Jointer - cutter head wedge bar screws

[bobgroh]

Continuing my saga with the SS 510 - now working on the jointer (same age as 510, i.e. 1994). Have disassembled the whole thing and taken out a ton of old saw dust, mud dabber nests and the like. Disassembled the cutter head and noticed some damaged screw threads on the wedge bar hold down screws (see attached picture). The screw on left is undamaged and the one on the right has the threads on the lower half damaged (the bright area - the thread tops are wiped off and flattened). The damaged screws were also more difficult to extract (no surprise) - about 1/2 the screws (of the 9 total) were damaged in this fashion. I also noted that the screws seem to be bent slightly.

My intent is to replace all the screws and to run an appropriate tap down through the holes in the cutter head to clean up the threads.

When checking my jointer manual (for an earlier jointer 2/84), it indicates washers (PN 502272) are used under each screw. My jointer does NOT have those washers. I also noted that the screws on my jointer come perilously close to coming out the other end (which the washer would certainly help). As a note, SS indicates the washers are special (??) and cost a fortune ($6.74 each!). Ouch.

So on to my questions:
#1: Has anyone else found damaged screws?
#2: Has anyone else noted bent screws?
#3: Should there be washers on each of the screws?
#4: Does anyone have an updated Parts List and parts drawing they could send me since my manual is for an older unit.

As always, all information eagerly waited for and greatly appreciated.

[Bruce]

My jointer (1980's model) does not have washers. How many screws hold each knife, three or five?

[doug45601]

My Jointer, purchased in 96 was mfg is 95, same as my other SS equipment and "yes" there is a washer under each of the wedge screws.. BUT, there is no picture of, or call for the washers in my manual or even the Shopsmith parts catalog. Don't know why?!

Somewhere along the mfg line of assembly, washers were used but this did't get passed along to the tech writing department of Shopsmith and therefore never made it to the re-write of the tech manuals or parts manuals..

Guess since the installation of washers never got documented correctly into the parts and service manuals they were ignored during assembly to the point where they actually didn't install them at all?? Not a big deal as far as I can see one way or the other.

sorry, unable to post pictures of manuals or documentation.. Never learned to get that far advanced into computers..

[JPG]

When checking my jointer manual (for an earlier jointer 2/84), it indicates washers (PN 502272) are used under each screw. My jointer does NOT have those washers. I also noted that the screws on my jointer come perilously close to coming out the other end (which the washer would certainly help). As a note, SS indicates the washers are special (??) and cost a fortune ($6.74 each!). Ouch.

So on to my questions:
#1: Has anyone else found damaged screws?
#2: Has anyone else noted bent screws?
#3: Should there be washers on each of the screws?
#4: Does anyone have an updated Parts List and parts drawing they could send me since my manual is for an older unit.

As always, all information eagerly waited for and greatly appreciated.

#1 Probably
#2 see #1
#3 Probably NOT - Current ss parts list etc. does NOT show them
#4 http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/part ... xpview.htm

THEY (SS) WILL BE HAPPY TO SELL YOU ONE - THE PRICE IS I THINK REASONABLE - WE NEED TO SUPPORT THEM!!!!

WOW! I just (trial and no error) learned how to embed a LINK!!!!!

I would make sure the threads in the cutter head are good. Cleaning them out with a tap would remove any debris, but would not restore the threads if damaged. Replace ALL the screws and keep the 'good' ones as spares.

Hope the cutter head threads are good since the head is only sold as a complete assembly, but you would get new blades and bearings with it.

P.S. My 1963 jointer HAS them. ... Manual published in 1962 shows them(3/blade).

[BigSky]

I am looking at the exploded parts view that is available for downloading on the front page of the Shopsmith website. If this is the correct drawing, there are no expensive washers in the Cutter head assembly. When I do a search for the part number 502272 it returns "no matches found". I have no washers on the wedge hold down screws of which there are nine. Three in each wedge. In fact, the wedges are counterbored for the heads of the screws. There is no way I could install washers. If I did, the heads would be far too high.

This may mean that you and I have different jointers. What is the serial number on yours.

ps A search for the part number on the Shopsmith Site, owners page, does return the $6.74 price.

[JPG]

I think the reason the washers are special/expensive is because they have a very small od to fit into the counter bore in the wedges.

[BigSky]

I read your post over again. Now I am not sure. Do you have an old jointer (84ish) or do you have a newer jointer of the same vintage as your Mark 5. I think that is going to make a real big difference.

I suggest you download the pdf catalog and do some research.

Again I say, check serial numbers.

http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/faq/jointer.htm

That thought triggered a stupid question that really has nothing to do with the problem here but....when they (SS) quit assigning serial numbers and began using date codes....do they then build only one unit a day or are there multiple units with the same serial number (date code)?

.

[JPG]

... That thought triggered a stupid question that really has nothing to do with the problem here but....when they (SS) quit assigning serial numbers and began using date codes....do they then build only one unit a day or are there multiple units with the same serial number (date code)?

.

MULTIPLES I would think! We all seem to use the SN as a date of manufacture indicator anyway so why not just date codes? Makes sense and is much simpler ALL around since there is really no need for EACH unit to have a unique ID!:)

[billmayo]

I use a #10 stainless steel lockwasher under each cutter head screw. I only lightly snug the wedge screws when installing each knife. The lock washer provides a little force on the wedge to hold the knife when adjusting the knife height. This also allows me to loosen the screws and wedge easlier if the knife was raised too high and needs to be reset. I only tighten the wedge screws once the knife height is correct.

It appears someone cross threaded, tried to used the wrong thread size screws or did not clean the cutter head screw holes prior to installing the screws. I use a #10 bottom tap to clean the cutter head screw holes before resetting the knives.

[bobgroh]

Thanks for the hints, ideas and slap to the back of the head (which, goodness knows, I need every now and then). I had forgotten about the parts lists and assembly drawings on the web site. Duh! That takes care of an update for my manual - I printed the assembly drawing and stuck in my manual. It does not, as others mentioned, show any washers so that point is settled.

For those who asked, my jointer is the latest model 'Jointer "C"', PN 555483, with SN (date code) of '020191' (February 1991). So it predates the SS itself by about a year.

Thanks for the comment about the jointer owner's manual - buying one et al. They are pretty inexpensive. I do have one (that came with my other 510 and along with a fresh set of jointer blades but not, unfortunately, the jointer itself).

Again thanks to all.