1962 Goldie Disassembly

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ddvann79
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Post by ddvann79 »

mickyd wrote:Since you like to play as I do, duplicate my primed vs. unprimedwork. Unprimed steel sheet metal DEFINITELY resulted in a a more uniform, fuller texture. I didn't prime my Mark 5 steel parts because of this. Rustoleum had conflicting technical information on whether primer was needed or not so I went with no primer. Can't attest for longevity yet but almost 2 years later, it's still perfect.

I also experimented with not using self etch primer on some of my aluminum parts as discussed in this thread just to see if hammered paint bonds well by itself to aluminum. Again here, to date, looks great.
So far I have similar results to your sheet metal tests. However, I found that I could achieve the desired effect as long as I applied a thicker coat to the primed sheet metal or other smooth surface. My limited experience with this hammered copper and gold is that an un-primed surface, whether sheet metal, cast aluminum or paper and ink :p will achieve the hammered effect in a thinner coat BUT pinholes are more likely in the dimples. I also noticed a difference in how likely pinholes are apt to form depending upon temperature. I've applied this stuff at 45to 50 degrees (low end of the acceptable range) and at about 70. The colder temperature seemed to cause more dimpling and pinholes than the warmer temperature.

Of course, this is not a random, double-blind statistical analysis so my observations are only anecdotal.
Dalton
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1962 MK 5 #373733 Goldie
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ddvann79
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Caution/Name Plate Removal Help

Post by ddvann79 »

While most of the Goldie castings are in paint, I haven't painted the headstock yet. I'm debating whether or not to drill out the rivets in the caution plate to paint the headstock casting and clean up dents in the plate. My problem is multi-fold. First, is it worth it? Second, I'm not sure I can get new rivets in once the old ones are drilled out. How does one go about getting a riveting tool into this tight space? Lastly, these are threaded rivets, which I am not familiar with. Could someone explain how these things work?

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Dalton
Fort Worth, Texas
1962 MK 5 #373733 Goldie
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beeg
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Post by beeg »

Those threaded rivets in your link, is what's in your Goldie. I believe that it was Mickyd that was successful at tapping them out from the inside. I'll try and find the post where he explains the process.
SS 500(09/1980), DC3300, jointer, bandsaw, belt sander, Strip Sander, drum sanders,molder, dado, biscuit joiner, universal lathe tool rest, Oneway talon chuck, router bits & chucks and a De Walt 735 planer,a #5,#6, block planes. ALL in a 100 square foot shop.
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mickyd
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Post by mickyd »

ddvann79 wrote:While most of the Goldie castings are in paint, I haven't painted the headstock yet. I'm debating whether or not to drill out the rivets in the caution plate to paint the headstock casting and clean up dents in the plate. My problem is multi-fold. First, is it worth it? Second, I'm not sure I can get new rivets in once the old ones are drilled out. How does one go about getting a riveting tool into this tight space? Lastly, these are threaded rivets, which I am not familiar with. Could someone explain how these things work?

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They are pressed or knocked in and removed the same way. They are easily removed attacking them from the backside.

Here's how I got to the backside of my ER10 nameplate. Sky is the limit for your creativity.
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ddvann79
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Post by ddvann79 »

mickyd wrote:They are pressed or knocked in and removed the same way. They are easily removed attacking them from the backside.

Here's how I got to the backside of my ER10 nameplate. Sky is the limit for your creativity.
Thanks, Mike. So basically these "U-Drive" rivets are self-tapping screws with something like two thread revolutions and no screw slot. I was concerned that just hammering them in would mar the round heads but apparently that's how they were installed. To drive these things out from the back would be near impossible because the sleeve for the quill is right behind them. I'll just drill them out and refasten with pan head bolts until I get new rivets in.

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Dalton
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1962 MK 5 #373733 Goldie
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NOT JB Weld

Post by ddvann79 »

So I thought I would save a few bucks and buy Harbor Freight's knock off of JB Weld, or so I thought. After all, I'm repairing a casting defect that's non-structural. This stuff comes in two tubes of different colors and I thought would be a reasonable substitute. It is not JB Weld. Sure enough, it's epoxy all right. It's like thick super glue.

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I ended up having to purchase the real thing so instead of saving a few bucks, I paid a few extra. So please, don't drink and dr... er... be excessively cheap. Funny how trying to be cheap costs you more money. This is a side-by-side comparison of the thick superglue and JB original.

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Dalton
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1962 MK 5 #373733 Goldie
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Post by mickyd »

ddvann79 wrote:Thanks, Mike. So basically these "U-Drive" rivets are self-tapping screws with something like two thread revolutions and no screw slot. I was concerned that just hammering them in would mar the round heads but apparently that's how they were installed. To drive these things out from the back would be near impossible because the sleeve for the quill is right behind them. I'll just drill them out and refasten with pan head bolts until I get new rivets in.

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You could consider the U-Drive as a self tapper but if you REALLY trying to impress someone with your schmarts, you'd categorize them as "Metallic Drive Screws". That's what they are. :D .

These things are made of hardened steel and you won't be able to drill them out. Just take a file to the head and you'll see. You'll should try to get them started from the back. It doesn't take much force. I understand the tight quarters your in but from what I see in your pics, you can do it. See the attached pdf for what I mean. Very gentle taps will get them to move. DO NOT BREAK THE CASTING EARS. Once they move, you can easily grab the heads with pliers.

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Your other option is to GRIND. Grind a slot in the head and turn with a screwdriver.
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Threaded Rivets

Post by ddvann79 »

Thanks, Mike! I hope you didn't draw up that illustration just for me! That's exactly the kind of thing someone as dense as me needs.

Mike, I think Magna may have used "metalic drive screws" of differing hardness between the 10er and Mark 5. The rivets in my headstock were definitely steel but they were soft. I got out to the shop last night and proceeded to drill them out before I read your post. :o

I used a medium file and put a flat surface in the top, then made a center punch with a dimple. I used a relatively inexpensive Black and Decker metal bit and WD-40 to drill them out with great success. Once drilled, I knocked off the back of the rivet with a cold chisel. BUT if I had used your method, I may have been able to reuse the rivets! :rolleyes:

Here's how it went:

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I plan on just using some short carriage bolts until I get some round head U drive screws to replace these. Also, that name plate is aluminum and has been cleaning up pretty easily but there are several dimples I don't think I'll be able to get out. We'll just call them "character development" and leave them alone.
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Dalton
Fort Worth, Texas
1962 MK 5 #373733 Goldie
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ddvann79
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Hammered Copper Finish

Post by ddvann79 »

Here's how the table gauge turned out after peeling off the paint from the scale with a razor blade. What's that about imitation being a form of flattery, Mike? :D

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I'm starting on some Christmas presents for the wife this week and much to my dismay, I don't have the Shopsmith back together, as I had expected. This project is taking much longer than I had anticipated but has been one of the most enjoyable I've had in a while.
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Dalton
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Post by dusty »

That appears to be an excellent Hammered finish. It is what I had hoped for when I repainted the second Mark V. That is not what I ended with. What I have would be more appropriately named "orange peal".

I seem to have gotten a good bonding but not the desired texture.

I painted over the original "rough gray" texture. This worked and I like the color I chose. Guess it could have been a lot worse.

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