Shopsmith Forums

keakap wrote:
This will be an interesting glue up. Since the inner discs will be making contact only at one small spot per stave, I'll be using some of that Gorilla Glue type stuff for them that activates with water. But first the staves have to be glued together, with regular exterior wood glue. And I can't do em all in one shot- glue sets too fast here. Then its pop the discs, one at a time, wet their edges and wet the staves, brush on the Gorilla juice and hope to get the disc back in place before the Gorilla starts to swell-- this stuff expands, a lot, as it sets. Another ply disc will cap each end, up against the smaller disc. Large quantities of Gorilla product will be involved in this step as well. And its the expansion I'm counting on to seal the cylinder ends.

Yup, you are definitely in the running for the Most Challenging Glue-Up award. But what the heck is The Cylinder for?

He is making a 'thumper' keg!:D

jtevans wrote:... a form of "laziness" for anyone who owns a SS, in that they either fear, or are to darn lazy, to change anything on their machines...THAT'S WHAT IT IS FOR !!!...so spend the little extra money and get the attachment. ...

That hit home. I've evolved to the point where if I need to use another "mode" of the SS I just make sure I don't need to duplicate something in the current setup while it's still, well, setup, then go for the change. Use to really resist it, "go to all that trouble" et cetera. Funny thing is, the more you do it the less time & trouble! But way down inside there remains (or did) the hesitancy borne of doing something unfamiliar and strange.
Then too, in the past I did have many alignment and other problems that made a pita out of almost any procedure, let alone mode change. Best thing for all that was to stop, say No MOre!, and completely align everything for once and fer all. I can still remember the first time I made a mode change then made the change BACK and found that stuff still worked!

JPG40504 wrote:He is making a 'thumper' keg!:D

Keg??
I don't think so!
This is pressure treated construction lumber we're talkin about here, 2x8 ripped in half and again and again, etc., and I gotta tell ya, despite an excellent dust collection system and daily replacing of throwaway face masks, the garage, especially in the morning after bein closed up all night, smells like all that wood had been soaked for a month in a vat of armpit sweat and foot drippings.

Keg? Whew- talk about yer "heady" brew!

BuckeyeDennis wrote:Yup, you are definitely in the running for the Most Challenging Glue-Up award. But what the heck is The Cylinder for?

My front lawn.

OOPS! just noticed it's time to turn on the weekly PBS woodworking show.

Details'll hafta wait.


;-)

I use my biscuit joiner much like Ed of Tampa described. I've put together boxes for boys who I know are going to be tough on those boxes. Used sufficient biscuits. My method is to cut all my wood to size, lay it all out on the table, put painters tape along the edges, line up the joints, mark both pieces of tape of how the boards will be joined. That mark is then used to lign up the biscuit cut. I've used only about 100 or so biscuits never having one to fail nor have I looked for impressions/depressions. Now, I've got to find some stuff to see what is there. Thanks for that.

The only thing I haven't figured out exactly is joining angled edges, such as the drum above, unless you can take the angled edge to the table and low it over the biscuit joiner. But, then I would certainly have a problem with my method of ligning up the join lines of the two pieces. Will have to give that a try. Guess I could put a piece of tap on the table in line with the center line of the biscuit joiner and then align my cut with the angle board.

For pocket screws, use either the horizontal boring or drill press method and tilt your table about 15 degrees off center line of the bit. Makes for perfect alignment without buying jigs and fixtures.

I do use my Shopsmith for most all woodworking. Rarely do I pick up another tool except for clamps. That's how versatile this machine is to me and made me fall in love with in in the 1970's. Couldn't afford one, but was still in love with it.

Just wondering the degree of cut of the joined side pieces.

How to you propose to seal it if it going to be used for liquids?
Would love to see it finished and its usage. Thanks.

swampgator wrote:... My method is to cut all my wood to size, lay it all out on the table, put painters tape along the edges, line up the joints, mark both pieces of tape of how the boards will be joined. That mark is then used to lign up the biscuit cut. ...
The only thing I haven't figured out exactly is joining angled edges, such as the drum above, unless you can take the angled edge to the table and low it over the biscuit joiner. ...
I do use my Shopsmith for most all woodworking. Rarely do I pick up another tool except for clamps. That's how versatile this machine is to me and made me fall in love with in in the 1970's. Couldn't afford one, but was still in love with it.

First, bIf, I agree with your comments re the SS. When planning almost anything it is the first thing comes to mind. (Well, maybe not what to have for breakfast.)

As for the lining up the biscuit cut, I'm not sure I understand exactly your method, but for the angles I was using I think your usual method should work.

