Noisey Power Pro Headstock

[hfmann]

Hey RF Guy, I hadn't thought about needing a replacement screw. Dang, better order that right away. Thanks.

And I'll give the vice grips a try. I assumed I wouldn't be able to get a grip on that domed top. Just ran out to try it and just couldn't get a good enough grip on the thing. There's a lip on the motor mount that prevents getting a grip on more than about 40% of the head. It just slides off when trying to turn it.

We'll see what the 4mm wrench does before trying the screw extractor.

thanks,

hal

[RFGuy]

Hal,

Do you have more than one size of Vise Grips? I have the "normal" size one, but also have a smaller, needle nose Vise Grip one. Not saying this will definitely work in this situation, but it has saved me quite a few times. It is tight quarters from your picture and the pan head makes it hard to keep a Vise Grips on it without slipping, but not impossible if you can get on the pan head. Another option, if the 4mm hex wrench doesn't work, is to try a small tip straight (flat blade) screwdriver. If you have a small tip screwdriver of just the write size, sometimes you can insert it into the hex head and get just enough bite to turn it and loosen it. If it is really stripped this won't work, but I have had luck with this method a few times too. Good luck with it.

[hfmann]

Thanks RF Guy,

You certainly have a lot of good ideas and I appreciate your suggestions. Unfortunately don't have small VG. Tomorrow I may try a normal needle nose and see if I can get it tight enough around the head. I did try some small flat bladed screwdrivers earlier but none of them fit.

Picked up a good set of metric allen wrenches last night and am anxious to try the 4mm today.

I was too late in calling SS to order another screw last night. Will hit that as soon as they open this morning. Puzzling that the item number listed in the exploded drawing (522660) didn't get a hit in the SS search bar.

I do have a screw extractor set that I might have to put to use if nothing else works. In any event, looks like another weekend working in the yard instead of the shop.

I'll update later on the 4mm wrench results.

hal

[stew]

If you have a Dremel Tool you might be able cut either a straight grove across the head of the bolt for a straight screw driver or cut in both directions for a phillips screw driver

[DLB]

I was too late in calling SS to order another screw last night. Will hit that as soon as they open this morning. Puzzling that the item number listed in the exploded drawing (522660) didn't get a hit in the SS search bar.

My source of choice on things like this screw is Fastenal, but that is primarily due to location. Their distribution network is great and I pay virtually no shipping if I pick up my order at a store that happens to be convenient for me. https://www.fastenal.com/product/fasten ... lyId=21637 In my experience they are cost effective and very quick. They have a home delivery option but I prefer in store pickup. Selection is not quite in line with Grainger's, but good.

- David

[hfmann]

Stew - Good idea. I may pull that dremel out of the closet and give it a try if the extractor doesn't do it.

The new 4mm wrench almost did it. Almost but I guess the head is too far gone.

RF Guy - Also couldn't get enough grip with my standard needle nose pliers. (Saw your name on "My Growth Rings" video today. What a great resource.)

David - OMG, Thank you. You even gave me the Fastenal part #s. I would have been lost trying to find the right items. Incredible customer service. My local store didn't have it in stock, but immediately gave me the closest store that did. He even called them to verify that I could buy a small quantity (2). What great customer service. So...topping off the electric car for a short road trip this afternoon. 82 miles round trip and I may be back cutting wood this weekend after all. Thank you.

hal

[hfmann]

HURRAY. The screw is out and replaced with the one I picked at Fastenal (thanks again).

Getting your alignment screws back to a starting point once you get this screw out won't be hard.
- David

Ok David, Ready to go. How do I get these alignment screws back in place. (aren't they really tensioning screws?).

tensioning screws.jpg (36.95 KiB) Viewed 1538 times

In Jim's video he says after turning them out 2 turns, he only turned it back in one turn and it was plenty tight. Also I don't understand how turning one screw in and the other one out keeps them aligned.

Anyway - now getting excited I could be back in business today with all everyone's help.

Standing by for further guidance.

hal

[edma194]

Those screws just used for the alignment position. The two screws on the side of the mount have to be loosened. Tightening one of the alignment screws pushes the motor away from the mounting block attached to the casting, loosening just provides room for the motor to move outward. If gravity doesn't move the motor when you loosen an alignment screw then you have to push it in place yourself. Once in position you lock the position down by tightening the other two screws on the side of the mount. Take your time doing the alignment, you need to get the lower belt parallel to the upper one, and both perpendicular to the spindle shaft.

