pieces with a hand held circular saw and a guide. The few times I did try cutting larger pieces on my Mark V were not too successful. I usually work by myself, and man-handling and controlling the piece of wood was my main problem, even with infeed and outfeed supports. I mostly use the table saw, sanding and drilling functions on my Shopsmith, and on workpieces of a size that I can easily control. The ability to switch functions while maintaining some of the setup adjustments is part of why I enjoy owning a Shopsmith.

Having said that, the larger 505/510/520/7 table systems and fences are thought by many to be a vast improvement over the 5/V/500. Again, no personal experience here, but if I were starting over and had the space, I would definitely have to re-think my needs. The compactness of the 5/V/500 is one of it's main advantages for me, as a semi-serious hobbyist. It is a trade-off of versatility and compactness.

While the main itself is not terribly larger than a 5/V/500 system, the 505/510/520/7 table system gives you much more support and configuration capabilities. The 520/7 systems will probably give you a fence with more of what you find attractive in the Vega Pro 40.

If you are still looking, Craigslist can still be your friend. Good buys come up all of the time, but it involves patience. You might want to expand your search radius. You may want to include cities in which you have relatives or good friends who could make purchases for you. You can set up alerts to notify you of any new listings. Keep your search terms more general, such as "Shopsmith" and "Shop Smith" to get more results. Being spelled both ways will get you more results on Craigslist. Unlike ebay, you won't have to sort through hundreds or thousands of listings. I don't belong to Facebook, but I have read that there is even a Facebook group for buying and selling Shopsmith machines and parts. And, if you have a chance to view a Shopsmith demo, that would be a good way to see one in action. It was seeing a demo in a mall 40 years ago that led to my purchase of a Mark V.

Keep reading the articles and links that others have provided about what to look for in purchasing a used Shopsmith, and learn all you can about maintenance and repair, as any Shopsmith will need some care and feeding during it's long lifetime.

Best of luck.

[ehbowen]

BR549--

No, I didn't get to see the one in the Austin listing; someone had already moved in on it the previous day. There are two other ones which I see which might be worthy of a look; I'll accept recommendations from those here:

https://austin.craigslist.org/tls/d/bas ... 34536.html
This one is at the absolute top of my current budget range; it looks to have a bunch of accessories but seeing as how it's all jumbled up in a pile with no other information it looks to be an "estate sale special" from a vulture with no expertise. Could consider if it would really jump-start me.

https://sanantonio.craigslist.org/wan/d ... 08752.html
This one looks like it might be a decent starter machine; I wonder what it would take to get it fully capable. One thing I like about it: It has wheels. I need that for my location (although I assume they're not all that expensive to add).

As far as my needs: As the thread says, I'm new to the hobby. I'm actually in the process of building out a bathroom renovation and I find myself in need of some custom cabinetry to conceal an HVAC duct or two. I picked up the Craftsman 10" table saw for $50; it had NOTHING except the base, drive, and motor. I've been able to find everything except a rip fence. What I'm using right now is a piece of aluminum channel Vise-Gripped to the table. I really don't need the large sheet capability of the Vega right now, but it happens to be the only good rip fence I've found which is 1) available and 2) will fit on my saw without major custom modifications.

So a Model V/500 will probably meet my immediate needs. If I get to the point where I have help and do want to saw big 4x8 sheets on the table, I can always buy the Vega Pro 40 at that point. Perhaps someday I'll have the funds to buy a brand-new Mark VII. Until then, I'm wanting to get established in the hobby at a level I can currently afford. True Confessions time: I first had my eye on Shopsmith when they were advertising in Boy's Life in the early 1970s. So if I can get a decent setup fairly close to home (I have a shortie Voyager minivan to transport it), I'll be pleased.

Thanks very much for your advice so far.

[chapmanruss]

Well two different options there. The one in Austin looks to be a little newer and has five major accessories/SPT's with it. Form the picture I see a Jig Saw, Belt Sander, Jointer, Band Saw and the Mark Mount Planer. All in all that looks like a good really buy for the price.

The one for sale in San Antonio is a basic Mark 5/V with most of the standard accessories. If it was made before 1980 it will say Mark 5 on the vent/serial number plate, otherwise it will say Mark V. The ad tells what is missing. It looks a bit older than the other one and I base that on the Blade Guards each one has. Also an interesting paint job.

Both will likely work just as well. It is a matter of how much you are willing to spend right now. Just a Mark 5/V or a Mark V with 5 SPT's.