On mine, I laid down the slats, or staves, on the workbench (ah, how I love saying that, having a real workbench now after all these years) and aligned them carefully to one end, and marked 'em that way for future alignments. . Then marked three lines for the biscuits along that 42" or so, one ~4" from each edge, one centered.
{Now here is where I made a major goof. Set my ruler on the group in various positions to figure a balanced setting, and originally made a mark at 3". After looking and thinking, decided that was too close to the edge, so moved it to 4" and made the marks. But I did NOT erase the first mark at 3". Later, when setting up the Joiner, well, I don't need to tell you what happened. Suffice it to say if one of your biscuits is so far off it wont go in, you can cut it in half and still use it, if, say, you didn't notice til way after the Joiner had been taken down.}

Anaway, to cut, laid the stave wide side to table, slid to joiner fence, and the small angle still allowed an easy eyeball line-up to the fence mid-mark when the pins started to engage. At that point, with the pins- very sharp- engaged, a simple tilt up (pins now pivot points) to mate the stave edge to the fence (here's where a clean flat rip cut did its job) and push in to cut.

Writing this I can see where a more acute angle might present problems with those Line alignments. Still, once the edges are mated, it is perfectly clear if the lines also meet. A little slop is allowed, too.

I do remember when setting up getting to the point of seeing how the workpiece engaged the Joiner, when I saw that gap because of the angle I had a major Oops moment. Turns out the pins are positioned perfectly to manage this problem.

swampgator wrote:Just wondering the degree of cut of the joined side pieces.

How to you propose to seal it if it going to be used for liquids?
Would love to see it finished and its usage. Thanks.

Ah, yes, the reporter's question: "what's your angle in all this?"

I admit I cheated, but once I saw the answer knew I didn't have to. 9 degrees.
I love playing with my CAD program, so any excuse to draw up a new plan is welcome. I just went in there and drew a polygon, then read off the measurements. Played with # sides, figured 20 was enough to allow me to turn it round if I chose to, less would eat up too much of the 3/4" of the stave thickness, and many more would have the finish date running into 2014. I'd already figured out I wanted it to be a foot in diameter, big enough to roll, not so big as to be unwieldy. The other consideration was the size of the stinkwood rough boards I had available from another done project.

So, after ripping clean edges on each plank and figuring in the kerf waste (30 thou each) I had my width, down to 2.113 from 2.25, length (and dang it I forgot to trim for clean square ends), and angle.
[angle was a head slapper, you know, as in "up the side of", since a circle of 360d regardless of size divided by 20 slats & 40 edges is...]

The Cylinder, btw, will be a lawn roller for my new (coming) lawn. We have really nasty clay here, and I recently tilled weedy gnarly portions of the yard and am adding soil 'amendments' and stuff prep to grass. Now I've got it all fluffed out I need a way to smooth and level it down. For some reason I can't seem to get that done with the standard garden rake, so...

As for sealing it, each stave is edge glued to its neighbor with ext. yellow glue, and the end discs and their caps will be grossly slathered with that Gorilla-like glue, which is an expander/filler. That should take care of it. The staves were intentionally left as taken from the band saw but I had to take a plane to some of the edges to correct some swelling and knots after the ripping. Idea was to have some leakage as we rolled along, to keep soil- seeds- feeds from sticking to the drum and making huge clumps on it. This clay is unbelievable. If I don't get enough leakage I'll just have to have a hose handy as I go.

Funny bein on a rock in the middle of the Pacific ocean, there are so many things that are or would be sold in such small quantities that the retailers can't justify the shipping (really!) to get em here and stock em. I know I'd seen such rollers in the hardware stores back in Calif., but not here. Then too it seemed like a fun project- and a way to put that stinkwood to good use- at the time. And, of course, I'm stubborn, once I get an idea.

I'll take more (& hopefully better) pics as it goes along. Again, remember looks are not on the "Do I Care" list.

keakap wrote:
Anaway, to cut, laid the stave wide side to table, slid to joiner fence, and the small angle still allowed an easy eyeball line-up to the fence mid-mark when the pins started to engage. At that point, with the pins- very sharp- engaged, a simple tilt up (pins now pivot points) to mate the stave edge to the fence (here's where a clean flat rip cut did its job) and push in to cut.

Writing this I can see where a more acute angle might present problems with those Line alignments. Still, once the edges are mated, it is perfectly clear if the lines also meet. A little slop is allowed, too.

This tickled a neuron from a Sawdust Session, where Nick was cutting biscuit slots in the face of board, to biscuit-join shelves. He did it with the SS in horizontal mode, with the board clamped to the table, and the slots cut into the underside. The table was lowered to feed the cutter, and a stop collar was used to stop the table when the cutter was at full depth.

So anyway, I believe that beveled edges could be cut in a similar manner, with the SS in drill-press mode. Just tilt the table to the bevel angle, so that the bevel edge is vertical. Use the fence to align the workpiece, and clamp the workpiece down. Then use the table crank to feed the workpiece in horizontally for the biscuit cut. This should cut very accurately for any bevel angle.

Anyone know if standalone biscuit joiners can be used with beveled edges?