Shopsmith Forums

IMHO, an RAS is more suited to construction work. I've owned a C-man and used several other brands at construction sites. None remained accurate over several cuts. And, when any angle is changed, all bets were off. OK for cutting studs and, even rafters, but for trim and other "show cuts" it was always a CMS or miter box.
Even with my SCMS or the Shopsmith, 45 bevel cuts have always been problematic for me. They are never perfect.
I finally resorted to cutting mating pieces on either side of the blade, guaranteeing a perfect fit, if not a perfect cut. That is much easier and quicker to accomplish on a SCMS than on the tilted table of the Shopsmith. And, I think, safer, too.
Bite the bullet, Dick. Get a good SCMS. It only hurts once.

Serial Copy Management System (SCMS) - ???? Oh No - wrong context.

Sliding Compound Miter Saw (SCMS) - that's more like it. You can have one for a couple hundred dollars but if you really need accurate cuts (over time and job) you might have to pay a bit more. How much is it worth to you to abandon the tilting table and do you have the space to house an additional machine. By my way of thinking, those are the important questions.

I use the tilting table all the time and yes, it can be a bit clumsy some of the time but it works and it is accurate.

rjent wrote:I know this is kind of blasphemous, but what do you hotshots think of a RAS that can do miter, compound miter, rip and crosscuts?

I am looking at a Craftman's Contractor Series 10" Radial Saw. I have a series of (shudder) tilted table miter cuts to do and it scares me to death (what was I thinking buying ShopSmiths ).

Any advise/experience would be appreciated.

Cutting on a tilted table just seems dangerous ....

Thanks in advance!

There is nothing wrong with a Radial Arm Saw! Before buying one check the trolley bearings for slop. They can be adjusted tight unless worn out. If you do buy one either use the manual with the machine or buy a book on RAS and set it up and aligned it. Once done the saw is good to go for many many years.

Radial Arm Saws excel at cross cutting, and miter crosscuting is just one of their tricks.
Sliding miter saws are simply small radial arm saws that have reduced capacity. If their capacity is enough for you then they will work.

I own and use a Radial arm saw, a power miter saw and of course the Shopsmith. Each has it's advantages and limitations or things it isn't great at.

I love my Craftsman Radial Arm saw, it is over 40 years old and still works perfectly fine. I have cut hundreds of mitered Cross cuts on it and never had a problem with accuracy or safety.

One thing make sure you buy the correct blade!!! You want a blade with a negative hook set. Radial arms cut on the pull and a positive hook blade is too aggressive. It will want to pull itself into the wood which scares most people and can cause the blade to climb the cut.

I feel RAS is safer than table saws because you can always see the blade, but most believe it is dangerous because the blade comes at you. Again stand to the side, keep your hands and arms out of the cut line, always use the fence and nothing can happen. Any kickback is away from you.

I have seen and heard about the accidents on Radial arm saws and most occur because the operator had their arm/hand in the path of the blade or trying to use the saw without a fence or shields. A lot of people think they can simply hold the wood on the table at the angle they want and cut it. All wood MUST be against the fence. If it isn't you will probably regret it.

Against there is nothing that can protect against stupid!

Lots to think about (what did I expect). I would love to just use the SS(s) and the tilted table. My mind was creating all kinds of bad things happening with the table tilted, BUT I see that I might just be acting paranoid. I think I will make a small sled for this and try it. I truly hope I can get comfortable with it as I truly want to stay with shopsmith equipment as much as I can .... just because ...

Thanks Gene, Dusty, and Ed and everyone. This place, as always, is a great resource ....

If it is safe enough for Dusty, then I am willing to try it .....

As Ed in Tampa pointed out, a properly tuned and aligned RAS is a very versatile tool. I inherited my dad's Craftsman RAS (made in the early 80s), and it's a pretty good machine. I've got it integrated into my work bench, so there's plenty of support for long stock (about 8' each side). For shorter beveled cross cuts, I'm comfortable using the tilting table on the SS, but for long stock, I'll move to the RAS.

