Shopsmith Forums

OK, I am dumb founded. As I said earlier I had everything perfectly co-planer after swapping the main table carriage. I swapped the two extension tables left to right. The were not perfectly left to right but the back table on the right was about 1/8" below the main table. Huh

So I just quit and ordered a Wixey. That was two days ago. Today I went to the shop to do some work so I swapped the tables back thinking they would be aligned. I did a quick check and the left table was about 1/8" low at the back on the left side. Huh

OPERATOR ERROR Apparently but I was using a feeler gauge with the straight edge. You can't be off 1/8" and not notice. No the base has not been moved during any of this.

Wixey will be here tomorrow afternoon. I will hit it Tuesday and take pictures of everything so I can prove to myself what is going on.

I just read all of your posts in this thread again and I do notice one thing. All of your errant measurements are small (1/8" or less). If your problem is what I have said, this tells me that you are dealing with very slight tilt errors <.2°. I hope your eyes are better than mine. I already know that the lighting in your shop won't be a problem.

dusty wrote:I just read all of your posts in this thread again and I do notice one thing. All of your errant measurements are small (1/8" or less). If your problem is what I have said, this tells me that you are dealing with very slight tilt errors <.2°. I hope your eyes are better than mine. I already know that the lighting in your shop won't be a problem.

I don't know about the eyes but I have been using a .004 feeler gauge (a postit note) in all this. 1/8" is huge. I am used to working in tenth of a thou not 1/8". I just bought a real feeler gauge this week end not that it will make any difference.

I think I keep doing something wrong but for the life of me I don't know what. My entire 40 year career in the Air Force and as an AF civilian was one of precision.

OK, the jury is in and the results are not good.

I have not touched the main table since I squared it to the blade with a square. Checking with the Wixey it is right on and the main table is parallel to the way tubes.
Then I checked the table for parallel to the way tubes. The Wixey was not re-calibrated.
Then I checked the main table and aux table posts for vertical. The main table and the left aux table were 0 degrees (vertical) the right aux table was .3 degrees off. Pictures available if needed.

Next I made the two aux tables co-planer with the main table using a .002" feller gauge and a straight edge. The only issue was the front edge of the main table has about a .004" high spot some where.

The Wixwy showed everything was co-planer.
So everything is aligned. My chicken and rice with milk gravy needs attention. More tomorrow.

Tell us about the numbers displayed above the degree indication.

And the pseudo spirit level indicator and slope indicator.


Since your model is 'different', what is its resolution and accuracy?

JPG wrote:Tell us about the numbers displayed above the degree indication.

And the pseudo spirit level indicator and slope indicator.


Since your model is 'different', what is its resolution and accuracy?

Facts about Wixey straight from the horses mouth.

http://www.wixey.com/anglegauge/#wr365

I see that the tables are all level but are they coplanar?

Were both Extension Tables aligned on the right side or were they aligned at the destination location? Once aligned, CAN THEY BE SWAPPED? That is the real question. I don't believe anyone has had problems aligning a table installed where it is being used.

Thank you Dusty. Just as I suspected. I asked so as to create questions in John's mind(he has so few on this subject ).

OK John, the new device indicates both aux tables are parallel to the way tube, but the main table is .5 degree 'off'. The main table tilts down towards the base casting 0.2 degrees. The tubes and aux tables tilt towards the headrest end 0.3 degrees NO! That .5 degrees is in error. I missed that the viewpoint of the blade and table were from the 'rear'. The rest were from the 'front'. So the main table indication is .1 degree difference.

Of 'interest' is also the 'levelness' front to rear.


Keep in mind the stated accuracy of the relative angle is 0.1 degree, repeatability of 0.1 degree and resolution of 0.1 degree. Those are not all the same thing and can be accumulative.

0.1 degree at 50" results in over 1/16" deviation.




I assume you set the reference angle to either the table or the saw blade and the relative angle indications are referenced to that.(90.0 and 00.0). That is all one would have with the earlier model Wixey. The dead level indicator reveals a finer deviation.


P.S. The blade appears to be 'dead level' with the way tubes!!!!

JPG wrote:Thank you Dusty. Just as I suspected. I asked so as to create questions in John's mind(he has so few on this subject ).

OK John, the new device indicates both aux tables are parallel to the way tube, but the main table is .5 degree 'off'. The main table tilts down towards the base casting 0.2 degrees. The tubes and aux tables tilt towards the headrest end 0.3 degrees

Of 'interest' is also the 'levelness' front to rear.


Keep in mind the stated accuracy of the relative angle is 0.1 degree, repeatability of 0.1 degree and resolution of 0.1 degree. Those are not all the same thing and can be accumulative.

0.1 degree at 50" results in over 1/16" deviation.




I assume you set the reference angle to either the table or the saw blade and the relative angle indications are referenced to that.(90.0 and 00.0). That is all one would have with the earlier model Wixey. The dead level indicator reveals a finer deviation.


P.S. The blade appears to be 'dead level' with the way tubes!!!!

First, the spirit level is NOT zeroed when you zero the gauge. The spirit level is factory calibrated and does not change. So the spirit level is actually showing that the floor is not level. The floor in fact slopes slightly to the left. That is what the gauge on both end tables show along with a conventional 4' level on the floor. I am at a complete loss as to why the gauge on the main table is opposite.

The gauge was zeroed to the blade since it is a fixed surface. Then all the other measurements were taken. So that shows that the blade is 90 degrees to all of the tables and the way tubes. Also the extension table measurements were taken after I used a straight edge to align them left to right and front and rear to the main table.

Yes, they are all the same front to rear except the left extension table. It is within the accuracy of the gauge. I used the way tubes for the reference surface and for some reason did not zero the gauge. I don't have a picture of the right hand extension table but it did read 90.8.
Dusty asked in a previous post "I see that the tables are all level but are they coplanar?"

They are not level. The spirit level shows that. However they are all at the same relative angle to each other both left to right and front to back and they are all at the same height. Does that not make them coplanar? If not, then I guess I don't understand the definition of coplanar.

How does the blade appear to be 'dead level' with the way tubes? The gauge on the blade reads 00 and the gauge on the way tubes reads 90.

Your dining room table top with all of the leaves installed is coplanar If one of the leaves warps, it ceases to be coplanar.

With that, I believe I am coming to the conclusion that we had a communications problem. It is good to hear that your tables are coplanar and that they are level. From what you have said, I believe you use the blade as your primary reference surface during alignments and that is what most people do. If you zero the Wixey on the blade, then you want 90° to be the result of all readings on the table tops UNLESS you are deliberately tilting.

Play with your Wixey. You have to get real comfortable with it if you are going to rely on it. Check the blade and then check all of the vertical surfaces on the Shopsmith. You will find that they are pretty close to dead on. Likewise, check the table and then all the horizontal or near horizontal surfaces. Doing this now while the Wixey is new to you will help to establish your confidence in the Wixey so that when it tells you something you don't want to hear, you will take action.

Mine is good as long as the batteries are good. I believe that some improvements have been made in that area (more battery power and auto shutoff).

How does the blade appear to be 'dead level' with the way tubes? The gauge on the blade reads 00 and the gauge on the way tubes reads 90. Did I say this? If I did I must have overdosed on my pain killers!

Same difference but I am inclined to say blade = 90° and Way Tubes = 0°.