Age of my “1956” Greenie

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shipwright
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Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by shipwright »

A couple of weeks ago I bought what seemed to be a 1956 (from the serial #) Greenie. While investigating a slipping Gilmer drive I found a few anomalies.
1) Only two screws on the belt cover
2) The Gilmer drive hub has the set screw but it is on the end sleeve, not in the splined part of the hub. (Yes, tightening it fixed the slipping).
3) The eccentric tensioner is secured by the screw and washer, not by the earlier clips.
4) There is an inspection hole behind the logo cover.

I don’t believe any of these should be on a 1956 Machine? Am I right?

To make things interesting the belt cover is green, the main body of the headstock is grey, and the motor pan is gold.

Do I need to take it to the circus and have the clown guess it’s age?
Paul M ........ The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese
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JPG
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by JPG »

1956 "B" HEADSTOCK Explains 1,3,4

I leave it for others to address the Gilmer drive sleeve.

Belt cover either swapped or painted.

Green / gray(silver??) typical.

Paint does fade occasionally over 65+ years.
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rpd
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by rpd »

Jacob Anderson has a video on variations of the Gilmer drive sleeve that he had seen.

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shipwright
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by shipwright »

I’ve seen the video. That and a past post here made me think that my drive sleeve (like the second from the left in the video) was newer than 1956.
I did think that green/silver was standard but the motor pan is definitely from a Goldie.
When did the B headstock surface? I had thought it was after 1956.
Paul M ........ The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese
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chapmanruss
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by chapmanruss »

shipwright you asked
A couple of weeks ago I bought what seemed to be a 1956 (from the serial #) Greenie. While investigating a slipping Gilmer drive I found a few anomalies.
1) Only two screws on the belt cover
2) The Gilmer drive hub has the set screw but it is on the end sleeve, not in the splined part of the hub. (Yes, tightening it fixed the slipping).
3) The eccentric tensioner is secured by the screw and washer, not by the earlier clips.
4) There is an inspection hole behind the logo cover.

I don’t believe any of these should be on a 1956 Machine? Am I right?

To make things interesting the belt cover is green, the main body of the headstock is grey, and the motor pan is gold.
What is the serial number? That could help but the serial number is on the vent plate attached to the belt cover. If it is not the original Belt Cover for that Mark 5 it may not be the original Vent Plate and serial number either. There is a lot of missing information for 1956 and 1957 as to beginning serial number for each month's production.

1) in 1957 the Belt Cover changed from 6 to 2 screws to attach to the Headstock & Motor Pan. The Headstock & Motor pan changed accordingly.

2) From what you say this is a clutched Gilmer Drive not the earlier non-clutched Gilmer Drive. The change from the original non-clutched Gilmer Drive to the clutched Gilmer Drive occurred by July of 1954. The beginning picture (shown below) from Jacob Anderson's video shows a non-clutched Gilmer Drive on the left and several clutched Gilmer Drives in various stages of disassembly to assembled. In 1956 the nylon cap was added to the drive sleeve to reduce noise.

3) In June 1955, beginning with serial number 298476 the Eccentric Bushing included a set screw. Mark 5’s before this used “rocker shaped” bearing retainers. These "rocker shaped" bearing retainers were not on the earliest Mark 5's produced.

4) October 1955 was the change to B Headstock at S/N 312508 included a hole behind the rear Name Plate. At that change they still used 6 screws to hold the Belt Cover on the Headstock casting and Motor Pan.

Parts get changed over time. It is possible that the Headstock looks "off" due to damaged parts being replaced over the years. The same may be the reason for the different colors. By "1) Only two screws on the belt cover" it would be a 1957 or later but all other questions fit a 1956 Mark 5.

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Gilmer Drives - J Anderson.jpg
Gilmer Drives - J Anderson.jpg (99.04 KiB) Viewed 291 times
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by JPG »

" ONLY TWO SCREWS ON THE BELT COVER"

How many screw receptors on the headstock (tapped hole/tinnerman clip)?
╔═══╗
╟JPG ╢
╚═══╝

Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10
E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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shipwright
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by shipwright »

The serial # makes it a B headstock. I’m out sailing now but I’ll check the screw holes in the headstock and motor pan when I get home.
It seems it may all be 1956 except maybe the belt cover and engine pan.
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by chapmanruss »

Serial Number 345662 would have it likely being made in May 1957. That is one of the months not having a starting serial number on the old production chart. See attached PDF below.
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Mark V Serial Numbers.pdf
(138.9 KiB) Downloaded 10 times

If there are only two holes on the Headstock casting and none in the Motor Pan to attach the Belt Cover then those parts match for being a mid 1957 or later Mark 5 Greenie. The Screw locations for 2 screws are one each side of the Headstock casting which is the location still used today indicated by the arrow in the picture below. For 6 screws the additional screws are one at the top of the Headstock, one at the bottom and one on each side of the Motor Pan above the Bench Tubes shown in the red circles in the picture. For the 8 screws the additional 2 are located on each side of the Headstock Casting where it meets the Motor Pan Indicated by the black circle.
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Belt Cover Screws.jpg
Belt Cover Screws.jpg (160.9 KiB) Viewed 183 times
The above is a "B" Headstock having 6 screws to attach the Belt Cover, but the lower Motor Pan Screws are missing. This "B" Headstock is typical of those beginning with the change to the "B" Headstock in October 1955 until the change to only 2 screws to attach the Belt Cover in early 1957.
Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.
Has Speed Changer, 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E's S/N's 1076 & 1077 oldest ones I have restored. Mark 2 S/N 85959 restored. Others to be restored.
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shipwright
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by shipwright »

Yes, looks like late May or early June 1957. I’m sure that’s the chart I looked at before but I try not to look like an old guy and slide my finger across the row so I likely just misread it. (Still better than looking like an old guy) 🤣
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shipwright
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Re: Age of my “1956” Greenie

Post by shipwright »

Only two holes in the headstock and none in the motor pan (but it appears to be from a Goldie …. maybe)
Hard to tell from the pic but the pan is definitely not silver or green. It’s brownish
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Anyway it looks like this now.
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Paul M ........ The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese
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