I have no argument about the virtues of a good and properly managed RAS. I am, however, voicing an opinion in defense of the Shopsmith tilted table.

Please acknowledge that the Mark 5/V is not a construction tool. It was designed to function in the hands of a "home style wood worker". It does have some limitations as do all tools. Using the tilted table on projects typical of a home work shop, the tilted table works fine. The only warning I would give is "manage the cut off that is above the saw blade". If not managed, gravity will pull that cut off right into the blade.

When tilted there is also a length limitation for the work piece. The low end of the work piece, if too long, will be on the gound/floor prohibiting the cut.

It was 0200 here!

Did you see how Shipwright handled that type cut on his spilled coffee table?

Made a sled that had a 'bed' at a 45° angle for the mitered corners.

http://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/viewt ... 334#p73334

dusty wrote:I have no argument about the virtues of a good and properly managed RAS. I am, however, voicing an opinion in defense of the Shopsmith tilted table.

Please acknowledge that the Mark 5/V is not a construction tool. It was designed to function in the hands of a "home style wood worker". It does have some limitations as do all tools. Using the tilted table on projects typical of a home work shop, the tilted table works fine. The only warning I would give is "manage the cut off that is above the saw blade". If not managed, gravity will pull that cut off right into the blade.

When tilted there is also a length limitation for the work piece. The low end of the work piece, if too long, will be on the gound/floor prohibiting the cut.

And I thank you for that Dusty, that is exactly the kind of info I was looking for. Like I said I WANT to use the SS in all of it's abilities and in spite of it's limitations. The "limitations" don't, so far, seem to actually be there, just different approach to doing the job at hand ....

JPG wrote:It was 0200 here!

Did you see how Shipwright handled that type cut on his spilled coffee table?

Made a sled that had a 'bed' at a 45° angle for the mitered corners.

http://www.shopsmith.com/ss_forum/viewt ... 334#p73334

I do remember that and had actually reviewed that. This all comes from watching a video by Doug Stowe and his method of using stop blocks to assure equal length and etc. Just seemed to complicate the SS process (which I have overcome and will address in a min ). It is a great idea, but doesn't address the real "issue" of the tilted table which I would like to learn how to use ....

OK, great news! I have used the tilted table method and have produced perfect mitered corners (and I mean perfect ). It probably took me 45 mins to get it set correctly, but it cut perfectly ....

I even built a very simple jig with a stop block on the miter gauge extender fence and it worked perfect. I followed through the very very slow cut with my left hand controlling the "waste" piece with my left hand while feeding the miter gauge with my right and found it to be very functional. If I was cutting a 2x4 with an angle I would rethink the process, but for a small box it worked better than I had hoped.

Thank you so much for all of the replies. I will have pictures in a few days with the results.

You guys rock!

On a side note...

For those of you who have the luxury of having spare system pieces, consider assembling one with no headstock on it, installing a carriage and work table.

I watched a friend in Dallas some years ago who placed it directly behind his production machine, titled the tables to match, and used the rip fences on both covered inside with a 8’ long piece of oak to rip a 4 x 8 sheet of 5/8 plywood, using the 2nd unit as a matching tilted out-feed table.

It worked like a charm. He said he used it all the time to cut down 4 x 8 panels into working stock. He even used the bench tubes to support the suspended matching accessory storage system under each.

The caster assembly allowed him to keep it behind him with the dual accessory storage readily accessible, and use the accessory mounts at each end to store the band saw and belt sander, and the work table to lay down various chisels and other tools when he wasn’t using the second unit for an over-size (even tilting) out feed table. He generally kept his jointer mounted on the production machine, and always had the spare headstock as a backup.

On that day he built octagonal columns to wrap the steel support poles on his patio and they turned out really phenomenal.

Someday I may do the same with a spare unit, and build matching bench storage systems.