[ehbowen]

Thanks for the answer. Unfortunately I can't make a move on it today; I'm having a minor health issue and I'm supposed to work the graveyard shift tonight. But if it's still available come Friday morning I'll probably be making a drive out to Austin.

[br549]

My $0.02 about your other two finds:

The San Antonio one would worry me a little ... the way tubes are still pretty rough, for a unit that has been "renovated". It's not missing much to have the basic standard equipment (drill chuck, lathe centers, access hole cover.) I would ask the seller if he or she personally owned the machine and used it before painting it and find out as much as you can about the operational condition.

The one in Austin looks to be a much better buy for the money, especially if you need any of the Special Purpose Tools. The surface planer is the most valuable of the bunch and could easily be sold if you didn't want or need it. Many users add a jointer, bandsaw, or belt sander, so those are fairly commonly found used and typically can be had for $150 or less. Planers typically go for much more. The main unit is also on wheels (casters). This unit has the upgraded upper and lower saw guard, a definite improvement over the original version. While it may be an estate sale special, you never know ... I saw this one advertised when it first came out and even posted about it on the "Heads Up - Bargain Available" thread in the Community Forum (another good place to watch for bargains). Much of may take some work, and elbow grease, but could be worth the effort. Again, find out about the operational condition, and ask if it can be demonstrated. The ad is 2 months old now, and sometimes sellers forget to take down ads after items sell. So if you do investigate, please let us know what you learn about it.

[DLB]

Of the two, the Austin unit is a far better value IMO. The add on accessory equipment, SPTs, frequently drive price in any used Mark 5/Mark V. This one comes with five, though condition might not be perfect, including a Planer. It is likely to come with many more things not normally included with a basic MV. (I see some of that in the pic, safety equipment, probably a main table extension, probably a second extension table, etc.)

The SA unit appears to include no SPTs. It is missing a few parts but they are reasonably easy to obtain. It has been repainted but is in kind of rough overall condition. It is hard to estimate its age but the aluminum sanding disc, if original, suggests it is pretty old.

Most, not all, used Shopsmiths have retractable casters (the wheels you noted) for ease of movement, and both of these have them.

- David

[ehbowen]

Well, the nice one in Austin with all the accessories sold also, apparently quite some time back...the seller says that he's still getting "thousands" of calls. So, I'm still looking. At least I'm getting a little better idea of going "market rates."

[ehbowen]

Hope Springs Eternal department: I just got off the phone with the seller of this listing:

https://easttexas.craigslist.org/tls/d/ ... 20222.html

Really no information there, and the seller couldn't add much more. He really doesn't know what he has, only that his father bought it 40 years ago and developed health problems which kept him from using it much. But when I asked about add-on accessories he said that it did have the bandsaw addition and perhaps some more, and that someone had come by a week ago and offered him $700 for the setup. He countered with $800 and the guy said he would get back to him but he hasn't called back yet.

I've made an appointment to drive up Friday and take a look at it. I've told him that if it's complete, with the bandsaw and possible other accessories and in good condition overall I should be willing and able to go $800.

Posting this here to ask for tips in evaluating condition and value and the real hot-button items to check before closing the deal. Thanks for your patience and help.

[br549]

Hope it works out for you. If it truly is 40 years old, then it is probably is a Mark V, just as ad states (now called a 500).

Pictures would be a big help in getting any kind of feedback on condition and potential issues. I am always a little surprised when any Craigslist ad doesn't include pictures, but perhaps the seller could email some to you, and you could in turn post here.

Based on what is known so far, unless the condition is near mint and all "standard" accessories are included (fence, miter gauge, saw guards, sanding disk, lathe chisels, drill chuck, etc), even with a bandsaw, the price might be a little high, even at $800. If there are more SPT's or other valuable accessories, that would change things.

If the seller has no working knowledge, then it will be up to you to determine the running condition. The previously mentioned Guide to Buying a Used Shopsmith will be extremely helpful. Don't forget the number one rule - NEVER* turn the speed control unless the unit is running.

*The one major exception: turning spindle by hand, using sanding disk or lathe faceplate, for example, to get speed control down from Fast to Slow, after oiling.

[ehbowen]

Thanks. One more question. This post gives instructions on breaking down the unit for transport. It says to bring a 9/16" socket and ratchet and a long T-handled Allen wrench. Socket and ratchet, no problem. But what size Allen wrench? Later on in the thread someone recommends bringing a backup in case your primary breaks; I don't mind buying one Allen wrench assortment but two or more of them "just in case" seems overkill. Does anyone know the exact size of those setscrews?

Thinking about it, a can of penetrating oil might not be a bad addition to the traveling bag...