[DLB]

Can I ask which book you have? I can expand on detail for any of the steps. I'm using the DIY PP Upgrade Instructions combined with my recollections from the Jim McCann video. I would deviate from those though and use a 4 MM tool for this.

Pre-conditions - Upper belt should be tight using the eccentric. To me, this means some deflection under moderate pressure but less than 1/8". All PP countersunk mounting screws installed (item 50) with the lower belt in place on both pulleys.

Slightly loosen the four Tension Locking button head screws. These will lock the motor in position after it is tensioned and aligned.

You will primarily be adjusting two things, but the adjustments interact somewhat. The two setscrews at the pulley end primarily adjust belt tension. The two button head screws at the other end primarily tilt the motor to align the face of the motor pulley to the pulley on the idler shaft. You want to adjust the screws in pairs, for example if you want to tighten the belt you'll adjust the two setscrews tighter equally by counting turns or fractions of turns. Thus, you need that equal starting point.

Two get your screws to an equal starting point, I would adjust the two tension setscrews to measure a gap of 1/8" at the pulley end of both mounts. (If this would make the belt too tight, decrease the gap size). Then adjust the two button head alignment screws to get the same gap at the fan end of the motor. Note that the screw pairs have the opposite effect, clockwise on the setscrews to increase the gap, but counterclockwise on the button heads to increase the gap. When both gaps are even on both ends and even with each other you have that equal starting point. I've edited your pic to show where you'll measure the gap, circled in green. This gap being even at both ends is a starting point only, it does not have to end up that way.

Gap in green

tensioning screws.jpg (68.85 KiB) Viewed 1521 times

From that point you should be able to follow the procedure in the manual. The manual uses a straightedge to properly align the motor pulley to the idler shaft pulley. The way I remember the video this wasn't done. In your case I recommend doing it with the straightedge per the manual.

After completing the motor belt tension and alignment you'll need to go back and perform the belt tension balance portion. Sequence is backwards in the manual. Note that the eccentric bushing is going to have a much different feel and is not going far in either direction once both belts are on it and properly tightened. This is normal.

- David

[hfmann]

Hi Edma and David,

Thanks for the info.

I bought the headstock so only have instruction manual. There is a maintenance and troubleshooting section that goes through first "Balancing the Belt Tension" and then secondly "motor belt tensioning." In contrast to the manual, In Jim's video, the tensioning is done first, and then the balancing with the eccentric is done second. It take it you agree with Jim versus the manual.

Edma and David - even with the manual I don't get how to use a straightedge to "check that the face of the Motor Pulley is still aligned with the center of Poly-V Pulley on the Idlershaft." (And yes David - Jim didn't do that in the video) All I can tell is when I put a straightedge across the top of the motor pulley, the edge seems to squarely strike the lower part of the top pulley on the idler belt.

straightedge on motor pulley

straightedge on pulley.jpg (54.8 KiB) Viewed 1506 times

Edma - When you say "Take your time doing the alignment, you need to get the lower belt parallel to the upper one, and both perpendicular to the spindle shaft." I don't know how to check those things other than what I did with the straightedge. The little v ridges in the motor belt seems to ride in properly in the motor pulley and idler grooves. I can't see inside the upper belt to tell if that's seated properly. Also this all seemed to fit so I assumed I assumed belts were parallel to each other and perpendicular to the idler shaft.

Poly V belt on motor pulley and idler pulley

20201010_143450.jpg (51.47 KiB) Viewed 1506 times

After following all the instructions I ended up with what I thought was a tight belt with little flex, I ended up with fairly even gap on the motor mount adjustment plates.

gap on motor mount plate

20201010_143813.jpg (40.78 KiB) Viewed 1506 times

Started up the motor. Ran very smooth and quiet at 500, 900, 1200 rpms. At 2,000 slight rattle (bearing?) and more noticeable at 3,450. Loosening the eccentric bolt, the rattle became less, but still noticeable. It was impossible to rotate the eccentric with screwdriver as instructed in video and manual. This was so with the bolt totally loose. I remember several days ago when there was no main belt tension, it was easy to rotate that eccentric with the screwdriver. What next?

I also noticed when I shut the machine off, the main belt and motor pulley were quite warm. Is that normal? Could I have the belt too tight?

As I await further guidance, Thank you.

hal